no spark


Information and questions on GL1200 Goldwings (1984-1987)
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Lucky713
Posts: 26
Joined: Fri Dec 31, 2010 1:26 am
Location: DeWitt, Mi
Motorcycle: 1986 GL1200 Aspencade SEI

no spark

Postby Lucky713 » Thu Nov 01, 2012 9:45 pm



Ok....if you have read my prior post you will see that my bike will not start. It cranks over just fine, but I am getting no spark at all. Pulled one of the plugs, and nothing. It acts like you have hit the kill swtich. I have double checked the kill switch, and that is not it. I have also checked all the fuses and everything is good there. I replaced the regulator/rectifier 2 springs ago. The fall before I replaced it the bike was acting if someone had hit the kill switch. The regulator rectifier was bought from an aftermarket supplier on line. Is it possible that the Regulator/Rectifier has gone bad in just 2 years?? One thing to note is the last time I turned the bike off I had a whinning noise that sounded like a fan was running. I couldnt figure it out so I disconnected the battery to see if that solved the problem. As you can imagine, it kept on making the noise. It sounded like it was coming from the left side of the engine.(IE: Regulator/rectifier side) I'm thinking now that the whinning noise was the regulator/rectifier going. Can anyone confirm that they have had a similar thing happen or heard of something similar?



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dingdong
Posts: 2865
Joined: Thu Apr 08, 2010 8:35 am
Location: Oklahoma City
Motorcycle: 1976 gl1000
1993 gl1500
2004 NRX1800 Rune

Re: no spark

Postby dingdong » Fri Nov 02, 2012 7:02 am

One question. Do you mean that after you turned the bike off it was still making the noise and even after you disconnected the battery the noise was still there? Not sure what you mean.
Tom

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

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feetup
Posts: 100
Joined: Mon Jun 29, 2009 1:15 pm
Location: West Coast of Canada
Motorcycle: 84 GL 1200I
75 GL 1000 (in pieces)
'02 Gas Gas Trials
'56 Norton 600

Re: no spark

Postby feetup » Fri Nov 02, 2012 10:59 am

The Regulator/rectifier is connected to the spark only as a distant cousin. Yes it is part of the system for providing the current needed for the coils to build the spark but only that.
The ignition system consists of four components. First is the signal generator which is behind your timing belt covers, right next to the crankshaft. It does exactly what the name implies, it makes a signal that tells when the spark is to happen. The next is the ignition module, under the shelter ahead of the air cleaner. I receives the tiny signal from the signal generators and amplifies it large enough for the coils to use, and also adjusts the timing advance both for rpm and throttle setting ( vacuum ). It does a few other things as well. Next are the coils which take a 12 volt, high amp current from the bikes' supply, ground it through ignition module and turn it into a low current, several thousand volt burst and sends that to the last component, the spark plugs, by way of the high tension (or plug) leads. The reg/rect really isn't a part of this, and if your engine cranks over with any kind of vigor, you have enough voltage in your battery to run the ignition system.

There are tests you can perform to at least measure your signal generators' resistance which will tell you if they have shorted or have an open circuit (they are little more than a fine wire coil and a magnet). This test will be in the manual. There are measurements that can be taken of the spark plug caps, high tension leads and coils, also in the manual, and you can check whether there is the proper power in the proper wires to your ignition module, and coils. If all these things check out, you would have to suspect the module itself.

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86pearlblue
Posts: 100
Joined: Sat Sep 22, 2012 6:04 pm
Location: Hartford, Connecticut
Motorcycle: 1986 gl1200a

Re: no spark

Postby 86pearlblue » Fri Nov 02, 2012 11:49 am

There may also be an issue with various interlocks which may kill the spark. Kickstand, neutral and clutch switches, for example. Modern ignition coils are also susceptible to failing with multiple heat/cool cycles. Wires in the coil try to expand/ contract and can't due to the fact that they are encapsulated in a resin epoxy.

Ghostrider52005
Posts: 124
Joined: Sun Dec 20, 2009 7:19 pm
Location: Olive Hill Kentucky
Motorcycle: 1985 GL 1200 LTD, 1984 GL1200 Interstate, VS 700 Suzuki Intruder.

