Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make


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Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby eklimek » Tue Feb 19, 2013 9:21 am



To make a JIS conforming screwdriver bit the Phillips is modified as in the photo.

Note the mould impression of the JIS screw for guidance.

Refashion the Phillips contact angle to 57 degrees from the plane. The resulting point is then removed.

The bit now broadly contacts the screw and enters fully without bottoming on the tip.
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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby WingAdmin » Tue Feb 19, 2013 10:16 am

Or you could just buy a cheap set of JIS drivers. :)

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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby Mag » Tue Feb 19, 2013 10:17 am

Is this why my Phillips skips sometimes? I never knew. Now why would this type of screw be done then being so close. I thought the Phillips patters was standard.

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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby eklimek » Tue Feb 19, 2013 10:26 am

The JIS is a pacific rim standard. At least in my locale you get a funny look when you ask for a JIS screwdriver. They are available if one looks.

The JIS screw head does not mate fully and can be damaged with forceful use of a Phillips. Many of my other bikes have Allan head socket replacements as a result.

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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby charliektm400exc » Tue Feb 19, 2013 3:07 pm

The JIS is a pacific rim standard


Not this part of the Pacific rim (Australia). :D

Went in to my local specialised tools shop about a week ago and asked if they could get JIS screwdrivers, and they looked at me blankly. They suggested trying a pozidrive, but that's not right either.

Looks like I'll have to try the internet.

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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby WingAdmin » Tue Feb 19, 2013 3:30 pm

Here's an article from this month's Motorcycle Consumer News (my favorite magazine!), by Steve Larsen:

VISITING STU OLTMAN'S garage near Phoenix, Arizona, I always learn something, even if my bike isn't ailing. For many years Oltman has been the Technical Editor of Wing World Magazine, the official publication of the GWRRA (Gold Wing Road Riders Association). Oltman can be technical and crusty, opinionated, funny, intolerant of fools, but he lets me help. Good thing he's retired because this typically doubles or triples the time a repair would take. Add in coffee breaks and time for telling lies, and a two-hour job can easily take the best part of a day.

My last visit required some extensive disassembly. Unable to dislodge one rusted and corroded screw, I'd only managed to strip a good part of its Phillips head. Oltman, seeing my distress, went to his tool box and came back with a different screwdriver, saying, "try this." This screwdriver fit snugly and the screw came right out. "That's a JIS screwdriver," Oltman told me, "Japanese Industry Standard. They look like a Phillips but they're not, and they work a lot better on bikes from Japan."

Sometimes referred to as "Japanese Phillips," screws in products from cameras to carburetors made in Japan conform to Japanese Industrial Standard 463313-3/1991 (DIN/ISO standard 5260).

While a normal Phillips screwdriver will sometimes do the job on JIS screws, the smaller they are, the more susceptible they are to stripping. But even when a Phillips screwdriver works, it never has that satisfying tight, snug feel that the correct tool engagement gives.

Portland native Henry Phillips invented the Phillips screws/drivers in the 1930s for application in automobile assembly lines.

His Phillips screwdrivers were built with an angle on the flanks and rounded corners. This taper on the driving faces causes the screwdriver bit to "cam out" of the slot before twisting a screw head off, which was a requirement for automated assembly lines. But what made it do well in that environment makes it prone to stripping when used by hand. Unlike a machine, a person has no way to deliver the specific downward force required, and the chances of stripping the head go way up. On the other hand, JIS screwdrivers have virtually parallel faces on the driving flanges and will not cam out. As a result, they will break whatever corrosion was keeping the screw from turning (good), or even strip the thread with excessive torque (bad). Identifying JIS screws is simple; they often have a small dot to one side of the cross slot. Using a JIS screwdriver in the right situation on the appropriate screw head feels really good. It's a pleasure to have something work so well. It finally begins to make sense why Phillips head screws always seem to get so bunged up and why it feels like they push back when pressure is applied.

Conversely, using a JIS screwdriver on a regular Phillips-head screw should work just fine, although you won't gain any real advantages.

