GL1100 starter hangs up


Information and questions on GL1100 Goldwings (1980-1983)
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auctioneeral
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GL1100 starter hangs up

Postby auctioneeral » Mon Nov 10, 2014 9:22 am



Hello
Let me start out saying I'm going to look at bike 1981 with 79000 miles. Condition was told in great shape. Now the owner States that the starter or motor as a dead spot. Starter will only turn motor so far and stop. But if you put bike in gear and turn wheel the starter will spin motor to dead spot again. He can get bike to start but only runs for 3-4 minutes and dies.
It's been garage kept. That's all I know till I go look at it this week.
I'm thinking maybe it's the starter clutch rollers stuck.
I know I would have to clean and flush carbs. And fuel tank.
He's wanting $600.
I'm just looking for a cheap one to tinker with and get drivable some day.
What do you think about starter problem.



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HawkeyeGL1200
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1981 GL1100 Interstate

Re: GL1100 starter hangs up

Postby HawkeyeGL1200 » Mon Nov 10, 2014 11:09 am

It could be many things, of course. A couple of places I'd start looking at... is one of the carbs leaking fuel into a cylinder causing the engine to lock up... also may want to see if the dog bone fuse is in good condition or if it has been replaced, as these have notoriously caused electrical problems... I would change the fuel filter, change the oil, then try to synchronize the carbs to see if that helps. Spark plugs may also tell you a story about how well the carburetors are set up and working...
I am wrong as often as I am right concerning what is wrong with someone else' motorcycle without having seen the machine in person. Guessing with limited information, as to the source of the trouble, is sketchy at best.

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WingAdmin
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Re: GL1100 starter hangs up

Postby WingAdmin » Mon Nov 10, 2014 11:52 am

auctioneeral wrote:Hello
Let me start out saying I'm going to look at bike 1981 with 79000 miles. Condition was told in great shape. Now the owner States that the starter or motor as a dead spot. Starter will only turn motor so far and stop. But if you put bike in gear and turn wheel the starter will spin motor to dead spot again. He can get bike to start but only runs for 3-4 minutes and dies.
It's been garage kept. That's all I know till I go look at it this week.
I'm thinking maybe it's the starter clutch rollers stuck.
I know I would have to clean and flush carbs. And fuel tank.
He's wanting $600.
I'm just looking for a cheap one to tinker with and get drivable some day.
What do you think about starter problem.


The starter motor has a planetary reduction gear on it. The electric motor actually spins hundreds of times to get the engine to turn over once, this is how it achieves the tremendous torque required to turn the engine against the piston compression. So if the starter had a "dead spot" (usually caused by an electrical problem on the brushes or commutator) it would cause the engine to pretty much not turn at all. Usually a dead spot on a commutator will only affect the motor when it is at rest - once it's already spinning, it will spin past the dead spot with no problem.

So in your case, the motor is turning for a bit, then it stops. Bumping the engine with the rear wheel will get it to crank again until it stops once more.

When it stops, does the starter continue to spin, but the engine doesn't turn over? If that is the case, then you have an issue with the sprags in the sprag clutch.

If it starts cranking the engine but then stops, it could be one of several things:

- Battery dead
- Starter needs rebuilding
- Mechanical failure in the chain drive from the starter to the sprag clutch

there could be a few others, but that's what is coming to mind right now.

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virgilmobile
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Re: GL1100 starter hangs up

Postby virgilmobile » Mon Nov 10, 2014 12:38 pm

I guess if the seller would allow,pull the 4 plugs out and hit the starter.It will most likely eject raw gas.(keep the kill switch off and do this outside)...
This is about all you'll need to know.
If it shoots gas out of a cylinder,you know the carbs need tending to and the starter is probably OK.
You mention that he did get it to run.That confirms that it has a heartbeat.even if just for a short time(till the carbs flooded again).
At the price,its worth tinkering with.
Don't expect some snake oil to magically fix the whole thing.It sounds like a winter project.
I've resurrected my share of bikes,I don't think I spent less than $500 on any one yet.
Lots of things to service.Oils,belts,carbs,brakes,electrical,tires,etc.

