Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???


Information and questions on GL1000 Goldwings (1975-1979)
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KenoshaGoldwing
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Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby KenoshaGoldwing » Sat May 17, 2014 8:38 pm



Just a note to say hi and introduce myself. Just picked up a 1978 GL1000 and couldn’t be happier. Before I begin I would like to express thanks to those who have contributed in the past. I have already gotten a tremendous amount of help from you all. Thanks again.

I had started looking for a GL back in the early spring, but with no real vigor. Just sent out a couple of questions to some people on CL, but nothing really stood out. I was looking for a summer project and not in any hurry. A couple of weeks later, I get another email from one of these contacts asking if I was still interested. Revisiting the ad, I saw a couple of my favorite words on CL – 'moving' and 'need to sell'. To shorten the story, they were asking 1200 and I got it for 400. Sweet.

She is definitely not currently a runner, but I got to working on her today. Most of the day was spent getting all of the after market stuff off. (Constantly switching between SAE and Metric got boring fast)
Here is what I have done, or will soon do…
• Flush coolant
• Change oil and filter
• Flush and change rear diff
• New plugs
• Timing belt
• Flush break fluid
• Find a replacement center stand (removed by PO)
• Find a replacement battery box

I also have to investigate starting issues. When I push the button, I just get a click out of the solenoid. When I hit the starter directly, it turns over but sluggishly.

Question – does Martek Products of Santa Ana CA mean anything to anybody? I did some searching, and it seems this is some sort of electrical ignition system. There is a box about the size of a pack of cigarettes (chicken) wired around the frame neck. I opened up the points cover and it doesn’t look anything like the FSM. I also found reference to ‘switching back to points’ when these things go bad. I am going to have to do some more research, as this is a little above my knowledge level.

I also have a lot of wiring to do – way more black electrical tape than I am comfortable with.

(Oh yeah – I found a paper wasp nest in the original head light bucket when I removed the Vetter fairing. Is that a normal occurance?)

Pics below are mid tear down. If I can find the before pics, I will post them.
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Fred Camper
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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby Fred Camper » Sat May 17, 2014 9:35 pm

Well first I would follow the excellent starter rebuild thread on this site. After doing a few of these, buying a rebuild is a waste of money. They just need a good internal cleaning.

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KenoshaGoldwing
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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby KenoshaGoldwing » Sat May 17, 2014 9:53 pm

Cheers Fred, that is what I was thinking. Man, there is so much peace in working on these lovely beasts...
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KenoshaGoldwing
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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby KenoshaGoldwing » Sat May 17, 2014 11:14 pm

Any thoughts on this Martek deal? Anyone with any experience would be appreciated. Anyway this unit can be tested? I could go back to points (if I knew what that meant....)
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dingdong
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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby dingdong » Sun May 18, 2014 7:03 am

The original ignition on these old girls was a dual point system. One set of points for each coil. The points are too much trouble to set and keep adjusted for some guys. What you have is a Martek electronic ignition. (No longer in production). If it still works that is a good thing. Switching back to points is an alternative if it doesn't work. Replacing with a newer style electronic ignition (Dyna S) is an even better (IMO) solution. Once installed you never have to replace or adjust points again. I have the Dyna S on my 76 but I carry all the parts to convert back if it ever fails on the road. I have had it for 7 or 8 years with no problems. Good luck with your rebuild.
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Fred Camper
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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby Fred Camper » Sun May 18, 2014 8:54 am

Electronic ignition gets less reliable as time progresses. I had a Dyna on mine that went on in 1984 and brought issues in 2011. A new system was well worth it as points are difficult to keep clean unless you ride most every day. Take a week off every once in a while and point need cleaning. Then you ride even less. I would not replace that Martek until you have reason to know it is failing.The coils are often the first to go.

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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby KenoshaGoldwing » Sun May 18, 2014 8:09 pm

Just a quick note on my progress today with the starter rebuild. A bad day in the garage is better than the best day in the office.

Somehow, step one 'drain the oil' was lost on me. My garage smells like a real mechanic's shop now. Related, we are now out of cat litter.

In removing the starter, one is required to remove one of the mounting bolts for the exhaust. I don't know what you all call it, but around here, that requires using a technique we call the double-nutter. Having not attempted this maneuver for many years, I consulted the internet. Let me warn you, a youtube search for 'double-nutter' is not for the faint of heart.

Failure came at the last minute. A stupid piddly 17 cent fiber gasket on the back end ended up breaking. Not available locally, and the process will resume shortly... after Amazon arrives.

Other than that it was a snap. The armature wheel was formerly orange with a patina of rust. And the conductors are a pleasant shade of copper compared to the most recent carbon black.

