'89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster


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pakkies
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'89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby pakkies » Thu Apr 12, 2012 4:16 am



Hi guy's!! can anyone help and tell me what can be wrong ????? my front forks were re-chromed when i bought the bike from the dealer and aparently new seals fitted and ever since the shocks slam when they fully extend upwards/ wheel moves down....had a so called goldwing spesialist redo them but no improvement...so DIY! ......replaced the oil with 15 weight at 377ml R, 372ml L, still the same...don't have a manual so that's what i could find out.... is this correct or should it be more/less???? The forks have dubble springs in them and the odometer reading is 27000km, it has anti-dive valves on both forks...... Honda South Africa can't even give advise!!!!!! PLEASE can enyone help????? Can email me direct if so want at gmarais1964@gmail.com..... ;) :? Had the bike for a week before the so called re-chroming was done then it was fne ... but NOW!!!! just hartace!!!!! and it hurts to drive in this condition!!!



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virgilmobile
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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby virgilmobile » Thu Apr 12, 2012 8:29 am

Download the 89 european service manual from the "manuals" tab.Section 14 gives you all the info on the shocks.You can measure the spring lengths.
One note.The oil lock piece shown on one piston is on the right shock only.the left one does not have one.
The springs in my 88 are a single spring.They may have been changed to a Progressive brand.
They also stick out of the fork tube 4 inches.Much further than my 1200.
It takes everything I've got to compress them by hand with a "T" handle and screw the cap back on.

pakkies
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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby pakkies » Thu Apr 12, 2012 9:36 am

Thanx virgilmobile for the reply!! well you wont believe i had just finished downloading the manual that you speak off and now what is funny is that the right fork takes 320ml and 325ml left and everybody said it must be the other way round hey!! So is your oil levels according to this manual ???? and you've got no hassels???? O yes my springs are also a ***** to get back but made a spesial tool with normal car coilspring compression clamps and a piece of tube and it works like a dream :D

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virgilmobile
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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby virgilmobile » Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:57 am

Yes the book is correct.I'm about half way through the whole front end on mine.I'll post pictures when I get done this week.Mine pulled to the right,so I'm doing an alignment.
You mentioned that your's slams hard.If I read it right,Is that when the front wheel is fully extended away from the bike ?
There is a rebound spring inside the fork.It goes on the piston and then into the fork tube.
The spring is only about 2 inches long.It keeps the fork tube from slamming on metal when it's fully extended.

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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby pakkies » Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:54 pm

Yes it is when the wheel is fully extended away from the bike !!! Ok ! so what your telling me is to strip the whole fork to check if the so called exp. did not leave them out ?? Hmmm! So :evil: who's going to get it!!!! Tell me do you think too much oil could also couse this action ???? :(

At least it's a nice cool evening in Springs, South Africa...at 20:00

Are you rebuilding your ride ???

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heidebill
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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby heidebill » Thu Apr 12, 2012 2:00 pm

Hey Virgilmobile, you say that it only has an Oil Lock one one side, Mine was like that and I could not see a reason for it, and could not buy one so I built one and installed it, Do you know why there is only one in the front suspension and would/will there be any adverse effects fo installing two??? Bill

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virgilmobile
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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby virgilmobile » Thu Apr 12, 2012 3:02 pm

heidebill wrote:Hey Virgilmobile, you say that it only has an Oil Lock one one side, Mine was like that and I could not see a reason for it, and could not buy one so I built one and installed it, Do you know why there is only one in the front suspension and would/will there be any adverse effects fo installing two??? Bill

My only guess is some kind of flow control for the left fork.Remember the right and left are applied from different master cylinders.
I wouldn't put one on the left side,some engineer decided that it better not be there when just the front brake is used(the left caliper)The right caliper is tied to the rear one.
It MAY have some adverse affect during panic braking.Don't know for sure.

by pakkies » Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:54 pm
Yes it is when the wheel is fully extended away from the bike !!! Ok ! so what your telling me is to strip the whole fork to check if the so called exp. did not leave them out ?? Hmmm! So who's going to get it!!!! Tell me do you think too much oil could also cause this action ????

Well if it hammers on extension,it sure sounds like he left them out.Sorry.But if he did,how are you going to get new ones?
Too much oil will cause a dampening problem.How smooth the shocks travel on the road.
To little and they bounce all over the place,too much and they get stiff.But either way,they shouldn't bang at the bottom.Just a nice thud when it hits the rebound spring.