Re: no spark

Postby Ghostrider52005 » Fri Nov 02, 2012 9:42 pm

The whineing noise your speaking of has my interest. Though im not really clear on what you mean. You turned off the bike and with key off you still had a whining noise? And it kept up while you disconnected the battery and then kept whining after there was no power to the bike?? How long did it keep whining after you disconnected the battery?? And did does it still do it or only that once?
Sei and LTD are basically the same bike. If you have as much as 10 volts available the bike will run charging not charging bad voltage reg or not. at around 9.3 it will die. Dont ask how I know :lol:

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86pearlblue
Posts: 100
Joined: Sat Sep 22, 2012 6:04 pm
Location: Hartford, Connecticut
Motorcycle: 1986 gl1200a

Re: no spark

Postby 86pearlblue » Sat Nov 03, 2012 8:05 am

My '86 made a similar noise. Tracked it to vacuum in the fuel tank. When I opened the cap, noise stopped.

pudd750
Posts: 112
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2011 2:23 am
Location: wacousta Mi
Motorcycle: 1986 GL1200 interstate
1980 GN400
1979 CB750
1996 1200 Sportster
1961 T120R sold
1975 Norton sold
1972 Moto Guzzi 750
1976 Goldwing sold
1972 SL125 sold
Honda Fat Cat
RD350 sold

Re: no spark

Postby pudd750 » Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:39 am

Freddie Kling, master Honda (GL) wrench always suspects harness connections first - well, not ALWAYS always, but a lot- if virgin/never lubed, look for less than bright brass connectors and green oxidation, and dont use dielectric grease in them - the ignition switch connector is hanging in the fairing tunnel,

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Lucky713
Posts: 26
Joined: Fri Dec 31, 2010 1:26 am
Location: DeWitt, Mi
Motorcycle: 1986 GL1200 Aspencade SEI

Re: no spark

Postby Lucky713 » Thu Nov 08, 2012 10:50 pm

The whinnig noise was when the bike was running. I couldnt figure out what it was. I turned off the bike and it was still doing it. therefore I disconnected the battery and it was still doing it. I dont know how long it did it, because I had to get somewhere with my kids. by the time I got home it had stopped. have no idea what the hell that was all about. If anyone wants to buy a project bike cheap, I'm ready to sell this dam thing. I have not been able to get through an entire season without something going wrong. first year it was the reg/rec. Next season it was the battery, and then the starter. This past summer I replaced the thermostat in the spring. everything was fine all summer long, and then in august the temp started shooting up again. So I had just replaced the thermostat for the 2nd time this summer. I was trying to run the bike to get the air out of the cooling system. it started and ran for a few minutes and then quit. I started it again. ran for a few minutes and then quit. tried to start it a 3rd time, and it only ran for a few seconds. After that it wouldnt start at all. thought originally it was the fuel. its getting fuel because I can smell it flooding. checked the spark and nothing. I've had it, and I'm tired of tracking crab down twice a season on thie dam bike. Its a really nice looking bike. I'm serous about selling the dam thing. Want to get a newer bike will far less problems. Would really like to be able to ride all season without something going wrong. I feel like I would have better luck with a Harley at this point, and I know they are known for having mechanical problems.

pudd750
Posts: 112
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2011 2:23 am
Location: wacousta Mi
Motorcycle: 1986 GL1200 interstate
1980 GN400
1979 CB750
1996 1200 Sportster
1961 T120R sold
1975 Norton sold
1972 Moto Guzzi 750
1976 Goldwing sold
1972 SL125 sold
Honda Fat Cat
RD350 sold

Re: no spark

Postby pudd750 » Fri Nov 09, 2012 12:27 am

is that 2 tone gold bike in your avatar the bike in question? this is unbelievable (tho i do believe you) my bike is an 86 I and its been a rock - tires, forks, rear shocks (high miles) but in 10 years ive had it, its always ran - early 6 cylinder wings burn up the center pistons? be careful buying used- hate to see you give up (but, id be ready to buy a stick of dinomite for the old girl too) before her miracle

Dan1985
Posts: 9
Joined: Tue Jan 05, 2010 12:41 am
Location: Canby, OR
Motorcycle: 1985 GL1200 LTD
1998 GL1500 SE

