Cover piper tips for winter


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hap2
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Cover piper tips for winter

Postby hap2 » Fri Dec 21, 2012 11:11 am



Some people say I should cover the open tips of the bike's exhaust to prevent moisture from getting in the motor during the winter. So I went thi the hardware store, got a couple of rubber covers & clamped them on the ends of the pipes. However, I had had both my 1200 outside all winter & now in an unheated garage for the last 3 yrs with no problem. Is it really a good idea or not? Should I take the covers off?

Just looking for some advice...thanx



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WingAdmin
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Re: Cover piper tips for winter

Postby WingAdmin » Fri Dec 21, 2012 12:46 pm

If it's in a moist area, it can't hurt. That said, before my winter storage, I take the bike out for a good, hard 30-60 minute run (with Seafoam in the crankcase oil) to get it good and hot, bring it back, change the oil while it's still hot, and then do the rest of my winter routine. That ensures any moisture that condensed in the exhaust system has evaporated, and won't be rusting it from the inside out.

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SteveB123
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Re: Cover piper tips for winter

Postby SteveB123 » Fri Dec 21, 2012 2:08 pm

WingAdmin wrote:That ensures any moisture that condensed in the exhaust system has evaporated, and won't be rusting it from the inside out.


...and what do you do to stop the next batch of condensation?
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newday777
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Re: Cover piper tips for winter

Postby newday777 » Fri Dec 21, 2012 7:02 pm

The condensation happens from the bike being run too short a time, as with any exhaust, you need to run for a good long ride to get it fully heated for a couple hour ride to burn out the condensation that starts when you start it up for a few minutes in cold temps and ambient moisture is present in the air.
There are also weep holes on the bottom of the mufflers that need to be cleaned out for drainage, ever cleaned them?
Ever seen a cast iron table saw that has been in the cold then you start to heat the area around it or the ambient temps go up outside to warm everything up? Moisture appears on the cast iron, then rust.

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redial
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Re: Cover piper tips for winter

Postby redial » Fri Dec 21, 2012 7:39 pm

We dont seem to have this problem over here. I wonder why? Although temp @ 11am is 40C, the humidity is 9%, so we have the best of both worlds.

Now if you frozen northerners want to store your GW in ideal conditions of low humidity, and good riding weather, send them over. I will look after them for you, and make sure they are exercised on a rotational basis :twisted: . You would not even have to work out whether to put rubber tips on the end of the pipes or not. Just saying 8-) .
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Re: Cover piper tips for winter

Postby SteveB123 » Fri Dec 21, 2012 8:52 pm

newday777 wrote:The condensation happens from the bike being run too short a time, as with any exhaust, you need to run for a good long ride to get it fully heated for a couple hour ride to burn out the condensation that starts when you start it up for a few minutes in cold temps and ambient moisture is present in the air.
.


I'm of the opinion that the ambient moisture is in the air, and therefore in the exhaust, whether the engine is started or not.
Burning it out is all well and good, but as soon as you shut if off and it cools....you're right back to where you started.
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Re: Cover piper tips for winter

Postby dingdong » Sat Dec 22, 2012 9:09 am

The inside if the mufflers are coated with exhaust deposits (oil) from the combustion of the engine. I doubt if moisture in the air from humidity will cause any appreciable rust on the inside.
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Re: Cover piper tips for winter

Postby newday777 » Sat Dec 22, 2012 9:50 am

dingdong wrote:The inside if the mufflers are coated with exhaust deposits (oil) from the combustion of the engine. I doubt if moisture in the air from humidity will cause any appreciable rust on the inside.


They rust from the inside out. Yes it does, whether you doubt it or not.
The deposits mix with the liquid moisture caused from short warmups and cause an acid like action. The inside is just steel. It would not happen it it was stainless steel exhaust system.

I grew up in NH and learned the hard way, and then through knowledge of experienced people and text books.

Merry Christmas to all!

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Re: Cover piper tips for winter

Postby dingdong » Sat Dec 22, 2012 11:22 am

newday777 wrote:
dingdong wrote:The inside if the mufflers are coated with exhaust deposits (oil) from the combustion of the engine. I doubt if moisture in the air from humidity will cause any appreciable rust on the inside.


They rust from the inside out. Yes it does, whether you doubt it or not.
The deposits mix with the liquid moisture caused from short warmups and cause an acid like action. The inside is just steel. It would not happen it it was stainless steel exhaust system.

I grew up in NH and learned the hard way, and then through knowledge of experienced people and text books.

Merry Christmas to all!



So you are saying that when stored for the winter after a good run to make sure all moisture has dried completely that appreciable rust is going to occur? I suppose that location has more to do with it than anything and whether it is stored inside or out. Our winters are dry here and I have never had a muffler rust out.

