Too much oil? HELP wanted


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ApplecoreR6
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Too much oil? HELP wanted

Post by ApplecoreR6 » Mon Sep 18, 2017 4:27 pm



    HELP, did I overdo on my oil? I added some due to losing a lot of oil and once filled it seemed to be over the line, is also doesn't want to stay running when on, even with the choke it still wants to die here's a link to the video of it running,

    Please let me know what you think is going on






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    newday777
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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by newday777 » Mon Sep 18, 2017 7:13 pm

    Did you pull the spark plugs and inspect them yet?

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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by ApplecoreR6 » Mon Sep 18, 2017 9:04 pm

    I did inspect the spark plugs, they looked foul and they were wet except for one that was foul but dry. I'm going to purchase new plugs tomorrow to see if it happens to be misfiring, which I'm not too certain, the loud popping in the video is mainly coming from the right exhaust

    Let me add that when starting it I pull the choke to let it warm up, but 6-7 seconds RPMs go down and the bike dies.

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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by ApplecoreR6 » Mon Sep 18, 2017 9:39 pm

    Also, I've been playing with electrical on the wiring harness, which needs a ground for signals and headlight to function , with that my battery has been draining quite quick for some reason so I've had to jump start the bike a couple of times. just wondering if me playing with the electrical system could cause anything?

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    flash2002
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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by flash2002 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 5:11 am

    It sounds like you need a good carb cleaning and adjustment. Did you change spark plugs, you might have cross the wires.

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    newday777
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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by newday777 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 6:38 am

    With plugs out, spin motor over with kill switch off and see if liquid comes out of plug holes. Caution put rags over plug holes as if liquid squirts out it shoots far.
    If liquid comes out you probably have a blown head gasket.

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    newday777
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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by newday777 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 6:40 am

    As to too much oil, it will foam if too high and not properly lube the heads/cam bearings and cook them.

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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by ApplecoreR6 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 7:00 am

    Okay I will try these things tonight, I'll keep you posted

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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by ApplecoreR6 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 8:00 am

    newday777 wrote:
    Tue Sep 19, 2017 6:38 am
    With plugs out, spin motor over with kill switch off and see if liquid comes out of plug holes. Caution put rags over plug holes as if liquid squirts out it shoots far.
    If liquid comes out you probably have a blown head gasket.
    The night before I accidently left the petcock open and I came out in the morning and noticed and shut it off, would that cause this?

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    newday777
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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by newday777 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 8:53 am

    Yes if the floats stick open it can drain the tank into the cylinders and into crank case (eventually)

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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by ApplecoreR6 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 9:42 am

    newday777 wrote:
    Tue Sep 19, 2017 8:53 am
    Yes if the floats stick open it can drain the tank into the cylinders and into crank case (eventually)
    Okay what options do I have? Tonight I will be pulling all plugs and crank it over and see if anything comes out, I'm hoping it's not in the crankcase :oops:

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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by thrasherg » Tue Sep 19, 2017 10:27 am

    if gas is in the crankcase, you really just need to perform an oil change, nothing else is really needed. It does sound like the carbs could do with a good clean and overhaul, if it is leaking gasoline through the carbs, then don't forget to turn the gas off every time you stop the engine (until you clean the carbs and fix the issue). If you remove the plugs and gasoline spits out when you crank the engine, then do not try starting the engine until you have changed the engine oil, gasoline is not a good lubricant and it could damage your engine if it was to be started, also Gasoline explodes so again, it's not a good idea to start an engine that has gasoline inside the engine!!

    Gary

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    flash2002
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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by flash2002 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 10:52 am

    He has a GL1100, I don't think the gas would flood the carbs if the electric pump wasn't running and going up hill would it ? I had a GL1000 with mechanical pump and it never flooded so I'm not sure about electric.

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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by newday777 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:53 am

    1100 doesn't have an electric pump. 1200 and up yes.
    flash2002 wrote:
    Tue Sep 19, 2017 10:52 am
    He has a GL1100, I don't think the gas would flood the carbs if the electric pump wasn't running and going up hill would it ? I had a GL1000 with mechanical pump and it never flooded so I'm not sure about electric.

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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by flash2002 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 12:26 pm

    newday777 wrote:
    Tue Sep 19, 2017 11:53 am
    1100 doesn't have an electric pump. 1200 and up yes.
    flash2002 wrote:
    Tue Sep 19, 2017 10:52 am
    He has a GL1100, I don't think the gas would flood the carbs if the electric pump wasn't running and going up hill would it ? I had a GL1000 with mechanical pump and it never flooded so I'm not sure about electric.
    So, if it's a mechanical pump which is below the carbs, how does the gas go up hill. I understand my Valkyrie with the tank on top of the carbs on the bottom gas will flow down hill. I'm just trying to understand , if a pump is not working, how does the gas fill the carbs unless the tank is under pressure.

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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by ApplecoreR6 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 2:52 pm

    UPDATE: Pulled all spark plugs and cylinder labeled ENG 2 was spitting gasoline out (petcock has been closed since yesterday)

    I also pulled a bit of oil to inspect it and it smelled of gasoline, so would my problem be with one of the carb floats? If so ENG2?

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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by flash2002 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 3:19 pm

    If you don't want any problems, pull the carbs, clean and rebuild them.

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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by thrasherg » Tue Sep 19, 2017 4:53 pm

    I don't know where everyone is getting the "gas flowing uphill from", even though the gas tank is under the seat, it is still above the level of the carbs when the tank is full, so fuel will easily siphon from the tank through the carbs and into the cylinder if the float valves are not closing correctly. the type of fuel pump is irrelevant. The fuel pump is there to ensure a good supply of fuel whether the tank is full or empty, but siphoning will happen regardless of the tank level, it's just a slow flow but left overnight will easily drain your gas tank into the cylinders!! the only way to prevent it is to either fix the float valves or turn the fuel tap off.

