Rough shifting issue question.


Information and questions on GL1100 Goldwings (1980-1983)
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processing
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Rough shifting issue question.

Postby processing » Mon Jun 06, 2016 3:14 am



Hello everyone.
I have put about 400 miles on my bike after carb rebuild (and being very happy) and noticed the transmision is acting funny. It seems to me that "stoppers" (if there are any) between gears are not working. When i up shift from say 1 to 2 I hit and feel the teeth of the gear (probably the teeth of the second gear or maybe the third one?). That happens almost every the time i upshift except for the fifth. When I downshift it happens less but there is always rather noisy "metallic clinking sound" which I don't think should be there. It does not seems to happen when I try to upshift very fast and go crazy. It somehow finds the right position... Sometimes when the engine is hot - after about 30 minutes of driving the shifting symptoms are more apparent. On a few occasions I couldn't upshift from 3 to 4 gear, particularly when I'm trying to be gentle. It just doesn't engage. Sometimes, when I stop, I can't find the neutral between 1 and 2 gear. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thanks Peter



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Re: Rough shifting issue question.

Postby maintainer » Mon Jun 06, 2016 7:36 am

Sounds like you need to adjust the clutch cable. Also possibly adjust the idle speed, if idle speed is too high it will be difficult to find neutral or get the light to illuminate.
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Re: Rough shifting issue question.

Postby aj1500 » Mon Jun 06, 2016 7:44 am

you don't want to shift slowly, you don't want to slam it either but you should shift quick and firmly
you need to find that right rpm range to get the smoothest shift,most of the time around 2500 to 3000 also if you pre-load the shifter right before shifting it will go smoother
by pre load you gently apply pressure in the direction of the shift right before pulling the clutch and then just pull the clutch and finish the shift
quickly. when down shifting a slight blip of the throttle right as you shift will help smooth it down
finding neutral is just something you have to find the trick to as it's a bit different on every bike, I find just sort of rocking the shifter is the best way but I have heal toe shifter set up

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Re: Rough shifting issue question.

Postby Maz » Mon Jun 06, 2016 12:24 pm

I'm not sure what bike you have and whether it has cable or hydraulic clutch but, either way, this sounds like typical clutch drag. In other words the clutch is not fully disengaging.
If it's cable, then it needs adjusting. If the cable is already adjusted correctly, then it could need adjusting at the pushrod (if your bike has this adjuster). If it's hydraulic then it may need bleeding.
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Re: Rough shifting issue question.

Postby processing » Mon Jun 06, 2016 1:12 pm

I have a bowden and a very small free play on the clutch lever so when i engage the clutch i basically use the longest travel to disengage the clutch. I am not sure if my bike has the push rod adjuster. It has two nuts on the lever on the engine and I adjusted them so i have the most pull on the lever. I am not sure if it is draging. ... thanks for the feedback

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Re: Rough shifting issue question.

Postby Maz » Mon Jun 06, 2016 2:23 pm

processing wrote:I have a bowden and a very small free play on the clutch lever so when i engage the clutch i basically use the longest travel to disengage the clutch. I am not sure if my bike has the push rod adjuster. It has two nuts on the lever on the engine and I adjusted them so i have the most pull on the lever. I am not sure if it is draging. ... thanks for the feedback


When idling in neutral, pull clutch in and select first gear. Does the bike feel like it wants to creep forward? If you now try to select neutral, is it easy to select? Select first gear again but now switch off engine. Is neutral now easier to select?
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Re: Rough shifting issue question.

Postby processing » Mon Jun 06, 2016 3:44 pm

I am going to try it. But YES, if i select the first gear the bike wants to creep forward in 95 % of all cases. But the major issue is that when I ride and upshift I feel the teeth of the next gear - if I shift reasonably slow. Not when I shift fast. AND when I downshift i hear metal sound - less when I use a blib of gas when downshifting....I also try to use pre loading (gently applying pressure in the direction of the shift right before pulling the clutch) when upshifting or downshifting ...it is better but not much.....

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Re: Rough shifting issue question.

Postby WingAdmin » Mon Jun 06, 2016 6:09 pm

processing wrote:I am going to try it. But YES, if i select the first gear the bike wants to creep forward in 95 % of all cases. But the major issue is that when I ride and upshift I feel the teeth of the next gear - if I shift reasonably slow. Not when I shift fast. AND when I downshift i hear metal sound - less when I use a blib of gas when downshifting....I also try to use pre loading (gently applying pressure in the direction of the shift right before pulling the clutch) when upshifting or downshifting ...it is better but not much.....