Re: no spark

Postby Dan1985 » Sun Nov 11, 2012 4:16 am

You have the 1986 SEi, which is almost Idential to the 1985 LTD, different color. Read on, this may be of use to you. You have under the trunk,
your fuel injection control CFI computer, which does many things. It for one sends a signal for the spark for each bank 1&3, 2&4 at the proper time. It needs to know where the crank is for these signals. It comes from the Crank position (Ns) sensor behind the timing belts, next to the crank pulley. These are know to go bad, I just experienced this on a LTD I just purchased that has a spark problem. If no signal from the Ns sensor, you will get NO SPARK at the plugs.
First try to start the bike, if it does and then dies, BEFORE YOU TURN THE KEY OFF, look under the trunk at the left hand side of the computer, look to see if any LEDs are on. From Left to Right they are labeled (3-2-1-0-W), If 3 & 0 are flashing AND W is solid, the LED's are telling you the Ns sensor (crank Position sensor) at the crank pulley is bad. NOTE: the 3 & possibly 2 LED may be hidden with the mounting bracket. Look in your GL1200 LTD supplement Manual, PG 10-6, you will find the chart, that little computer has a mind of its own, USE IT to your advantage. Page 10-27 will tell you how to check the sensor. The resistance measurement should be 297-363 ohms, if not, bad luck. I removed my timing belt covers, plus the radiator to get to the Ns sensor, I used a heat gun to heat the sensor just a little bit, I had an Ohm meter connected to the two wires up at the connector shown in the book, just in front of the voltage regulator, look you will see the white connector with two wires. Disconnect this connector
to check your resistance. As I gave the sensor a little heat, the ohm meter showed me an open circuit, lost its reading. BINGO, BAD Sensor, thats why
the bike ran for a few minutes then died. You need a new sensor.
Now that you may have zeroed in on your problem, more bad and possibly good news. The sensor (Ns) (30300-MG9-951) is now longer available from Honda, OBSOLETE. I ran a dealer check for the part, no luck on a new replacement. BUT, A dealer in Hendersonville, NC / Shroaders Honda (Tele: (828)693-4101 will repair yours with a substitue sensor. Your will need to send your sensor with wire harness to them, cost $150 Plus S/H, vs the original around $50. OUCH
Your other option is to get one off Ebay, Which very seldom come up for action, sellers let it go with a complete running engine. I see one on auction at $175 USED at the present. I have sent mine to Shroaders, for a new replacement. They claim they have been doing this for about a year with no problems with the substitue, so they claim. ??? Mine is due back this week around Friday, I hope.
This is my 3rd 1985 LTD, I enjoy picking them up giving them new life and turning them around, with a little profit in my pocket. This and the 86SEi
are in my book, a great choice in an older very reliable bike well ahead of its time. HOW EVER certin parts are getting scare and hard to get at times. Especially the sensors. I have found most of the Goldwing electrical components are very rugged, but they do fail at times.
I also have a 1998 SE, which is also a great rider for long distance, BUT I DO MISS THE FUEL INJECTION, along with the lighter bike of around 100+ lbs.
From Canby, OR / a retired daily rider, 12 months, rain or shine, hot or cold, night or day, but I will not put chains or studed tires on for that suicide ride. Other wise, I am grounded when snow and Ice are present, which may only be a couple weeks in the winter, in the Willamette Valley here in Oregon.

Hope this helps solve your problem, or at least zero in on it.
If I can be of further help let me know.

pudd750
Posts: 112
Joined: Sat Sep 03, 2011 2:23 am
Location: wacousta Mi
Motorcycle: 1986 GL1200 interstate
1980 GN400
1979 CB750
1996 1200 Sportster
1961 T120R sold
1975 Norton sold
1972 Moto Guzzi 750
1976 Goldwing sold
1972 SL125 sold
Honda Fat Cat
RD350 sold

Re: no spark

Postby pudd750 » Sun Nov 11, 2012 11:24 am

ther ya go- no spark on a 3.1 buick is almost automatically the CPS- they are also known to go bad and the new one i put in was bad too- 2nd one was good-




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