Are you rebuilding your ride ???
Well,kinda...I'm doing all the repairs to make it reliable and in the best possible condition.I'm not adding on a bunch of junk,just fixing what doesn't work right.

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virgilmobile
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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby virgilmobile » Thu Apr 12, 2012 9:09 pm

Sometimes it takes a while for things to sink in.
Obviously there HAS to be less oil in the right fork.
The difference between the two forks is the oil lock piece that is attached to only the right side piston.
By a quick math,it has the mass to displace 5cc. of fluid.

I proved this theory by adding the 2 different amounts to the forks,operating the shocks,and measuring the distance from the top of the fork to the fluid level.
I did this tonight and they are the same distance even tho the right fork has 5cc less fluid in it.

Oh,by the way,I used a piece of glass taped to the top of the forks,under the faring,to identify that they were in fact twisted.On 8" of distance,I measured 0.025" so on the total distance top to bottom I guess it would track 0.10'' to the left causing the slight drifting.

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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby pakkies » Fri Apr 13, 2012 1:08 am

Hi virgilmobile, Good question ! if they were left out i might aswell sit on a mountain and cry !!!! becuase here if you need spares almost everything needs to be imported and then it costs a arm and leg or they are going to say.... sorry you need to buy the whole kit or shock.... my fault i life almost on the moon :) ... so either will have to get dimentions of the springs and see if someone can manufacture them or MAYBE find a replacement somewhere that can do the job ?????

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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby virgilmobile » Fri Apr 13, 2012 6:56 am

I understand.how about this.the rebound spring has to be the same diameter as the big fork spring.the manual shows the length.You may find a automotive repair shop that has a valve spring that is close enough to work.
The hardest part about doing this yourself is compressing the main spring back in.
By the way,my 88 does use 2 springs , my 84 has just one

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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby pakkies » Fri Apr 13, 2012 7:41 am

Well i did strip the forks and geuss what??? the inner pistons were wrong.... :shock: The oil lock piece was in the left fork and the right fork had only the oil lock assembly on it.... The spring joint plates are also missing so got a friend to manufacture 4 for me !!!! I'll have too replace the fork tube bushes and slider bushes but like said they must be imported :o ..but reasembled it for now and hope they will be wright now !!! O yes luckly the rebound springs were not missing but still can't find lenght service specs for them ?? 1 either side ... Wanted to add pics but my phone batt flat... So at the end of it all i hope that that was the problem with turned around inners???? :)

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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby pakkies » Fri Apr 13, 2012 7:51 am

Now that i sit and have a break before putting everything togetter and having the forks out and had them desembled it seems to me they were not re-chromed or new parts fitted :oops: SOOOOO!!! goes to show how flippen people get done in and we pay for nothing .... :( So it seems DIY is the only way that one can be sure what is siad was done is done !!! Phoned the so called fundy mec and he was very surprised to hear me tell him the inners were wrong way round :) Guess thats what they call "JOB CREATION" :lol:

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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby virgilmobile » Fri Apr 13, 2012 8:13 am

I'm afraid I'd have a few words with the mechanic.They would include "criminal suit,incompetence, refund of all money,etc" also putting me at risk of death due to improper repairs.What he worked on is a critical part of the bike.Lack of restoring it to manufacture specs puts you at great risk of loosing control of your bike.
I will not tolerate poor workmanship when it comes to my safety.
A ugly bike is OK as long as it's safe.
Sorry,I'll get of my soap box.

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virgilmobile
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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby virgilmobile » Fri Apr 13, 2012 9:01 am

Was the rebound spring installed wrong?It should go into the fork tube first and then the piston,then the main springs.This way,the wheel is suspended between springs.

