2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.


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peppilepew
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2012 GL1800 Level 3

2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby peppilepew » Thu Jun 06, 2013 11:06 pm



This is my third year riding and my second bike. My first was a 1200 that I never tried to push in corners. My confidence level has increased and thus my demands on this 1500 have increased. Some say shocks and tires increase handling characteristics. I have a completely serviced 100% mechanically functioning bike. I have done everything. Had 14k on it when purchased and it now has 31k. This bike had the same wobble with new tires so it is not a tire brand issue or a wear indicator. This question is for 1500 owners. Does your bike get squirmy at higher speeds cornering? Does the problem get magnified on uneven pavements? Am I expecting ST performance from a tourer? Are there products out there that will cure, not lessen steering wobble? I absolutely love this bike otherwise. I have 11k on a set of Venoms. I run 41 and 45 lbs. Same with 36 and 41 lbs. More so trying to find if 1500s have more limitations than an 1800.



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ct1500
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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby ct1500 » Thu Jun 06, 2013 11:19 pm

You listed about five problems you have with the bike.

What exactly and at what time do you have a problem?

At 118 MPH the 1500 may start to wobble from the rear.
This is what I do
Local and need repair help with your 1500, Valkyrie or ST please PM

peppilepew
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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby peppilepew » Thu Jun 06, 2013 11:33 pm

ct1500 wrote:You listed about five problems you have with the bike.

What exactly and at what time do you have a problem?

At 118 MPH the 1500 may start to wobble from the rear.


Haven't hit 118 yet. lol. Squirm comes alive at about 65 on moderate turns. Way worse 2 up. Magnified on rough roads. Suspension turns to mush. Feels like a tire has gone flat or is way low on pressure. Problem or characteristic?

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minimac
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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby minimac » Fri Jun 07, 2013 6:56 am

If it's the front, take a good look at your fork oil. You state you've done everything, but have you changed the fork oil? Do a search on this site and see how to do it properly. I can't tell you how important that is. Also are you certain the wheel is balanced properly? This is one area that Dyna Beads, or similar products, really help. If, after doing these there is still a problem, try a fork brace. An 1800 is a bit lacking in legroom compared to the 1500, and more$$. Work with what you have , and you'll be happy for a long time!

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dingdong
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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby dingdong » Fri Jun 07, 2013 7:06 am

From your description you have a definite problem. Bad rear shocks, weak front springs or swing arm bearings loose. Two big improvements for the 1500 is a fork brace and also Progressive fork springs. Both will show a definite improvement. I have heard that Progressive rear shocks show an even greater improvement but I haven't done that "yet". At 65mph you shouldn't have any problems in a curve.
Tom

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peppilepew
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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby peppilepew » Fri Jun 07, 2013 5:54 pm

I have done the fork brace and replaced both fork seals. Installed bushings along with the new seals. 13 and 12 ounces of 10w fork oil installed. I also have dynabeads in both tires. Head and swing arm are both tight. I have progressive front springs already. I am not your average mechanic. I can't help but think bike limitation and not a mechanical issue. At 6ft 1in I agree that the 1500 has more room than a 1800. The rear shocks are the only thing left. I will only purchase them if I am pretty sure they will help.

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minimac
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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby minimac » Fri Jun 07, 2013 6:37 pm

Mine will pick up a wobble but not until an indicated 105mph- which I only did once. I run my shocks with about 54-58psi and around 44 lbs in the back tires.There should not be any squirming or wiggling at only 65mph. If everything else checks out, all I can think of is that something else out of whack, bent forks, frame, something that isn't right- and it will probably drive you nuts to find it. I really feel for you. Good luck.

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hugger-4641
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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby hugger-4641 » Tue Jun 18, 2013 7:35 pm

I've noticed in certain situations I will get a little "sway" in mine. There are a couple good long sweeping curves in a 4 lane hwy near my home that I have to lean into pretty good if taken at 70mph. There are also some pretty well worn "ruts" in this road from the semi traffic. If I don't lean in enough or I pick my head up a little to look at something on the outside of the curve, I'll get a little sway in the bike, sorta like a trailer that's been loaded too heavy in the rear, but it settles down if I put some pressure on the bars and lean in like I should.

peppilepew
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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby peppilepew » Wed Jun 19, 2013 10:30 am

hugger-4641 wrote:I've noticed in certain situations I will get a little "sway" in mine. There are a couple good long sweeping curves in a 4 lane hwy near my home that I have to lean into pretty good if taken at 70mph. There are also some pretty well worn "ruts" in this road from the semi traffic. If I don't lean in enough or I pick my head up a little to look at something on the outside of the curve, I'll get a little sway in the bike, sorta like a trailer that's been loaded too heavy in the rear, but it settles down if I put some pressure on the bars and lean in like I should.