Phillips vs JIS
Phillips vs JIS


Surprisingly, considering the number of Japanese products on the road, JIS screwdrivers can be difficult to find. None of my local hardware stores (ACE Hardware, Sears, Harbor Freight) carried them and, in fact, most had no idea what I was talking about. However, an internet search turned up two good sources, both made in Japan: HOZAN brand screwdrivers are only $20 for the four most common sizes-No.00, No.0, No. 1 and No.2, and Vessel brand screwdrivers for the professional crowd (No. 1, 2 and 3 for $42.) Gotta have 'em!

-Steve Larsen

Hozan-Ikas, Inc. 425-374-8715 http://www.ikaswebshop.com
Vessel - http://www.vesseltools.com
also http://www.rjrcooltools.com

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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby WingAdmin » Tue Feb 19, 2013 3:37 pm

charliektm400exc wrote:
The JIS is a pacific rim standard


Not this part of the Pacific rim (Australia). :D

Went in to my local specialised tools shop about a week ago and asked if they could get JIS screwdrivers, and they looked at me blankly. They suggested trying a pozidrive, but that's not right either.

Looks like I'll have to try the internet.


I ordered a set for $20, plus $7 for a stubby, from here: http://www.ikaswebshop.com/

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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby Mag » Tue Feb 19, 2013 5:58 pm

Guess what I will be ordering also, I can see where the simple change will make all the bit of difference.

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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby patbrandon1 » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:03 pm

The JIS type screw would explain a lot of why almost every screw on my bike looked in rough shape, and why the Speedo Cable Screw was nearly almost just a blank hole. I am curious as to weather the stores I buy my screws from, Ace, Gilroy's, etc...sell JIS screws. I'm going to have to check that out.But this info does explain a lot, thanks.

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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby redial » Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:49 pm

Q: Why VESSEL's screwdrivers are not labeled “JIS”?

As you might know, VESSEL is the oldest screwdriver manufacturer in Japan, and made a contribution to set a JIS standard.

We do follow JIS standard for cross point screwdrivers. Because the technology to manufacture screwdrivers in Japan had already become above a certain level, JIS recognition system for screwdrivers became extinct in 2008.

So there is no authorized JIS manufacturer now, and we therefore cannot print "JIS" mark on our screwdrivers.


manufacture screwdrivers in Japan had already become above a certain level, JIS recognition system for screwdrivers became extinct in 2008


But I dont quite understand the statement: "... already become above a certain level,"

Very interesting.
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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby prc » Wed Feb 20, 2013 6:32 am

Very informative, all these years working under the assumption that the screw I was removing was either a #1 or #2.
This does indeed explain the fact that a high percentage of older bike sidecase/engine cover case screws were difficult to remove and quite often ruined by virture of having the slots on the heads strip, twist and distort.
Thanks for sharing this.

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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby dingdong » Wed Feb 20, 2013 7:46 am

If you need a quick fix and don't have time to order a set of JIS you can grind about 1 mm off the tip of your Phillips screwdriver. Because of the difference in the angles the standard Phillips bottoms out and doesn't seat properly with the slots in the screw. It isn't a perfect fit but it will work much better. I have been doing this for years.
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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby eklimek » Wed Feb 20, 2013 7:57 am

: "... already become above a certain level"

Poor translation for "become obsolete."

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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby bustedwing » Wed Feb 20, 2013 4:14 pm

This answers a perplexing question that I have had for many years. I have never known about let alone the difference between the two types of tips. And evidently they have been around for many years. Learn something new every day. Thank you.
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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby wjnfirearms » Sat Feb 23, 2013 9:27 am

Just goes to show you...no matter how long you have been wrenching, you learn something all the time.

I never knew about JIS and this explains much to me as well. Gotta get me a set of those drivers.
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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby themainviking » Sat Feb 23, 2013 11:36 am

WingAdmin wrote:I ordered a set for $20, plus $7 for a stubby, from here: http://www.ikaswebshop.com/


I checked those people... sure enough, $27 for the set plus the stubby - $30 to ship it to me. For $57 I gotta find another source.
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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby jdvorchak » Sat Feb 23, 2013 1:12 pm

JIS are hard to find in the U.S. but I found that they are available at HarborFreight for $7 for a whole set. I've used these for years and are surprisingly very good quality! No where does it say they are JIS but they are and fit these metric bike's screws like a glove.

http://www.harborfreight.com/32-piece-s ... 90764.html

Believe me you won't be disappointed.