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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby heidebill » Fri Apr 13, 2012 9:20 am

I could not find to buy an Oil Lock , so I build one and installed it in the other fork.
Should I dissassemble it and remove the second Oil Lock??
or should I leave it and ride, It feels fine when I am riding now.
Bill

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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby pakkies » Fri Apr 13, 2012 9:22 am

Yes had them apart and back together again!!.. slowly but i got there.... :) No they are there... thank goodness for that! But like said just can't find service specs on them?? Well the forks are together again just waiting for the spring joint plates then i can put spring A & B in and close them and put the bike together again !!! :) Just wish i did take photo's to post so that the other guys can see what to look for and what goes where for them who wants too DIY like me !! I hear what you're saying regarding giving so called mechanic a few words... i agree but like said this is just another point that there are NO ethics in people any more just greed and money grabbers !!! :x I souldn't have believed them but it was .. and is my dream too drive my wing and will just need to do things myself hey !! What scares me the most now days is it seems you never know who one can trust this side of the world with a bike like ours because i've heard guys tell me too mark my covers if at gatherings becuase the guys steel them ..... Now how low can one go ??? :oops: :x
Just glad i did it myself becuase i think if i had to take it back to the IDIOTS they still would have gotten it wrong !!!! and maybe cheated me some more !!!
Sorry for lashing out but it's sad when a person treats some other persons dreams or problems this way!!!!!

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virgilmobile
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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby virgilmobile » Fri Apr 13, 2012 10:24 am

heidebill wrote:I could not find to buy an Oil Lock , so I build one and installed it in the other fork.
Should I dissassemble it and remove the second Oil Lock??
or should I leave it and ride, It feels fine when I am riding now.
Bill

I truly don't know how the extra piece would affect the bike.I can only speculate that it is used to control the fluid during the use of the antidive mechanism.Hard braking.
The secone part is that if you put in the exact amount of fluid called for in the manual,the left fork oil level will be different than the right.Again,probably not noticeable for every day use, but under extreme conditions,it may make a difference in control of the bike.

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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby heidebill » Fri Apr 13, 2012 11:08 am

Thanks Virgil
You are a wealth of knowledge,
I think I will just lave it the way it is , if it gives me any strange effects, I will deal with it then
Bill

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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby pakkies » Fri Apr 13, 2012 11:40 am

virgilmobile this is going to sound very stupid .. i just read a post where they state that the fork oil seal is inserted with the seal spring facing down......... mine faced upwards towards dust cover when i dismanteld them .... so now which is correct... ???? reasembled them the sameway.
The rebound springs are they pressed onto the pistons or should they be loose on the piston/ free moving????????

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virgilmobile
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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby virgilmobile » Fri Apr 13, 2012 1:06 pm

If I remember correctly,the seal with the spring faced down on my 1100 with air shocks.
Also my seals on my1500 faced up.they have never been disassembled before me.
So I guess that because they are not air shocks the spring goes up.
As far as the rebound spring,it's loose on the piston,just like the 1000,1100,1200.
There all built the same in there.you shouldn't have to press it on or it would never be able to move.It's a spring. It's gotta flex to absorb the tire weight.

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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby pakkies » Fri Apr 13, 2012 1:41 pm

i hear what you're saying and i thought so .. but at the moment mine is stuck at the top end of the piston like they were pressed on there... so they do not move freely ??? do you suggest i pry them off/loose???

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virgilmobile
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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby virgilmobile » Fri Apr 13, 2012 2:00 pm

Might as well. If their jammed tight they are not doing anything good.
Think of it this way,when your front wheel fully extends,the only part that keeps it from coming off is that piston hitting the bottom of the fork tube.the spring is there so it can absorb the shock rather than metal slamming on metal.

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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby pakkies » Fri Apr 13, 2012 2:22 pm

I agree but still would like too know then what prevents them from being pressed back on tightly with will happen while driving our bad roads ...OR ...the rebound springs in there are the wrong ones.. and they're ID is just to small so that's why they are stuck at the top..and not loose on the piston??
Next opsion is to put a coller ontop of the spring so as to allow it to come down further allowing more spring at the bottem of the piston !!! Will this work ?? does it make sense ??

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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby virgilmobile » Fri Apr 13, 2012 3:45 pm

If the spring is just stuck on the first turn of the coil and the rest of it is loose on the pistons shaft, that's OK.this would be seen if the piston shaft is a smaller diameter than the spring,it slides smooth and then sticks to a tapered lip just under the piston top.you don't want the spring stuck solid to it, it would never be able to move.

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Re: '89 goldwing 1500 fork disaster

Postby pakkies » Sat Apr 14, 2012 12:09 am

Mine seems to be stuck all the way or should i say the whole leght of the piston shoulder, if you pull the slider when bleeding the fork it still slams metal to metal on full extention... so this tells me that the rebound spring in to short or pressed up on the piston shoulder !!




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