Exactly what I speak of. I hear it is more a characteristic than a problem with the 1500. I see an 1800 in my future. Someone is going to get a nice 2000 se that needs nothing.

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robb
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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby robb » Wed Jun 19, 2013 8:45 pm

Have you checked wheel bearings. Just the other day another rider with a new tire found that it was not completely seated, said it looked good but when deflated and aired up he did hear a pop. Wobble gone.

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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby detdrbuzzard » Thu Jun 20, 2013 3:15 am

have you replaced the rear shocks? also when rideing through a curve are your knees in the breeze or against the tank, in the breeze will cause a wobble
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peppilepew
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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby peppilepew » Thu Jun 20, 2013 5:39 am

robb wrote:Have you checked wheel bearings. Just the other day another rider with a new tire found that it was not completely seated, said it looked good but when deflated and aired up he did hear a pop. Wobble gone.


Avons have about 12k on them and are soon to be replaced. They are seated but starting to get scalloped. Running Dynabeads for balance.

detdrbuzzard wrote:have you replaced the rear shocks? also when rideing through a curve are your knees in the breeze or against the tank, in the breeze will cause a wobble


Now this area of the suspension is somewhat a mystery. Bike rides well and doesn't bounce like a rubber ball. My troubles actually start in the 70mph area on moderate curves. I do sometimes fell the rear suspension bottom. I run 60 lbs pressure unloaded. While money isn't a problem for new shocks I want to be somewhat sure they will correct or drastically improve the handling. I keep my body tight to the tank. Can air wings create or add to this type of instability?

Wheel and head bearings are all tight. Bike is 100% maintained and checked every 3k with an oil change on a car lift. I am anal with a machine that uses 2 wheels to protect my wife and I from the pavement.

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rrruuunnn
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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby rrruuunnn » Thu Jun 20, 2013 12:08 pm

I'm glad to know I'm not the only one who feels like you are chasing there rear tire in turns, the only way I can stop it is to run 120 pounds of air in rear shock, I to have replaced all suspension parts mentioned above with no improvement

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hugger-4641
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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby hugger-4641 » Thu Jun 20, 2013 2:09 pm

rrruuunnn wrote:I'm glad to know I'm not the only one who feels like you are chasing there rear tire in turns, the only way I can stop it is to run 120 pounds of air in rear shock, I to have replaced all suspension parts mentioned above with no improvement



Wow. I run 35 - 40psi riding single and 75 to 80 when two up. I weight 220 and my wife is about 140. I very seldom bottom out the suspension at 40 when riding single, but there are a couple very bad bridge aproaches that will do it occasionally. I didn't have the "swaying" problem until I put this last set of E-3's on, but I can't swear that is the problem. My bike just hit 100k miles and still on the original shocks, so I'm wondering if one of the springs on the rear shocks has become weaker than the other side.

peppilepew
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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby peppilepew » Thu Jun 20, 2013 6:48 pm

hugger-4641 wrote:
rrruuunnn wrote:I'm glad to know I'm not the only one who feels like you are chasing there rear tire in turns, the only way I can stop it is to run 120 pounds of air in rear shock, I to have replaced all suspension parts mentioned above with no improvement



Wow. I run 35 - 40psi riding single and 75 to 80 when two up. I weight 220 and my wife is about 140. I very seldom bottom out the suspension at 40 when riding single, but there are a couple very bad bridge aproaches that will do it occasionally. I didn't have the "swaying" problem until I put this last set of E-3's on, but I can't swear that is the problem. My bike just hit 100k miles and still on the original shocks, so I'm wondering if one of the springs on the rear shocks has become weaker than the other side.


You only have one rear spring on the left. The right air shock is a load adjuster. I ordered a progressive 412 for the rear. 231 delivered to the door. If the shock helps or eliminates the wallow then it will be the best 2 hrs and 231 spent on this machine. If it doesn't then the brain is working on excuses and reasons to upgrade to the 1800. I'm convinced but the wife will be a little harder. I'm convinced that the swaying is a characteristic and not a mechanical part failure of the 1500. I could spend 800 only to still have the sway. I would rather put the 800 against the 1800.

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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby Wingsconsin » Fri Jun 21, 2013 9:20 am

The new rear shock should help. It was one of the best investments I made as I tuned my bike for better riding.
However - you may be expecting too much from a Touring machine meant to eat long miles and not to carve corners at speed.
Although the 1500 is a very capable machine , and I will run with anyone and not loose sight of them, it is NOT a Sport Tourer ...
The 1800 compares favorably with the sport touring aspect of big bikes, it was designed to do more cornering and high performance, however you do sacrifice a little storage, and overall passenger room (very little), and longevity of tires when moving to an 1800.
Many 1800 owners/riders I speak to LOVED their 1500's and miss them ...until they have to go corner carving and throittle twisting... :mrgreen:
Postings are my opinions based on experience and acquired knowledge.
Your results may vary. Universal disclaimers apply.


