Drain carbs for winter storage, or just add Stabil and keep carbs full?


Technical information and Q&A applicable to all years and models of Goldwings
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busdriver
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Re: Drain carbs for winter storage, or just add Stabil and keep carbs full?

Post by busdriver » Sun Jun 04, 2017 11:44 pm



Stored wet.
Started with Stabil then later moved to SeaFoam. 10 years now and no issues.



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5m0k3y
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Re: Drain carbs for winter storage, or just add Stabil and keep carbs full?

Post by 5m0k3y » Thu Jun 15, 2017 12:58 am

I was sure I needed to rebuild the carbs on my gl but due to time and financial constraints I didn't get around to it this winter, the bike did however sit 8+ months with a large amount of Lucas Deep Clean fuel system cleaner. The bike has never run better when I took it out for the first time this year a week ago. No more hesitation, smoother idle, and I don't always need the choke to start it now. I had run an entire can of seafoam through the bike, followed by an entire bottle of berryman b-12 chemtool, and lastly the lucas deep clean to avoid having to remove the carbs. My average mpg before putting it in to storage was 27 with rough idle and hesitation on acceleration still happening, running off of the fuel it had from last year yet I got 32, and I just filled it for the first time this year so im hoping for a bit more from fresh fuel.
Im not sure if the lucas deep clean is supposed to be a fuel stabilizer, I threw away the bottle after using the remainder before storing it so I would have to check next time I see one. It just worked out that I didn't ride it any more last year before winter and that's how it got stored. Its a happy accident for sure, but may help someone else having similar issues.

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rockford75
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Re: Drain carbs for winter storage, or just add Stabil and keep carbs full?

Post by rockford75 » Wed Jun 28, 2017 11:23 am

All I know is that Ethanol gasoline is the worst thing you can put into a bike. When I park my bike for the winter,I put in a full tank of gas and stabil. I run it for a few and shut it off as well as turn the gas off. This spring I went to clean my fuel filter I couldnt get the fuel line off of the petcock. It was on there so tight I broke the Petcock trying to get the fuel line off. What a bummer that was. I also make sure I change the oil before parking the bike for the winter.
A BIKE IS LIKE A AIRPLANE Maintenance Maintenance!

FM-USA
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Re: Drain carbs for winter storage, or just add Stabil and keep carbs full?

Post by FM-USA » Sat Jul 01, 2017 7:02 am

FYI:
On my 1500, fuel from the tank to the carbs takes around 3.25 miles of normal speed (50-ish mph) in 5th gear.
I've never tested in different gears and speeds.

This info is just to let you know it does take a while for fresh fuel to get the the carb bowls.
If you're not riding for long periods like a winter layover, plan on at least a 5 mile run. ;)
"Tact is the ability to tell someone to go to hell in such a way that they look forward to the trip." W.C. Have a wonderful flat tire day while doing 99mph.

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Solina Dave
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Re: Drain carbs for winter storage, or just add Stabil and keep carbs full?

Post by Solina Dave » Wed Nov 01, 2017 12:58 pm

I'm just as confused as I ever was. Maybe that's no surprise. But I can never seem to get a straight answer. Maybe I'm missing something. Let me know what you think.

I asked the following question on Sta-bil's question/answer link:

"When using STAY-BIL 360º Marine, will adding more do a better job? And if so, how much more can be added without doing harm?"

The reply was:

"All you need to add is the suggested treatment amount: 1oz for every 2.5 gallons of fuel."

That didn't coincide with instructions on the product. So I contacted Sta-bil's customer service for confirmation. I stated:

You're saying 1 oz. for every 2.5 gallons. That would be 4 oz. for 10 gallons. Yet I'm also seeing, on the product, 1 oz. for up to 10 gallons. Which is it? Can I put in too much? I have a 5 gallon tank on my motorcycle. Would I put in 1 oz.? Would I put in 2 oz? Are the supposed benefits of adding STAY-BIL 360 Marine enhanced significantly by adding more product to the fuel than specified? And if so, how much more can be added without doing harm.

The reply from customer service was:

If you are using STA-BIL360® Marine™ Formula:

1. Fill the fuel tank as much as possible.
2. Add .5 oz. (half ounce) of STA-BIL 360® Marine™ to your motorcycle’s 5 gallon tank. This will preserve the fuel for at least 12 months.
3. Run the engine for about 5 minutes to ensure that the entire fuel system is treated or coated.

We do not recommend adding too much over the dosage amount because this formula is already concentrated.

There ya go!.............................Dave :?
"Assume Nothing"

FM-USA
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Re: Drain carbs for winter storage, or just add Stabil and keep carbs full?

Post by FM-USA » Thu Nov 02, 2017 10:14 pm

Dave,...
That Stabil answer sounds like a computer generated auto reply, I'm getting more of those the past few years.

I guess businesses are tired of talking person to person. Understandable after "X" amount of time the questions are repetitious but it's still good to get ALL your questions answered.