Thanks for all of your help so far and for the help to come.
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Fred Camper
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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby Fred Camper » Sun May 18, 2014 8:45 pm

Just wait until you hear her turn over with full compression once you get her buttoned up. She will spin like new. One of the best things you can do for these old girls.

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KenoshaGoldwing
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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby KenoshaGoldwing » Sun May 18, 2014 9:43 pm

Cheers mate. Very much looking forward to the end game.

I have read a lot, but one bit of advice requested... Any other major rebuilds advised at this early stage? Really happy with how the starter worked out (sans stupid fiber filter)...
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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby dingdong » Mon May 19, 2014 6:52 am

I didn't see where you mentioned the brakes. A must to flush or rebuild wheel cylinders and master cylinder.
Tom

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KenoshaGoldwing
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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby KenoshaGoldwing » Mon May 19, 2014 9:23 am

Speaking of brakes... Looking at my girl and looking at other motorcycles of similar vintage, I have come to realize that my front wheel differs quite substantially. A PO removed the original front wheel and replaced it with one with only one brake rotor. The other brake line has been snipped and plugged with a bolt. Wow.

This is going to have to be addressed, as I wouldn't feel comfortable with all of this weight (including my less than svelte frame) and half of the braking power on the front end.

I can't imagine how that ever was considered a good idea. Is there such a term as PITA PO?
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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby WingAdmin » Mon May 19, 2014 9:28 am

KenoshaGoldwing wrote:Speaking of brakes... Looking at my girl and looking at other motorcycles of similar vintage, I have come to realize that my front wheel differs quite substantially. A PO removed the original front wheel and replaced it with one with only one brake rotor. The other brake line has been snipped and plugged with a bolt. Wow.

This is going to have to be addressed, as I wouldn't feel comfortable with all of this weight (including my less than svelte frame) and half of the braking power on the front end.

I can't imagine how that ever was considered a good idea. Is there such a term as PITA PO?


I once had a look at an old car that a friend had just bought. He said the brakes weren't working very well, and asked if I could have look at it for him. I pulled the front wheels off. One brake looked fine. The other had a caliper that had obviously been leaking for some time. The previous owner had "fixed" the leaking brake problem by cutting the brake line, bending it over and crimping it shut with a pair of vice-grips, then duct-taping the vice grips to the suspension arm. Job well done!

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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby SnoBrdr » Mon May 19, 2014 2:43 pm

WingAdmin wrote:
KenoshaGoldwing wrote:Speaking of brakes... Looking at my girl and looking at other motorcycles of similar vintage, I have come to realize that my front wheel differs quite substantially. A PO removed the original front wheel and replaced it with one with only one brake rotor. The other brake line has been snipped and plugged with a bolt. Wow.

This is going to have to be addressed, as I wouldn't feel comfortable with all of this weight (including my less than svelte frame) and half of the braking power on the front end.

I can't imagine how that ever was considered a good idea. Is there such a term as PITA PO?


I once had a look at an old car that a friend had just bought. He said the brakes weren't working very well, and asked if I could have look at it for him. I pulled the front wheels off. One brake looked fine. The other had a caliper that had obviously been leaking for some time. The previous owner had "fixed" the leaking brake problem by cutting the brake line, bending it over and crimping it shut with a pair of vice-grips, then duct-taping the vice grips to the suspension arm. Job well done!


And what was the problem with that? You did say it was well done. :mrgreen:

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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby KenoshaGoldwing » Mon May 19, 2014 8:25 pm

WingAdmin - you win. My PO was an idiot, yours was a complete moron.
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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby KenoshaGoldwing » Tue May 20, 2014 9:31 pm

Any thoughts on Partzilla as a seller? Just wondering. I was supposed to have my (stupid-little-aggravating-starter-rebuild-stopping-time-wasting) fiber $2.00 o-ring by Memorial day, and the order has been postponed because I also ordered an air filter. The air filter is on back order...

Have I made a mistake? Is partzilla something that you collectively avoid, or is this just something else. What are your thoughts?
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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby WingAdmin » Tue May 20, 2014 10:02 pm

KenoshaGoldwing wrote:Any thoughts on Partzilla as a seller? Just wondering. I was supposed to have my (stupid-little-aggravating-starter-rebuild-stopping-time-wasting) fiber $2.00 o-ring by Memorial day, and the order has been postponed because I also ordered an air filter. The air filter is on back order...

Have I made a mistake? Is partzilla something that you collectively avoid, or is this just something else. What are your thoughts?


Partzilla is just like all the other online stores that offer OEM parts - they don't actually stock anything. You order it, they turn around and order it from Honda. When they get it shipped from Honda, they then turn around and ship it to you.

Some of them, like Cyclemax, keep commonly ordered OEM parts in stock, so they can turn orders around quickly. I don't know about Partzilla.

