Dyna Beads in front tire - now a low speed wobble


Information and questions on GL1100 Goldwings (1980-1983)
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mpj220
Posts: 14
Joined: Tue May 04, 2010 11:18 am
Location: Grafton, Ma
Motorcycle: 1983 GL1100Aspencade
1977 GL1000 Goldwing

Dyna Beads in front tire - now a low speed wobble

Postby mpj220 » Thu Jun 10, 2010 6:00 am



Hello all.

I would like to hear from others using Dynabeads in your front tire.

In my never ending quest to eliminate a 40 mph front end wobble from a 1983 Aspencade, I have created a low speed instability.

The history of the bike is that it sat for two years. The previous owner has receipts for a bunch of front end work. Head bearings, fork seals, wheel bearings, etc. were all replaced. The bike had a shake at 40 mph during deceleration. The shop that worked on it told him that it must have been a defective tire in some way. He decided to just live with it.
Along comes me.

When I got the bike, it had a plug in the front tire. I did go for a couple test rides and that is when I found this 40 mph wobble on decel.
I put a new front tire and decided to go with the Dynabeads. Now, I seem to have created a low speed problem as well. If trying to make a turn after a complete stop, it seems that I am fighting the bars. It feels like I am slipping on ice or something. I am wondering if it is the Dynabeads not dispersing themselves yet. Everything feels fine after, aside from the 40 mph wobble still there. Higher speed cornering is fine.
Everything is torqued. I have pulled the forks, replaced the fork oil (with ATF according to clymer), everything seems good. I have tried different pressures - 28, 32, 35, currently 40. At 40 psi, the decel wobble is only present at 39 to 40 mph. At lower pressures, the decel wobble would be present as low as 35mph and up to 45mph.

I am heading on a 3 hour ride tomorrow to Laconia so, I am going to pull the tire today and remove the beads and have the local shop balance it the old fashioned way.

Has anyone else experienced this with Dyna Beads?

Thanks



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Re: Dyna Beads in front tire - now a low speed wobble

Postby WingAdmin » Thu Jun 10, 2010 2:16 pm

The Dyna Beads should not have to take time to disperse - if the wheel is moving more than about 10-15 mph, they are in place and not moving inside the wheel. Slower than that, and they are rolling around in there. That is...unless there's something causing them to stick.

If the tire was put on with the goopy, greasy lubricant that some tire shops use, and that lubricant got spread on the rim or on the inside of the tire, it's possible that the Dyna Beads are stuck to the goop instead of positioning themselves properly on the inside of the tire - and this will cause a severe imbalance like you could be experiencing. The tire rim and the tire have to be clean and dry when the tire is mounted. If you put the bike on the center stand, have someone sit on the back to raise the front wheel, then turn the front wheel by hand, you should be able to hear the beads moving around in the tire.

How much (by weight) Dyna Beads did you put in the tire?

I doubt the 40 mph wobble is being caused by tire imbalance, but stranger things have happened. Have you had a look at the rear end? I had a wobble this spring that turned out to be incorrectly installed rear swingarm pivot pins, causing the rear wheel to have too much lateral free play. Check to see if the rear wheel can be moved from side to side when it's on the center stand, either moving the entire swingarm, or just the wheel (i.e. loose/worn wheel bearings).

I kind of doubt that it is the rear end, being that you were able to mitigate some of the wobble with increased front air pressure, but it can't hurt to check.

Is the fork weight installed? If that's missing, it can definitely cause a wobble.

The usual suspects on this have been addressed, but it might not hurt to also re-torque the steering head bearings yourself, if you haven't done them already.

mpj220
Posts: 14
Joined: Tue May 04, 2010 11:18 am
Location: Grafton, Ma
Motorcycle: 1983 GL1100Aspencade
1977 GL1000 Goldwing

Re: Dyna Beads in front tire - now a low speed wobble

Postby mpj220 » Thu Jun 10, 2010 3:19 pm

Beads were all in properly. I installed the new tire. All was dry. And, yes, the beads could be heard moving freely.
2oz of beads were put in. That is what was recommended when I bought them.
The uneasy feeling that I had was at speeds around 10-15mph so, maybe it was the beads not dispersed yet.