Another thing I'm noticing. You send in asking 2 or more questions, they only answer one question and it's almost always the first question. They totally ignore the rest of the email/message.
To me it's getting so futile, I may as well just send one question per email/message.
"Tact is the ability to tell someone to go to hell in such a way that they look forward to the trip." W.C. Have a wonderful flat tire day while doing 99mph.

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bluthundr31
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Re: Drain carbs for winter storage, or just add Stabil and keep carbs full?

Post by bluthundr31 » Mon Nov 27, 2017 11:14 pm

I’m a month or so away from a winter storage condition but I want to prep the beast correctly when the time comes.

Both Stabil “360 Marine” AND “360 PERFORMANCE” tout “vapor technology”. The marine product costs about 50% more than the performance product. Are there known benefits to using the marine product over the performance product?

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Re: Drain carbs for winter storage, or just add Stabil and keep carbs full?

Post by WingAdmin » Tue Nov 28, 2017 11:10 pm

From How to Winterize your Motorcycle, step 2:

Second, I add a double dose of Marine Sta-Bil fuel stabilizer. Why a double dose, and why the Marine version? First, this stabilizer is used to prevent phase separation - and you cannot do damage by overdosing your fuel. In fact, they tell you to use more when storing for longer periods of time. Second, the marine version of the product is designed for use where there is high humidity and frequent water incursion. It is far better at holding moisture in the fuel in suspension than the regular "red" Sta-Bil. Think of it as regular "red" Sta-Bil on steroids. In addition, the Marine Sta-Bil off-gasses a vapor that coats the inside of your fuel tank that is NOT submerged in gas, preventing corrosion. Once I've added both of these products, I fill the tank to the very, very top with FRESH, quality fuel, leaving as little air space as possible in the tank. Air in the tank = water vapor, so get rid of it as best you can. Lastly, I ride the bike for 5 minutes or so to make sure the fuel with additives has made it fully through the carburetors.

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bluthundr31
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Re: Drain carbs for winter storage, or just add Stabil and keep carbs full?

Post by bluthundr31 » Sat Dec 02, 2017 3:24 pm

I'm not in a high humidity environment but the Marine product sounds like it is the best solution. Thanks for the info. The beast will be set for the winter hibernation, but I'm STILL gonna ride the wheels off it til then, :D

Thomas Berry
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Re: Drain carbs for winter storage, or just add Stabil and keep carbs full?

Post by Thomas Berry » Tue Jan 02, 2018 10:28 am

Hi, my name is Tom. I have some advice on carb winterization. I have had many bikes, and I rebuild big lawn equipment engines. I have rebuilt many carbs on many engines and bikes. Carb problems are the most common problem with engine that come through our shop. Since gasoline companies started putting ethanol in gasoline, it has become a complete nightmare for all shops.
You explained that after you drained your bowls for the winter and upon starting it in the spring for the first time your carbs leaked. Draining them is best for winter storage. If so before you start them in the spring put the bike on center stand. If you can access your carbs with a small wooden dow rod or something none metallic. reach in with the dow and lightly tape each carb to jar them slightly. This will loosen any carb float and needle valve that may be slightly stuck for being dry. Then turn on fuel valve and start the bike. watch carbs for overflow, and retap if necessary.
I always find NONE ethanol fuel for ALL my winterization. And I use nothing but premium grade. For some reason low grade fuel does Not winterize well. Probably due to low octane. The Lawn Mower shops are told that ethanol fuel shelf life is 6 to 8 weeks. This is poor, although I have seen it last much longer, but it is unpredictable. None ethanol premium CAN be found if your near a lake or boating area. Premium fuel only, is what I use with stabilizer. I start my bike at least once a month and let it run until operating temperature. This cycles fuel through the carbs to fresh fuel. Every carburetor has an atmospheric vent which allows air to eventually reach the fuel in the carb bowl. Fuel exposed to air is what starts the fuel break down. Fuel injection is much better on preventing that problem. But I still start my bike once a month. In the spring when I ride the bike I put Lucas fuel injector cleaner in the bike, carb or fuel injected and ride the hell out of it. Never had a problem. I have an 87 Aspencade and an 02 1800 trike. Both get the same attention.

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AZgl1800
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Re: Drain carbs for winter storage, or just add Stabil and keep carbs full?

Post by AZgl1800 » Tue Jan 02, 2018 2:25 pm

I am blessed with two Pure Gas retailers

6 miles north with 87 & 91

and 5 miles east which is at the Marina.
The Marina Conoco has 87, 89, 91 grade non-ethanol fuels.

I have always just left the 87 in the tank and added Stabil.


However, last spring the Poulan Pro push mower refused to start, have not got into that one even yet. so it will be a two year dry spell on it before I get that one running.

and I have one of the tiny little Poulan tree trimmer/weed wackers that refused to start last year.

any hints on getting them to go w/o taking them apart?

My Emergency Generator, which is a 10 KVA, the manual told me to always shut off the Fuel Valve and let the engine run until it dies. I have followed that instruction, and yes, that thing starts on the first try, every time.


After reading the above comment, I think I will start buying 91 octane in the fall from now on.
John
'02 Gl1800 Hot Rod Yellow,
daughter named her Big Bird :lol:
http://www.goldwingfacts.com

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Re: Drain carbs for winter storage, or just add Stabil and keep carbs full?