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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby KenoshaGoldwing » Wed May 21, 2014 1:09 pm

With having in mind that I need entire new front wheel assembly, including brakes - I thinking of going full Frankenbike. I found another '78 (in better condition than mine) but without the fairing I want. I think I can whack these two into one good looking, good riding bike.

Can't wait!
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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby Fred Camper » Wed May 21, 2014 3:26 pm

Certainly an option but you would still have the limitations of our "skinny by today's standards" then a good plan. Any other solutions take a bunch more work, but the 1200 front end is common and a significant upgrade. But you do not see me doing that right now.

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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby SnoBrdr » Wed May 21, 2014 3:38 pm

Fred Camper wrote:Certainly an option but you would still have the limitations of our "skinny by today's standards" then a good plan. Any other solutions take a bunch more work, but the 1200 front end is common and a significant upgrade. But you do not see me doing that right now.


Is that a strict bolt on upgrade or is a lot of fiddling required?

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KenoshaGoldwing
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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby KenoshaGoldwing » Wed May 21, 2014 4:16 pm

Not attempting any upgrade. Just the merging of two '78 GL1000s. Hadn't even considered going to a 1200.
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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby Fred Camper » Wed May 21, 2014 7:25 pm

If I recall correctly the 1200 works with just minor changes. The steering stops need to match the 1000 so that takes a change to the 1200 triple tree. But I still suggest staying with the direct replacement plan.

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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby KenoshaGoldwing » Mon Jun 02, 2014 11:22 pm

New action on this project. Hopefully pictures tomorrow.

My original bike was to be the donor rather than the 'donee'. However, the original bike had been so molested by POs, I couldn't make headway with the f***ed up electronics. (I didn't know that much black tape was available on this whole planet...) Plus, there was enough rust in the tank to create a brand new AMC Pacer from scratch. Futile.

So I have the 'new' bike in a painful state of disrepair, augmented with parts from a true 'parts bike'

Once I have 'Frankenbike' together, look to the want ads for parts you might need. Cheers.
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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby KenoshaGoldwing » Sat Jun 07, 2014 9:27 pm

Spent a long and rewarding day in the driveway, tackling the missing center stand, plugs, timing belt, thermostat, and new hoses.

Both my living bike and my donor bike came without center stands. Spookytooth helped a great deal by sending me one that he had. (Shout out to Spookytooth. Big thanks from Wisconsin)

After installing it, I figured out why the stand had been replaced. You will see in the pictures below that after having installed it, it had a 10% list to starboard. The center frame piece was rusted and it was bending. Had to use a splitting maul to get it back on the side stand. This post has helpful information if you have this problem. http://ngwclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=11785. If you are buying one of these bikes without a center stand, take a close look at that part of the frame. Live and learn.

Keptin, we're taking on water...
Keptin, we're taking on water...


Look at the upper left
Look at the upper left




I found more rust than I would like in the right rear spark plug socket. I have never seen anything like it before.

One of these kids is not like the other...
One of these kids is not like the other...


The only issue with the timing belt was that the right side cog jumped when I released the timing belt. A video on the Steve Saunder's site had the same issue.

He just said to address it when you put the new one on, without sharing how to do this.

The cog was under tension, and after trying to hold it in place with one hand, and fit the timing belt with the other, I had had it. Eventually I ran a socket wrench with an extension through the belt to hold the cog in place and that worked wonderfully.



Honda belt, but not original.  Looking at the bolts inside, the belt had been replaced at least once. However, 40,000 miles, better to have peace of mind.
Honda belt, but not original. Looking at the bolts inside, the belt had been replaced at least once. However, 40,000 miles, better to have peace of mind.


Every bit of advice concerning this procedure advises to check the timing positions and check often. I highly second that. T1 slipped out of place when I installed the left belt.

Did have some drama in replacing the radiator unit. When I placed the clamp unit on the top radiator hose, it wasn't allowing the clearance needed to fit the radiator. (Don't ask how long that took to figure out. At one point, I considered gremlins had come and swapped out my radiator with one that was larger making the bolts not line up in the bottom.)

I also had some trouble mounting the water pump cover at the end. I might have cut the new hose a little long. Stripped it all to high heaven. I would have been more concerned, but I have a reserve unit on the parts bike.



Questions
* Other than what I read in the copied post, any other input on the frame damage? I don't have the time, skills or patience to do a full frame restore. (All due respect that have all of these things. I envy you terribly.)
* Any input on the rusty plug? Like I said, I have never seen the like.
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Fred Camper
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Re: Proud new owner - '78 GL1000 & Martek???

Postby Fred Camper » Sun Jun 08, 2014 9:36 pm

The plugs fit down in a recess that serves as a water cup. There is a drain hole in each plug cup. Bet the cylinder with the rust plug has debris in the drain. A wire is fine to clear it out.




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