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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby eklimek » Sat Feb 23, 2013 3:56 pm

Not to be fussy but as an amateur it is fairly easy to modify the phillips as needed. I also tend to mislay tools. I took the speedometer cable screw off the 76 cb550 I am in process of refurbishing with a spontaneously made JIS conforming driver. I find no shortage of phillips in my tool box. It takes only a small grinder, a model and good eye.

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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby wjnfirearms » Sat Feb 23, 2013 4:56 pm

Maybe I'm missing something, but I saw nowhere in the description of the Harbor Freight set anything about them being JIS. If they are, I would buy them in a heartbeat at that price.
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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby jdvorchak » Sat Feb 23, 2013 6:08 pm

I already said that no where on them do they say JIS but they are JIS screwdrivers none the less. I just got back from the local Harbor Freight store and purchased another set to give to my son. For $7 you will NOT be disappointed with the fit, finish and quality. Trust me you'll be glad you bought them. I've been wrenching since the 60's and have used Snap On, MAC, Stanley, Craftsman and probably every other brand you can think of. These are some of the best screwdrivers I've ever used. The handle is rubber and doesn't get slippery if you hands get wet or greasy. It is kind of oval shaped which means you can put an great deal of toque on them. After 4 years of working on metric bikes they still perform like the day they were new. I half expected them to wear out the tips but that hasn't happened. I regularly clean the handles with solvent and the rubber looks like new. No deterioration that I can see. But the best part it they fit the screw heads on these metric bikes perfectly! For example the screws on the top of the brake and clutch reservoir. You can actually stick the #2 driver into that screw and let go of it. It will stand up with no wobble and even if the screws have the slots messed up a little, it will remove them. These things fit tight into the slots.

Do what you want. You can find JIS screwdrivers online for $12 to $30 each or you can spend $7 and get a whole set. Your choice.

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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby Mag » Sun Feb 24, 2013 10:51 am

Harbor Freight is definitely a "candy store", amazing what you find there.

I was looking at my toolset, which I picked up at the local Napa store, and I have screw driver bits that are actually the stubby kind. I never noticed that before.....so, I guess I am already outfitted. Yes, I originally had a mish-mash of tools tha I collected over the years and got tired of not having a set where I can just look and get what I want. This set I have now is one that is in a plastic case that I hang on the wall of the garage. My other tools are sitting in a plastic bucket as 'extras'.

I guess it pays to look at whatcha got.

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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby WingAdmin » Mon Mar 04, 2013 1:16 pm

I ordered a set (plus a stubby) of JIS drivers from the http://www.ikaswebshop.com site mentioned in that article, and got the chance to use them for the first time while working on my wife's bike this past weekend. WOW, what a difference. They fit right in and hold there, totally unlike the Philips drivers. I wish I had done that years ago.

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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby eklimek » Mon Mar 04, 2013 2:47 pm

This would be why. The background is a US penny.

The white mold is from a JIS screw compared to the standard Philips PH2 bit in your tool box.

The commonly recommended modification is to grind down the tip off a Phillips. This allows the PH2 bit to sink deeper and engage more of the wings.

However the taper of the bit does not match and should also be refashioned to match the JIS.
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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby charliektm400exc » Tue Mar 05, 2013 4:11 pm

Thanks for the information. I've always wondered why I kept stuffing up the heads on phillips screws on bikes. Wish I had known this 30 years ago.

It's taken me a lot of mucking around to find somebody who will send them to Australia, and then at a reasonable price.

Now got them on the way from Vessel - http://www.vesseltools.com Larry from there has been really helpful.

Charlie

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Re: Japanese Industrial Standard Screwdriver - How to make

Postby El Taco » Fri Mar 08, 2013 3:26 am

[quote="patbrandon1"]The JIS type screw would explain a lot of why almost every screw on my bike looked in rough shape, and why the Speedo Cable Screw was nearly almost just a blank hole. I am curious as to weather the stores I buy my screws from, Ace, Gilroy's, etc...sell JIS screws. I'm going to have to check that out.But this info does explain a lot, thanks.[/quote]


This. It's been my experience all these years to start with a hammer then break it loose. Never had a number two for the hand impact. I've also had to deal with a good number of stripped speedo cable screws, and many times I've had to cut a slot through everything and remove it with a flat head. I'll have to get me a JIS set as well, soon as I come across them.




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