This is absolutely a symptom of a clutch that is not fully releasing. The first thing to do is as others have suggested here, adjust the cable on your clutch - extend the adjuster to tighten the cable up a bit.

If adjusting the clutch cable doesn't fix the problem, you may have a problem with the clutch itself (broken pieces inside).

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Re: Rough shifting issue question.

Postby processing » Tue Jun 07, 2016 12:51 am

Thank you. I will try to tighten the cable more...Peter

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Re: Rough shifting issue question.

Postby processing » Tue Jun 07, 2016 12:55 am

One more thing.. English is not my first language so I may have misunderstand the "creep" forward thing. When I shift the first gear it kind of jerks /jumps forward but just a little bit. Does creeping mean that she wants to actually keep going forward even when the clutch is pulled all the way in? If so that doesn't happen here. Slight jerk forward I feel when I shift the first gear in 95 % times.....

just making sure
Peter

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Re: Rough shifting issue question.

Postby Maz » Tue Jun 07, 2016 4:09 am

processing wrote:One more thing.. English is not my first language so I may have misunderstand the "creep" forward thing. When I shift the first gear it kind of jerks /jumps forward but just a little bit. Does creeping mean that she wants to actually keep going forward even when the clutch is pulled all the way in? If so that doesn't happen here. Slight jerk forward I feel when I shift the first gear in 95 % times.....

just making sure
Peter


Peter,

your English is perfect. Yes, when I said creeping, I meant does the bike feel like it wants to move forward with the clutch pulled in. A slight jerk, when selecting first gear from neutral, is normal. As I previously mentioned, if it easy to select neutral from first gear when not moving, then the clutch is probably NOT dragging.
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Re: Rough shifting issue question.

Postby aj1500 » Tue Jun 07, 2016 8:19 am

it does sound like your clutch might need adjusting, where does it grab when you slowly let it out in gear, it should be about 3/4 travel I think it is with a cable style, someone correct me if I'm off on that (been a while since I've had a cable clutch)
when was the last oil change and what weight oil are you using. I know on my bike the oil makes a big difference in clutch performance
I can tell if I need an oil change early because it will start shifting noisy

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Re: Rough shifting issue question.

Postby processing » Wed Jun 08, 2016 7:44 am

I played with the clutch cable and tightened it much more. I have no free play in the clutch lever now. It seemed a little better at first but then not really. The clutch is not sliping in the but I think I should have free play at least a little bit. I also did some reading about the oil versus wet clutch issues. I use synthetic. I know now that it is possible that synthetic oil will make the clutch act funny. But does that concern only slippage? Or may it lubricate somehow too much levers and springs and stuff inside the transmission and then cause it not to disengage properly? First thing tomorrow I will try to change the oil to regular 10-40 hopefully it will help. guys on this blog are also using diesel oil. I'm assuming diesel oilfor light trucks. Should I try? Make sense to me now. I guess this is my last chance if this wont help I I begin to think that I have a transmission issue. :(
Thanks everyone for help. Any ideas at all please let me know
Peter

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Re: Rough shifting issue question.

Postby aj1500 » Wed Jun 08, 2016 10:10 am

I use 15w40 oil and have in all my Wings, I highly recommend the 15w40 weight oil
I use a synthetic blend but the regular dino oil works good as well
maybe a good oil change will help but the grinding is not a good thing

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Re: Rough shifting issue question.

Postby processing » Sun Jun 12, 2016 2:22 am

hello again,
so I did change the oil and its a lot better I must say the kind of grinding noise in the clutch disappeared thanks God. I'm very careful when shifting and it's definitely better than before. So I hope she will brake in with the new oil and we ll have a happy relationship for many years to come :D
thanks everyone for help Peter

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Re: Rough shifting issue question.

Postby Old Fogey » Mon Jun 13, 2016 10:19 pm

There is an adjuster inside the clutch cover that is the first place to adjust.
Slacken all you external adjusters off
Remove the cap from the centre of the clutch cover.
You will see an adjusting screw and locknut.
Undo the locknut and turn the adjuster in until it contacts
Back it off about 1/2 - 3/4 turn.
Put the cap back on and take up most of the cable slack at the operating arm adjuster
Then adjust at the handlebar lever to give about an 1/8" / 3mm free play


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