1984 engine idle speed increase with temperature


Information and questions on GL1200 Goldwings (1984-1987)
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Owl
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2015 6:35 am
Location: Russia
Motorcycle: 1984 GL1200A Aspencade

1984 engine idle speed increase with temperature

Postby Owl » Sat Jun 11, 2016 4:12 am



Hi, there is problem with my Aspencade 1984. When the coolant temp inrease to fan on, the engine idle speed become higher, from 1000 up to 1500-1600. When the temp becomes lower - idle speed slowly fall down to 1200-1300. Also, the idle speed is not very smooth, like one cylinder works with faults. Carburators was repaired, syncronized. I guess, the problem is in igniter unit, can it be something else?



flash1942
Posts: 129
Joined: Fri Jan 24, 2014 4:37 pm
Location: Midwest
Motorcycle: '84 Aspencade

Re: 1984 engine idle speed increase with temperature

Postby flash1942 » Sat Jun 11, 2016 9:00 am

Sync your carbs? That may help.

Owl
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2015 6:35 am
Location: Russia
Motorcycle: 1984 GL1200A Aspencade

Re: 1984 engine idle speed increase with temperature

Postby Owl » Sat Jun 11, 2016 9:25 am

flash1942 wrote:Sync your carbs? That may help.

I told it was done already. Carbs are cleaned and synced

froche
Posts: 36
Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2014 1:56 pm
Location: Vista, ca
Motorcycle: 1985 Goldwing Aspencade (GL1200A

Former bikes;
2000 R1100RT
2005 Suzuki Bandit
1979 Yamaha XS1100
1978 Yamaha XS1100 Special
1990 Yamaha XV250
1980 Yamaha XV750
1979 Honda CB750
1968 Triumph Bonneville T120
1973 Honda CB450
1968 Harley Davidson Sportster
1974 Honda CB750
1968 Honda CL72

Re: 1984 engine idle speed increase with temperature

Postby froche » Sat Jun 11, 2016 4:40 pm

Did you see the sync?

It's pretty easy to check, and you can build a manometer pretty cheaply

http://www.powerchutes.com/manometer.asp

http://www.instructables.com/id/DIY-Dua ... Sync-Tool/

That site shows a 2 cylinder, simply double it for a four. Searching Google with the term homemade carburetor balancer show many kinds.

Owl
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2015 6:35 am
Location: Russia
Motorcycle: 1984 GL1200A Aspencade

Re: 1984 engine idle speed increase with temperature

Postby Owl » Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:04 am

froche wrote:Did you see the sync?


Do you think the problem in carbs? Cause i did the sync at technical service of motodealer, i have no reasons don't trust them

froche
Posts: 36
Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2014 1:56 pm
Location: Vista, ca
Motorcycle: 1985 Goldwing Aspencade (GL1200A

Former bikes;
2000 R1100RT
2005 Suzuki Bandit
1979 Yamaha XS1100
1978 Yamaha XS1100 Special
1990 Yamaha XV250
1980 Yamaha XV750
1979 Honda CB750
1968 Triumph Bonneville T120
1973 Honda CB450
1968 Harley Davidson Sportster
1974 Honda CB750
1968 Honda CL72

Re: 1984 engine idle speed increase with temperature

Postby froche » Sun Jun 12, 2016 11:49 am

I had a problem with my 1985 Aspencade with 118K. When starting from cold it ran OK but needed full choke to start and stumbled from 1200 to 1500 through 2500 to 3000 when slowly advancing the throttle, even after taking the choke off (2 bars on temp scale).

I asked on the boards, searched on the old messages and found myself corresponding with a carb expert (40 years or so working, among others American Honda) who in over 60 emails suggested diagnosing steps and his responses and my trying things disposed of some problems etc.

The bike, before fixing, ran so smooth (except for the stumble) and I bought it from the original owner who had never missed any service ever that I was sure the carbs were synced.

So I purchased a Carbtune and found that all the carbs were set differently so were not in sync. So I synced them and tried it, a little better...

Then I shimmed the main jet needles and resynced them after closing the idle mixture and reopening them to 2 1/2 turns (recommended as a start), then I synced them again and found 2 1/2 worked fine for 3 of the 4, 1 needed to be about 3/4 of a turn (I forget if it was in or out) different than the others...

When I closed each idle mixture I counted the turns and found the left front carb was turned out almost twice as much as the others, so closing them counting the turns found another problem which was then was corrected.

So I asked if you saw the sync because unless you really trust the dealership or servicing company, and their assigning an experienced mechanic, I would wonder why they "synched" the carbs and returned it to you with the idle problem you described.

