Springs


Information and questions on GL1200 Goldwings (1984-1987)
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Rednaxs60
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Location: Victoria, British Columbia, Canada
Motorcycle: 1985 GL1200 LTD, 2008 GL1800

Springs

Postby Rednaxs60 » Tue Jun 14, 2016 9:33 pm



There are a lot of springs in an older and new GW. I have been replacing them as I go because most of them are 32 plus years old and have lost some or a significant amount of the original performance.

I have replaced the timing belt tensioner springs and have found that the new ones adjusted the timing belt idlers more accurately then the old ones.

I finally received the drive shaft spring - the one that is at the u-joint end, and was very surprised by the "set" of the original 32 year old spring when compared to the new spring. The new spring measured 3.25 inches in length, while the old, original spring measure 3.11 inches in length - a difference of 0.140 inch difference. These springs keep the system from moving too much, and I now expect the drive line to be much tighter than before, and perform better. Here is a picture of the springs, old on the right and new on left:


There are several springs in the engine I have thought of looking at since I have the engine out of the bike and have rebuilt the clutch, but I want to ride it this year, so it is going back together.

Cheers


"When you write the story of your life, don't let anyone else hold the pen"

Ernest

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twocams
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Location: Grants Pass, Oregon
Motorcycle: 1985 GL1200 Aspencade, 2003 K1200GT BMW, 1969 R69S BMW
Sold : 84 V65 Magna, 82 Moto Guzzi, XS 1100 Yamaha,84 Wing Int., 80 650 Special, Only new bike 82 XV750 Virago (Guam),Honda 250,84 R100RT BMW,87 K100 LT BMW,93 K1100 LT BMW, 91 535 Virago, Honda 50

Re: Springs

Postby twocams » Tue Jun 14, 2016 11:05 pm

Oh come on, just replace the rest....now. We need to know if it makes the difference.

User avatar
Rednaxs60
Posts: 726
Joined: Wed Nov 18, 2015 12:44 pm
Location: Victoria, British Columbia, Canada
Motorcycle: 1985 GL1200 LTD, 2008 GL1800

Re: Springs

Postby Rednaxs60 » Wed Jun 15, 2016 11:36 am

twocams wrote:Oh come on, just replace the rest....now. We need to know if it makes the difference.


Never Know!! May happen, but not right now. Cheers
"When you write the story of your life, don't let anyone else hold the pen"

Ernest

CrystalPistol
Posts: 261
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2010 9:07 pm
Location: Shenandoah Valley of Virginia
Motorcycle: 1985 GL1200A
1997 GL1500SE Lehman Trike

Re: Springs

Postby CrystalPistol » Sun Jun 19, 2016 11:07 am

Interesting ..... but those little springs on the timing belt tensioners are not there to tension the timing belts ..... they simply pull the tensioner up against the belt as a third hand when the tensioners are being adjusted. If you are relying on the springs to determine the position the tensioners are locked into via the bolt .... you are doing it wrong. You tension the timing belts by measuring deflection.

You could remove the springs and still accurately adjust the tensioners.

That driveshaft spring .... if it's putting pressure against the collar at the snap ring when the shaft is off the bike, it's doing about all it can do. It's just there to push the front U-joint all the way onto the engine/trans output shaft and hold it there so that the U-joint cross is centered between the fear swing arm pivots. In use, those splines don't slide lengthwise, they just transmit torque from shaft to shaft.
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twocams
Posts: 554
Joined: Tue Sep 29, 2015 11:25 am
Location: Grants Pass, Oregon
Motorcycle: 1985 GL1200 Aspencade, 2003 K1200GT BMW, 1969 R69S BMW
Sold : 84 V65 Magna, 82 Moto Guzzi, XS 1100 Yamaha,84 Wing Int., 80 650 Special, Only new bike 82 XV750 Virago (Guam),Honda 250,84 R100RT BMW,87 K100 LT BMW,93 K1100 LT BMW, 91 535 Virago, Honda 50