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auctioneeral
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1981 GL1100 full dresser
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Re: GL1100 starter hangs up

Postby auctioneeral » Tue Nov 11, 2014 9:11 am

Ok I go tonight to check bike out. Owner call last night said he got it running on 3 cylinders with plug out of the other cylinder. If he puts plug in that cylinder motor spins then stops. He said he did compression test on all 4 cylinders and we're all around 145-150.
But I'm confuse because the bad cylinder if you do a compression check wouldn't that be same as installing plug to were motor would not spin. I will find out more tonight.

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HawkeyeGL1200
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Re: GL1100 starter hangs up

Postby HawkeyeGL1200 » Tue Nov 11, 2014 10:13 am

Taking the plug boot off the plug (while it is still installed in the cylinder head) shouldn't prevent the engine from cranking with the plug installed. I would proceed with caution until you find out what the issue is. It is still a possibility that one cylinder's carb is dumping unrestricted amounts of fuel into the cylinder causing that cylinder to lock hydraulically and preventing the engine from turning over. Once you've "cleared" the blockage (cranking the engine with plugs out, either by bumping the starter or putting the engine in gear and turning with the rear wheel) the engine should spin over with the starter motor and all 4 plugs installed.

If you get this far, and put the plugs back in... and manage to get the engine to start and run, it shouldn't take much detective work to figure if there is excess fuel intrusion in one or my cylinders. You could attach a temporary fuel supply and just watch to see if it leaks down without the engine turning. That would be a dead give away that one or more of your float needle valves leaks through, especially if you attach the fuel connector downstream of the fuel pump.

My best guess is you need to pull the carbs off and at the very least inspect them, as I suspect they're in poor condition. While they're out, you can check out the quality of spark to the plugs and determine if the ignition system is working correctly.

Virgilmobile most likely hit the nail on the head... you're probably looking at 500$ or so to get the bike running correctly. Even at that cost, the total amount you will have in it will be a bargain.
I am wrong as often as I am right concerning what is wrong with someone else' motorcycle without having seen the machine in person. Guessing with limited information, as to the source of the trouble, is sketchy at best.

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virgilmobile
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83 GL1100 I
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Re: GL1100 starter hangs up

Postby virgilmobile » Tue Nov 11, 2014 12:18 pm

Yup.all that.
I'd be tempted to first turn off the fuel so that carb won't flood,leave the plug out,kill the ignition,bump the starter to clear that cylinder...put the plug back in,then run the starter(kill switch still off)...it should crank normal.
We're assuming that one carb floods quick and hydrolocked that cylinder.Leave the gas off.
Look at the plug too.make sure it's the right one for the bike and isn't threading too far into the head.ive seen odd things.
If it's too long,the tip of the plug can hit the piston.

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Ed Z
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Re: GL1100 starter hangs up

Postby Ed Z » Sat Nov 15, 2014 7:15 pm

Turn the kill switch to the off position... Does the "dead spot" go away ???

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auctioneeral
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Re: GL1100 starter hangs up

Postby auctioneeral » Sat Nov 15, 2014 7:47 pm

I will know tomorrow pickup bike. Po States bent exhaust valve.

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auctioneeral
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Re: GL1100 starter hangs up

Postby auctioneeral » Sun Nov 16, 2014 7:43 pm

Well I got it home today. Boy as it been sitting. Mud bee nest all under seat. Send half day just jumping right into left valve cover to check if valves were bent. (Since po stated when you install spark plug motor will not turn over completely before stopping dead.) Well I hand crank motor over 100 + times no problem plugs out. Took radiator out timing covers off and do not see anything. Well I left spark plug at po. So I when and got 4 new plugs, only installed 1 plug that I needed and turn motor over by hand no binding or problems. So I crank it and BRINGO it try starting. So I installed radiator and crank it and got it running not well,.
Its got a tapping knocking on left side. I did see valves need adjusting.
I jumped the gun today just excited to see if it would run.
I got to change oil,filter because oil is real thin. Put other spark plugs in it. Flush gas tank and put so fresh fuel and seaform in it. And see what I have then.