Merry Christmas to you.
Tom

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Sidcar
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Re: Cover piper tips for winter

Postby Sidcar » Sat Dec 22, 2012 4:38 pm

The easy answer is to ride it through the winter it's what I bought mine for.
It's not much work, why not remove the silencers and spray WD in from both ends then store them in a dry place.

Sid

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LloydB
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Re: Cover piper tips for winter

Postby LloydB » Sat Dec 29, 2012 9:34 pm

Back in the days when I rode BMW twins, I used to keep a couple of corks in the saddlebags, when I washed the bike I stuck the corks in the ends of the mufflers to keep wash water out, seemed to make sense, I don't really know if it did anything to help keep the mufflers from rusting.
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Re: Cover piper tips for winter

Postby tfdeputydawg » Sun Dec 30, 2012 9:47 am

WingAdmin wrote:If it's in a moist area, it can't hurt. That said, before my winter storage, I take the bike out for a good, hard 30-60 minute run (with Seafoam in the crankcase oil) to get it good and hot, bring it back, change the oil while it's still hot, and then do the rest of my winter routine. That ensures any moisture that condensed in the exhaust system has evaporated, and won't be rusting it from the inside out.

Honest question! I have read this statement many, many times in my 68 years. My problem lies in my belief that when one does this procedure and if the ambient conditions are right, condensation will again form as the bike cools down :?:
Wonder just how much volume of water is involved in the condensation scenario? Exactly where does it form within the motor/exhaust system?
Isn't a by-product of using unleaded gas exhausted through a CAT, water???
No matter what the ambient temp is, doesn't some amount of condensation form every time you motor/exhaust system cools after being run??
My winterizing, consists of keeping the battery maintainer plugged in. Normal maintenance is performed at the proper mileage intervals, whenever that occurs. I find no reason to change anything just because the bike may be parked for a short period of time!.
3,000 mile oil changes is another myth that has been "bought" just because oil companies and oil change businesses want more income!!!! While true many years ago, the use of unleaded gas and newer lubricants have extended the useful life of "oil" to at least 4 times the 3,000 mile change!
Newer vehicles "tell" when it's time to change. My 2010 Traverse averages 12,000 miles + before the "change oil soon" message illuminates.

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Re: Cover piper tips for winter

Postby WingAdmin » Sun Dec 30, 2012 3:07 pm

tfdeputydawg wrote:Honest question! I have read this statement many, many times in my 68 years. My problem lies in my belief that when one does this procedure and if the ambient conditions are right, condensation will again form as the bike cools down :?:
Wonder just how much volume of water is involved in the condensation scenario? Exactly where does it form within the motor/exhaust system?
Isn't a by-product of using unleaded gas exhausted through a CAT, water???
No matter what the ambient temp is, doesn't some amount of condensation form every time you motor/exhaust system cools after being run??
My winterizing, consists of keeping the battery maintainer plugged in. Normal maintenance is performed at the proper mileage intervals, whenever that occurs. I find no reason to change anything just because the bike may be parked for a short period of time!.
3,000 mile oil changes is another myth that has been "bought" just because oil companies and oil change businesses want more income!!!! While true many years ago, the use of unleaded gas and newer lubricants have extended the useful life of "oil" to at least 4 times the 3,000 mile change!
Newer vehicles "tell" when it's time to change. My 2010 Traverse averages 12,000 miles + before the "change oil soon" message illuminates.


Condensation happens inside the exhaust when the exhaust itself is cooler than the gases (containing moisture) passing through them. Once the exhaust heats up, the gases no longer condense, and what was condensed is evaporated. The amount of moisture remaining once shut down is incidental, and quickly evaporates as the exhaust system cools.

Your Traverse doesn't have a magical oil monitor that actually checks the quality of the oil - it simply monitors the mileage (some of them instead monitor the number of engine rotations) and when it reaches a set value, it turns that light on. My Explorer has the same thing, and it works off mileage - you can change it to whatever mileage you want it to when the notification comes on.

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Re: Cover piper tips for winter

Postby Missourimike » Wed Jan 02, 2013 1:42 pm

Most of the moisture in an exhaust system comes from the fuel itself. Ever notice the water dripping from the tail pipe of a car? By the time the exhaust has passed through the cat converter, piping, mufflers, it has cooled down to form condensate. Too big a muffler, too much exhaust, too many short runs not allowing the pipes to heat up, all contribute to rusting out pipes and mufflers.
True, when metal heats up and then cools down, moisture is drawn into an open exhaust. But not enough to cause any damage. 99% of the moisture comes from that portion of the fuel that does not burn. And then there is also that culprit called anti-freeze that can be drawn into cylinder, heated into steam, pumped into the exhaust pipes. Some folks wonder where their anti-freeze is leaking at, never taking into consideration that it may well be at the head gasket.




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