    Gary

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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by ApplecoreR6 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 5:02 pm

    thrasherg wrote:
    Tue Sep 19, 2017 4:53 pm
    I don't know where everyone is getting the "gas flowing uphill from", even though the gas tank is under the seat, it is still above the level of the carbs when the tank is full, so fuel will easily siphon from the tank through the carbs and into the cylinder if the float valves are not closing correctly. the type of fuel pump is irrelevant. The fuel pump is there to ensure a good supply of fuel whether the tank is full or empty, but siphoning will happen regardless of the tank level, it's just a slow flow but left overnight will easily drain your gas tank into the cylinders!! the only way to prevent it is to either fix the float valves or turn the fuel tap off.

    Gary
    You are right, my oil smells like gasoline so I'm going to drain the oil soon, does anyone know what size thread the oil drain bolt is? Mine is completely messed up (lost a battle against a curb) :oops:

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    newday777
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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by newday777 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 5:46 pm

    Rebuild all the carbs at the same time. Buy a Randakks Master carb rebuild kit. They are expensive for a reason. Many use the cheap kits and get the results you have, Cheap kits come with cheap float valves. Honda float valves and the Randakks kit are the only float valve and kit to use if you want to do it once.


    Drain bolt size is M14 x 1.5

    If threads in the pan are damaged use a Timesert not a helicoil.
    http://www.timesert.com/
    ApplecoreR6 wrote:
    Tue Sep 19, 2017 5:02 pm
    thrasherg wrote:
    Tue Sep 19, 2017 4:53 pm
    I don't know where everyone is getting the "gas flowing uphill from", even though the gas tank is under the seat, it is still above the level of the carbs when the tank is full, so fuel will easily siphon from the tank through the carbs and into the cylinder if the float valves are not closing correctly. the type of fuel pump is irrelevant. The fuel pump is there to ensure a good supply of fuel whether the tank is full or empty, but siphoning will happen regardless of the tank level, it's just a slow flow but left overnight will easily drain your gas tank into the cylinders!! the only way to prevent it is to either fix the float valves or turn the fuel tap off.

    Gary
    You are right, my oil smells like gasoline so I'm going to drain the oil soon, does anyone know what size thread the oil drain bolt is? Mine is completely messed up (lost a battle against a curb) :oops:

    ApplecoreR6
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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by ApplecoreR6 » Tue Sep 19, 2017 7:04 pm

    newday777 wrote:
    Tue Sep 19, 2017 5:46 pm
    Rebuild all the carbs at the same time. Buy a Randakks Master carb rebuild kit. They are expensive for a reason. Many use the cheap kits and get the results you have, Cheap kits come with cheap float valves. Honda float valves and the Randakks kit are the only float valve and kit to use if you want to do it once.


    Drain bolt size is M14 x 1.5

    If threads in the pan are damaged use a Timesert not a helicoil.
    http://www.timesert.com/
    ApplecoreR6 wrote:
    Tue Sep 19, 2017 5:02 pm
    thrasherg wrote:
    Tue Sep 19, 2017 4:53 pm
    I don't know where everyone is getting the "gas flowing uphill from", even though the gas tank is under the seat, it is still above the level of the carbs when the tank is full, so fuel will easily siphon from the tank through the carbs and into the cylinder if the float valves are not closing correctly. the type of fuel pump is irrelevant. The fuel pump is there to ensure a good supply of fuel whether the tank is full or empty, but siphoning will happen regardless of the tank level, it's just a slow flow but left overnight will easily drain your gas tank into the cylinders!! the only way to prevent it is to either fix the float valves or turn the fuel tap off.

    Gary
    You are right, my oil smells like gasoline so I'm going to drain the oil soon, does anyone know what size thread the oil drain bolt is? Mine is completely messed up (lost a battle against a curb) :oops:
    Thank you for that size, I've been delayed and will do the drain this Thursday I will keep you posted

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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by newday777 » Wed Sep 20, 2017 4:14 am

    you scroll down to the master carb kit

    https://www.randakks.com/honda-gl-1100.html?p=1

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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by ApplecoreR6 » Wed Sep 20, 2017 8:30 am

    newday777 wrote:
    Wed Sep 20, 2017 4:14 am
    you scroll down to the master carb kit

    https://www.randakks.com/honda-gl-1100.html?p=1
    Thanks for the link, I will be draining oil once I find a new drain bolt, then I'll start doing the carbs

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    Re: How does my gasoline get into crankcase?

    Post by ApplecoreR6 » Wed Sep 20, 2017 8:56 am

    Does anyone know how the gasoline gets into the crankcase ? The oil does smell like gasoline, just wondering how it's getting through? Are the rings bad? Or are the rings not rotated and oposite of each other?

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    thrasherg
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    Re: Too much oil? HELP wanted

    Post by thrasherg » Wed Sep 20, 2017 11:50 am

    The usual method is petrol will leak from the tank into the carb, overflow the carb (float valves leaking/sticking) and then flow into the cylinder inlet tract, from there it flows past any open inlet valves into the cylinders (usually the left hand side cylinders, as the bike is probably on its side stand), once in the cylinders it starts to pool and collect. However the rings on the pistons do have gaps and fuel has a very low viscosity so if it is left for 12 hours some fuel will find it's way past the rings and into the crankcase, this is completely normal and does NOT indicate that your rings are worn (but they could be!!). The gasoline then gets absorb by the oil and starts to weaken the lubrication capability of the oil and you get a smell of gasoline from the engine oil. As stated the only real way to fix it is to prevent the carbs from leaking in the first place and that means several hours dismantling them, cleaning them and replacing any worn parts and valves!!

    Gary



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