Re: Springs

Postby twocams » Sun Jun 19, 2016 1:25 pm

I disagree on the spline movement. They may only move a few mm. But every time the differential moves up and down and puts the u-joints at a certain angle, splines will move. If they didnt want them to move they would have bolted them solid to the transmission shaft. just my .02

twocams

CrystalPistol
Posts: 261
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2010 9:07 pm
Location: Shenandoah Valley of Virginia
Motorcycle: 1985 GL1200A
1997 GL1500SE Lehman Trike

Re: Springs

Postby CrystalPistol » Sun Jun 19, 2016 9:21 pm

My point was really just to point out that the strength of that spring or it's relaxed length is not critical. If it's placed under tension when in place behind the snap ring & collar, it's OK.

I agree that .... while the splines may move some little smidgeon between the U-joint rear yoke and drive shaft with suspension movement if the center of the joint cross is not in perfect alignment with the swing arm pivots .... the slightest spring pressure of that spring will keep that front trans side of the U-joint pushed firmly all the way onto the trans output shaft splines and it will not move in use.
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Rednaxs60
Posts: 726
Joined: Wed Nov 18, 2015 12:44 pm
Location: Victoria, British Columbia, Canada
Motorcycle: 1985 GL1200 LTD, 2008 GL1800

Re: Springs

Postby Rednaxs60 » Sun Jun 19, 2016 9:54 pm

I posted this because springs are very misunderstood and can be critical to the effective performance of a/the system. Sort of like seeing a car go down the road like a seesaw, shocks are shot as are the springs. In my former life had to take a course specifically on springs. It was brutal, but gained a lot of insight into the design, application and what they really did.

The other issue for myself is that I am doing work on a 33 year old bike, and would like it to last me for some years. A few renewals such as these small items will go a long way to providing me with some trouble free motoring.

Good to get the intellectual juices flowing with good discussion items such as this though.

Cheers
"When you write the story of your life, don't let anyone else hold the pen"

Ernest

User avatar
Rednaxs60
Posts: 726
Joined: Wed Nov 18, 2015 12:44 pm
Location: Victoria, British Columbia, Canada
Motorcycle: 1985 GL1200 LTD, 2008 GL1800

Re: Springs

Postby Rednaxs60 » Mon Jun 20, 2016 12:11 am

Checked the OEM service manual for the procedure. When the timing belts are tensioned, you use a wrench on the timing gear to tighten the straight (opposite) side of the belt and release the pressure on the idler. This allows the idler spring to properly tension the idler, and then you tighten up the idler. The deflection should be a maximum of 1/8" to 3/16" once this is done. If it is more than new springs should be installed. I surmise that Honda designed the system this way, otherwise there is really no need for an idler tension spring.

Cheers
"When you write the story of your life, don't let anyone else hold the pen"

Ernest

CrystalPistol
Posts: 261
Joined: Wed Mar 10, 2010 9:07 pm
Location: Shenandoah Valley of Virginia
Motorcycle: 1985 GL1200A
1997 GL1500SE Lehman Trike

Re: Springs

Postby CrystalPistol » Mon Jun 20, 2016 9:08 am

The deflection should be a maximum of 1/8" to 3/16"


That's correct .... and that's the standard you are setting it to. The procedure gets you started, the spring acts just like a hand holding it up in place .... but you are adjusting to that deflection. If you tighten it up where the spring pulls it to and don't check deflection, you'll likely hear the belt slapping at idle as it'll be too loose. Get it too tight, it'll sing. If the spring is weak or overly stiff, you'll still lock it down at that deflection if you do it correctly and the spring will just ride along until next time. If the spring is the most perfect of springs, a burr under a bolt's head or surface imperfection alongside the slot is all it would take to change it as you tighten up.

Relying on the spring and not setting it to the correct deflection is like using air to seat a tire on a wheel ..... and never adjusting with a gage.

If it is more than new springs should be installed.

If the OEM factory manual says that .... it's just to sell more springs / shop time.


Anyway ......... take care ..... & keep a spring in your step!


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