So unless the bike was:
1) Stored long enough to build up varnish in the carbs, since they synced the carbs.
or
2) Was not synced properly
or
3) Couldn't be synced properly, so they made it run as best as they could
or
Another reason I haven't thought of;
The sync is one of the potential reasons that the idle seems erratic to you, and should be checked as you try to diagnose and fix the problem(s) that you asked opinions for.

Owl
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2015 6:35 am
Location: Russia
Motorcycle: 1984 GL1200A Aspencade

Re: 1984 engine idle speed increase with temperature

Postby Owl » Sun Jun 12, 2016 12:23 pm

froche wrote:I had a problem with my 1985 Aspencade with 118K. When starting from cold it ran OK but needed full choke to start and stumbled from 1200 to 1500 through 2500 to 3000 when slowly advancing the throttle, even after taking the choke off (2 bars on temp scale).


Thank you, i'll check it

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julimike54
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Location: Euless, Texas
Motorcycle: 1986 GL1200A original owner
2016 HD FLTRU

Re: 1984 engine idle speed increase with temperature

Postby julimike54 » Sat Jun 18, 2016 11:16 am

Any update? :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?:
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Owl
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2015 6:35 am
Location: Russia
Motorcycle: 1984 GL1200A Aspencade

Re: 1984 engine idle speed increase with temperature

Postby Owl » Sat Jun 18, 2016 11:33 am

julimike54 wrote:Any update? :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?:

Yes, I checked the carbs. Sync was in ideal, but carbs need to be adjusted and cleaned. Fourth carb have no reaction for adjustment, needs to repair. So at tuesday mechanic will clean and repair carbs and I will know, was it the one reason or not. Sure I will write here the result

froche
Posts: 36
Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2014 1:56 pm
Location: Vista, ca
Motorcycle: 1985 Goldwing Aspencade (GL1200A

Former bikes;
2000 R1100RT
2005 Suzuki Bandit
1979 Yamaha XS1100
1978 Yamaha XS1100 Special
1990 Yamaha XV250
1980 Yamaha XV750
1979 Honda CB750
1968 Triumph Bonneville T120
1973 Honda CB450
1968 Harley Davidson Sportster
1974 Honda CB750
1968 Honda CL72

Re: 1984 engine idle speed increase with temperature

Postby froche » Sat Jun 18, 2016 7:41 pm

Owl wrote:
julimike54 wrote:Any update? :?: :?: :?: :?: :?: :?:

Yes, I checked the carbs. Sync was in ideal, but carbs need to be adjusted and cleaned. Fourth carb have no reaction for adjustment, needs to repair. So at tuesday mechanic will clean and repair carbs and I will know, was it the one reason or not. Sure I will write here the result


And earlier "I told it was done already. Carbs are cleaned and synced"

How can a carb that isn't working correctly "in sync"?

And did you pay for them to be adjusted? and synced... they should have told you about the fourth carb rather then syncing them, and leaving them to be needing "carbs need to be adjusted and cleaned. Fourth carb have no reaction for adjustment, needs to repair."

If so what does that tell you about the mechanic?

And once cleaned and adjusted they need to be at least checked for sync, possibly even synced again.

Cleaning the carbs is a fairly involved project, the best kit for cleaning them is http://randakks.com/collections/master- ... erhaul-kit. And Randakks has a list of approved re-builders one of whom is Motorcycle Diagnostics, Stu Oltman, Phoenix, AZ. 408-363-5486. Another guy is Mike Nixon found at http://www.goldwingcarbs.com/... about 450.00.

You have paid somebody to "adjust and sync" and paying again.. I say do it yourself or pay somebody to do it right.

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geraldm
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Location: pumphandle Saskatchewan ,Canada
Motorcycle: 86 gl1200 Aspencade

Re: 1984 engine idle speed increase with temperature

Postby geraldm » Sat Jun 18, 2016 9:18 pm

Not to take anything away from anyone but I doubt there are many mechanics out there these days that are capable of doing a top notch job on these old school carbs ,, not that I can do much better but would sooner be me screwing up and learning instead of paying someone to learn doing my carbs and screwing up and up and up . , a lot of the guys that could do perfect jobs are retired or just tired .
the way I understand it is the sync job is mainly to get that nice smooth non stumbling idle .. once the rpm's are up a bit the diaphragm in the carbs set the higher demands .. just what I was told . also is there a chance that the en-richer lever is not coming of all the way on some or all carbs making for the up down idle you describe . just my 2 c

Owl
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2015 6:35 am
Location: Russia
Motorcycle: 1984 GL1200A Aspencade

Re: 1984 engine idle speed increase with temperature

Postby Owl » Sun Jun 19, 2016 10:52 am

froche wrote:How can a carb that isn't working correctly "in sync"?