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HawkeyeGL1200
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Re: GL1100 starter hangs up

Postby HawkeyeGL1200 » Sun Nov 16, 2014 7:59 pm

Just curious if that "thin" oil smells like gasoline?
I am wrong as often as I am right concerning what is wrong with someone else' motorcycle without having seen the machine in person. Guessing with limited information, as to the source of the trouble, is sketchy at best.

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auctioneeral
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Motorcycle: 1981 GL1100 nake
1981 GL1100 full dresser
Both getting restored

Re: GL1100 starter hangs up

Postby auctioneeral » Sun Nov 16, 2014 8:19 pm

I really don't recall if it smell like gas. All I think is the thing as been sitting along time. When I first got it to start and I shut it off, white smoke was coming out left muffler like if you blew out a candle. But last time I started it, It was running a little better but had a tapping,knock noise left side and only had it running maybe 1-2 minutes at idle and gave it a little throttle so it didn't stall. But when I shout it off there was no smoke coming out muffler.
I was excite just to near thing run. Because i'm going to go over whole cycle. It's a project for me ,to keep me out of trouble.
It needs brakes. And a real good cleaning.

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HawkeyeGL1200
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Re: GL1100 starter hangs up

Postby HawkeyeGL1200 » Sun Nov 16, 2014 8:34 pm

Smoking out of left side isn't all that unusual, if it sat on the side stand for any length of time. I thought if the oil smelled like gas, it might tie into my thinking that raw gas was locking one of the cylinders... maybe not.

A valve adjustment may help a lot. I had even considered that it was possible the valves were so far out of adjustment (or maybe someone had adjusted them so badly) that the piston was contacting the valves or one of them at least, causing the starter to lock up. The fact that removing the spark plug seemed to eliminate the problem had me crossing the valve/piston contact off the "list" I was formulating.

It appears you're on the right track. I'm glad you got her started.
I am wrong as often as I am right concerning what is wrong with someone else' motorcycle without having seen the machine in person. Guessing with limited information, as to the source of the trouble, is sketchy at best.

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auctioneeral
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Both getting restored

Re: GL1100 starter hangs up

Postby auctioneeral » Sun Nov 16, 2014 8:42 pm

I understand. I been confuse since po stated he just brought bike and motor would not turn over completely, till he pulled #4 spark plug. Which I though loading with gas. But he said no, I think its a bent valve. That's the reason I just jump in taking it apart. We will see.

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Phavas
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Re: GL1100 starter hangs up

Postby Phavas » Wed Nov 19, 2014 3:17 pm

You can't just bend one valve on a Goldwing.
If a belt lets go, all the valves bend on that side.
If the belts are still intact the valves shouldn't be bent, however,
as the bike has been sitting; buy new belts.
Throw the old ones away. Far away.

You've got a duff starter. Get one on E-Bay for $80 bucks and put it on.
Open it first and re-lube it with marine grease to guarantee a long life.
Take your time rebuilding the old starter. Keep it on the shelf as a core.

Change the oil and filter and remove the oil screen from the engine and clean it out.
Flush the crankcase with diesel, then refill with clean oil.
Put Seafoam in the new oil to clear out the sprague clutch.

Change the coolant and clean out the thermostat.

Cheers,
Zaphod
Writing roughshod over the English language

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auctioneeral
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Motorcycle: 1981 GL1100 nake
1981 GL1100 full dresser
Both getting restored

Re: GL1100 starter hangs up

Postby auctioneeral » Thu Nov 20, 2014 7:45 pm

I started another thread under GL1100 Information & Questions.
VALVE TAPPING NOISE AND OTHER NOISE.




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