I dismounted and removed the dynabeads today and had the tire balanced at the local honda shop.
Only took the bike for a quick spin for about 10 minutes. It does feel better on very low speed turns. Still hard to tell as I only had a few minutes to take it out for a ride.

I did check the rear for play but, I will re-visit that again just to be sure all is well.

What is the fork weight? That may be my problem. Perhaps the shop that did all the previous work forgot to put something back.

I did replace one of the fork seals. Everything was there internally in the fork. I replaced with ATF on both legs though as suggested by the clymer manual. The 40mph wobble was present before all that. So, replacing the fork seal, fork oil, and a new tire, basically did nothing (but make my wallet lighter - hehe).

I did tighten the head a bit more today. Without the special socket though so, no idea if it is torqued to spec. I just helped it a bit with a hammer and flat chisel.

The wobble is not terrible. Strictly a hands off wobble in the front only. And only during deceleration at 39 to 40 mph.
I am just hoping to get rid of it. My 77 wing was wobble free and I guess I got used to that.

Thanks for the help.

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Re: Dyna Beads in front tire - now a low speed wobble

Postby WingAdmin » Thu Jun 10, 2010 3:39 pm

The fork weight is mounted on the front of the steering head on Goldwings with fairings. Goldwings that do not have fairings have the headlight mounted on the front of the steering head. The headlight assembly gives the steering head mass (inertia), and lowers its resonant frequency below that which would be induced by normal tire movement, and cause an uncontrollable speed wobble.

Because the faired Goldwing has the headlight mounted in the fairing, the steering head needs to have a weight added to it to provide that mass in place of the headlight assembly. That is why there are all kinds of warnings (including the warning casted right into the weight itself) not to ride the bike without that weight installed - without it, you could end up with uncontrollable tank-slapper that would end in a crash.

The fork weight is mounted on the front of the forks, near the bottom of the fairing. It's a ridged steel block, 3 or 4 pounds if I recall. You can see it in the picture, where the arrow is pointing (click the image for full size).

Are you getting the wobble only when decelerating with hands off the handlebars? If so, then there's no point in chasing it down - almost all of the 1100 and later Wings do it, even the 1800's. In that case, the solution is easy: keep your hands on the handlebars. :) Your hands and arms are performing the same job as the weight - lowering the resonant frequency of the handlebar system.
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Fork weight
Fork weight

mpj220
Posts: 14
Joined: Tue May 04, 2010 11:18 am
Location: Grafton, Ma
Motorcycle: 1983 GL1100Aspencade
1977 GL1000 Goldwing

Re: Dyna Beads in front tire - now a low speed wobble

Postby mpj220 » Thu Jun 10, 2010 7:16 pm

Yep, the weight is there.

The wobble is only hands off on deceleration at 40mph. Let me stress - hands off. If I even keep a hand resting on the grips - there is no wobble.
It seems I may be chasing something that is just inherent in the bike due to it's age.

Or, maybe I was just too spoiled with my '77 wing - that could go from 80 (plus) to 0 - hands off. But, it was naked.

I was just concerned about safety. I was thinking that if I were to take my hands off the bars to send that text (while lighting a cigar) - That wobble could pose a road hazard :shock:

I will see how things go this weekend - leaving around 6am tomorrow morning. Fingers are crossed for good weather.

Thanks for the info!!

elaijah1
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Re: Dyna Beads in front tire - now a low speed wobble

Postby elaijah1 » Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:49 pm

lol!!!!!!!!thats to funny and just keep your hands on the bar! lolololololo!!!

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littlebeaver
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Re: Dyna Beads in front tire - now a low speed wobble

Postby littlebeaver » Sat Jun 12, 2010 12:59 am

I would stick with the old fashion balancing method, use the wheel weights...I would bet that your rear wheel is out of balance. You can get a cheap balancer on ebay for the price the shop will charge you because they are so high these days.. If you are unsure how to balance them I would go to Youtube and see how, I did it a year ago and I never looked back man...Now I change my own and balance them...More Better That Kind...really I'm sure the guys at the shop are good but sometimes their bosses are yelling to hurry up and they get rushed...If you do it yourself I'm certain you will do the best job at it and you will feel really great after you finish and everything is perfect...Littlebeaver




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