It's funny, but i saw it by my own eyes - the sync device shows that all 4 carbs works synced. That mechanic who synced it before (last autumn) told, that cause of incorrect fourth cylinder work is in ignition troubles, thats why first i asked about ignition control block. And this is really big problem to find a good carburetor specialist in our city :( Its a good idea - do all adjustments and repairs by own hands, but i have no place and tools for it.

froche
Posts: 36
Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2014 1:56 pm
Location: Vista, ca
Motorcycle: 1985 Goldwing Aspencade (GL1200A

Former bikes;
2000 R1100RT
2005 Suzuki Bandit
1979 Yamaha XS1100
1978 Yamaha XS1100 Special
1990 Yamaha XV250
1980 Yamaha XV750
1979 Honda CB750
1968 Triumph Bonneville T120
1973 Honda CB450
1968 Harley Davidson Sportster
1974 Honda CB750
1968 Honda CL72

Re: 1984 engine idle speed increase with temperature

Postby froche » Sun Jun 19, 2016 7:10 pm

Well you can send it to one of the guys that know "old school carbs" such as Pistol Petes, or Mike Nixon, expect to pay 400 to 500 for a top job. Or you can do it yourself using Randakk kit and the book he sells, or you can continue to pay your mechanic. Again I would question a mech that can sync 4 carbs with 1 of them making no change....

Owl
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2015 6:35 am
Location: Russia
Motorcycle: 1984 GL1200A Aspencade

Re: 1984 engine idle speed increase with temperature

Postby Owl » Mon Jun 20, 2016 2:16 am

froche wrote:Well you can send it to one of the guys that know "old school carbs" such as Pistol Petes, or Mike Nixon

i guess it will spend too many time and money to send carbs from Russia :D

Owl
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2015 6:35 am
Location: Russia
Motorcycle: 1984 GL1200A Aspencade

Re: 1984 engine idle speed increase with temperature

Postby Owl » Tue Jun 21, 2016 11:22 pm

Thank you buddies for your advices, the problem was the carbs. Black scum on the all jets and small hole in one membrane. Now the engine run good

froche
Posts: 36
Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2014 1:56 pm
Location: Vista, ca
Motorcycle: 1985 Goldwing Aspencade (GL1200A

Former bikes;
2000 R1100RT
2005 Suzuki Bandit
1979 Yamaha XS1100
1978 Yamaha XS1100 Special
1990 Yamaha XV250
1980 Yamaha XV750
1979 Honda CB750
1968 Triumph Bonneville T120
1973 Honda CB450
1968 Harley Davidson Sportster
1974 Honda CB750
1968 Honda CL72

Re: 1984 engine idle speed increase with temperature

Postby froche » Tue Jun 21, 2016 11:27 pm

How did you fix the diaphragm (membrane), the ways to fix them usually fails so replacing them is the only way...

Owl
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2015 6:35 am
Location: Russia
Motorcycle: 1984 GL1200A Aspencade

Re: 1984 engine idle speed increase with temperature

Postby Owl » Tue Jun 21, 2016 11:43 pm

froche wrote:How did you fix the diaphragm (membrane), the ways to fix them usually fails so replacing them is the only way...


The membrane was glued, it's a normal practice here, cause ordering the new one needs too many time. I can't tell you step-by-step how it was done, it was made by mechanic. I know, that it is temporarily solution, but usually it work at least until the wheel season will end

froche
Posts: 36
Joined: Wed Mar 12, 2014 1:56 pm
Location: Vista, ca
Motorcycle: 1985 Goldwing Aspencade (GL1200A

Former bikes;
2000 R1100RT
2005 Suzuki Bandit
1979 Yamaha XS1100
1978 Yamaha XS1100 Special
1990 Yamaha XV250
1980 Yamaha XV750
1979 Honda CB750
1968 Triumph Bonneville T120
1973 Honda CB450
1968 Harley Davidson Sportster
1974 Honda CB750
1968 Honda CL72

Re: 1984 engine idle speed increase with temperature

Postby froche » Tue Jun 21, 2016 11:48 pm

Hope it lasts, if it's a small enough hole and the right glue was used, some last a long time. At least you will get the season out of it.

If you need to replace them look at http://jbmindustries.com/Dimensions.html for replacements. 19.50 (US) each 35.00 shipping (foreign). You do have to replace all 4 at the same time.

Owl
Posts: 12
Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2015 6:35 am
Location: Russia
Motorcycle: 1984 GL1200A Aspencade

Re: 1984 engine idle speed increase with temperature

Postby Owl » Tue Jun 21, 2016 11:53 pm

froche wrote:If you need to replace them look at

thank you




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