Post by Thomas Berry » Tue Jan 02, 2018 10:11 pm

AZ,
Your mower and the other items you mentioned that failed to start will probably need a good carb take apart cleaning. It has sat to long. Almost everything that I see come through the shop, that has been sitting more than 6 months gets a complete fuel system flush. Flush tank, fuel lines, and carb cleaning. On you Generator, after shutting off fuel and running the bowl dry, I would loosen carb bowl and let all the fuel out. There is always a very small amount left in the bottom of the bowls, even after running dry. That small amount will dry and gum up. Next year you will get another small amount. And year after year the build up will finally reach your main jet and it will not start. The premium fuel is always better for winterizing. My friend goes to a small airport that will sell him so aviation fuel that is very high octane. That also will work great. In my string trimmers and chain saws I use true fuel. I also have used it in my Goldwing. It is a fuel sold in a quart can, that can be bought in straight 4 cycle mix, or a premix, such as 40 to 1 or 50 to1. I buy the 40 to1 premix for all my two cycle equipment. It is expensive. One quart is from $ 6.00 to $ 8.00 per quart. But I guarantee you equipment will start next year and you don`t have to add a stabilizer. It is guaranteed for 5 years shelf life, and 2.5 years after you open the can. You can even put the 40 to one premix in your four cycle engines. It will not hurt it, and will not smoke. I put this in my 1800 once when I had issues will the handle bat switches. Bike sat for a long time with very little fuel in it. I finally took it to dealership for repair. They fired it up after they repaired it and I rode it home. I learned this trick from the warehouse where I get parts. I had a brush cutter at my Lake house that hang on the wall for two years. I fired it up on the second pull and used up all the fuel in the tank with no problems. The stuff works great, but is expensive, but you Don`t have to add stabill.

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AZgl1800
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Re: Drain carbs for winter storage, or just add Stabil and keep carbs full?

Post by AZgl1800 » Wed Jan 03, 2018 8:59 am

Thanks Thomas,

I need to look at the generator and see how the carbs are made.

if there is a drain, I will start doing that also.

I saw that True Fuel at Walmart a while back, and wondered what the concoction is made up of?
John
'02 Gl1800 Hot Rod Yellow,
daughter named her Big Bird :lol:
http://www.goldwingfacts.com

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Re: Drain carbs for winter storage, or just add Stabil and keep carbs full?

Post by Thomas Berry » Wed Jan 03, 2018 5:10 pm

True Fuel is full of preservatives, and no ethanol. Also high octane, I think 93. It looks like water.
It you know what Coleman lantern fuel is, my Father use to call it white gas because it had no color.
That stuff last for a long time. Not certain if it is the same formula, but looks like it and smells like it.
It will not hurt or deteriorate your fuel line hoses. Ethanol is terrible for that. That is why the hoses on chain saws and weed trimmers get hard and brittle. True Fuel is great, but the price is ridiculous. I drain my fuel, then put True fuel in by itself.
Your generator my not have a drain screw, but you should be able to loosen the bowl and let the small amount of fuel out. Like I mentioned before, you can put the pre-mix in a four cycle engine. The synthetic two stroke oil mixed with True Fuel will not settle to the bottom and cause any issues. In fact it makes good upper cylinder lubrication. If you ran it all the time it would probably cause spark plugs issues. But for winter storage it cant be beat.

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Re: Drain carbs for winter storage, or just add Stabil and keep carbs full?

Post by AndyC » Thu Jan 04, 2018 8:43 am

I have a great deal of cranking to start my bike after it sits for over a month. I try to ride it at least once a month in the winter and use stabil 360. Also I thought Honda did not recommend using after market fuel additives ?? Correct me. AndyC Kentucky

Thomas Berry
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Re: Drain carbs for winter storage, or just add Stabil and keep carbs full?

Post by Thomas Berry » Thu Jan 04, 2018 1:53 pm

True Fuel is not an aftermarket additive it is pure fuel. 93 octane with no Ethanol, and lots of preservatives to give it shelf life. It will not hurt any engine. Lucas fuel injector cleaner will not hurt any engine. I use it religiously. I did see one comment where someone used Berryman carb cleaner in their fuel. That is a NO NO. I use Berryman carb cleaner to clean carbs on lawn equipment, or any carbureted engine. But NOT in your fuel. It is made for soaking carbs after they are removed taken apart, and all plastic and rubber removed from carb. Never put carb cleaner in your fuel. I tried that years ago on a 1980 wing. I tried it as a last resort to removing carbs. It ruined all the air valve boots and rubber in my carbs. Very costly mistake. We use to do this to car carbs, but they are different. They don`t have as much rubber and plastic in the old carbs. I`m talking 60`s, 70`s. Fuel injector cleaner is formulated to be put in your fuel. Carb cleaner is NOT.
You said your bike takes a lot of cranking after it sits. That is because the fuel in your carb bowls evaporates due to the atmospheric vent that all carbs have. Takes some cranking to refill the bowls with fresh fuel.



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