Motorcycle Adventure Storys writen by me
http://neverlost-justexploring.blogspot.com/

peppilepew
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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby peppilepew » Fri Jun 21, 2013 4:53 pm

Wingsconsin wrote:The new rear shock should help. It was one of the best investments I made as I tuned my bike for better riding.
However - you may be expecting too much from a Touring machine meant to eat long miles and not to carve corners at speed.
Although the 1500 is a very capable machine , and I will run with anyone and not loose sight of them, it is NOT a Sport Tourer ...
The 1800 compares favorably with the sport touring aspect of big bikes, it was designed to do more cornering and high performance, however you do sacrifice a little storage, and overall passenger room (very little), and longevity of tires when moving to an 1800.
Many 1800 owners/riders I speak to LOVED their 1500's and miss them ...until they have to go corner carving and throittle twisting... :mrgreen:


I agree 100%. Yours was the answer I was looking for. Everything in life has limits. A friend of mine once said to me "Cliff, people have limitations. Learn what those limitations are and you will run a successful business. Your family will also be much happier. Know your limitations and keep learning." . This rule applies to everything. Even motorcycles! :D

Wingwong
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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby Wingwong » Sat Jul 06, 2013 1:41 am

I have a 2000 1500se with 31,000 miles and have put progressives on the front and rear along with a fork brace, I have dunlops front and rear and run 40lbsin both and my bike handles amazing.

peppilepew
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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby peppilepew » Mon Jul 08, 2013 7:01 am

I have a set of 416 progressives and a new set of dunlops waiting to be mounted. I will post the final results when my tires need replacement in another 3-4k. Want to do it all at once. i am pretty tired of taking it apart. It was fun at first. Now the mystery tour has become work.

peppilepew
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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby peppilepew » Mon Aug 26, 2013 7:18 am

I have installed the 416 progressive rear shocks and to my amazement the wobble is nearly gone. I think playing around with pressures and weight distribution may get rid of the very very slight wobble when hitting bumps on turns. The shocks in my opinion have cured the problem. I also installed a new set of road skins. Thanks for the help everyone. Now that I have done all this work I am selling it. Traveled to PA this weekend to pickup a new 2012 blue level 3. I was apprehensive at first because of all the work I have done to the 2000se. That went away by the time I reached the end of their parking lot.

peppilepew
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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby peppilepew » Mon Aug 26, 2013 7:24 am

Wingsconsin wrote:The new rear shock should help. It was one of the best investments I made as I tuned my bike for better riding.
However - you may be expecting too much from a Touring machine meant to eat long miles and not to carve corners at speed.
Although the 1500 is a very capable machine , and I will run with anyone and not loose sight of them, it is NOT a Sport Tourer ...
The 1800 compares favorably with the sport touring aspect of big bikes, it was designed to do more cornering and high performance, however you do sacrifice a little storage, and overall passenger room (very little), and longevity of tires when moving to an 1800.
Many 1800 owners/riders I speak to LOVED their 1500's and miss them ...until they have to go corner carving and throttle twisting... :mrgreen:


Dead on!

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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby Wingsconsin » Mon Aug 26, 2013 8:36 am

----- :ugeek: -----
Postings are my opinions based on experience and acquired knowledge.
Your results may vary. Universal disclaimers apply.


Motorcycle Adventure Storys writen by me
http://neverlost-justexploring.blogspot.com/

Matt G
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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby Matt G » Fri Aug 30, 2013 8:38 pm

peppilepew wrote:
Wingsconsin wrote:The new rear shock should help. It was one of the best investments I made as I tuned my bike for better riding.
However - you may be expecting too much from a Touring machine meant to eat long miles and not to carve corners at speed.
Although the 1500 is a very capable machine , and I will run with anyone and not loose sight of them, it is NOT a Sport Tourer ...
The 1800 compares favorably with the sport touring aspect of big bikes, it was designed to do more cornering and high performance, however you do sacrifice a little storage, and overall passenger room (very little), and longevity of tires when moving to an 1800.
Many 1800 owners/riders I speak to LOVED their 1500's and miss them ...until they have to go corner carving and throttle twisting... :mrgreen:


Dead on!


Had a 01 1800, sold it, kept the 1500, the 1800 was nice to ride, but it was more expensive to maintain.

on the wobble, my 88 1500 rolled like a beached whale, put a set of progressives on and it takes the same corners like it was on rails.

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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby Ericson38 » Sat Aug 31, 2013 10:50 am

I have a 2000 (1500) SE, with 78K miles. I never really liked how it handled, compared to the '83 standard. I had gone through everything, including changing to progressives in the front, new slider bushes, tire pressures (both bikes running Dunlop E3s), different fork oil weights, rider position. Neither bike wobbles or shimmys. The 1500 was just not precise, although all shifting is great, torque is great, carbs are fine, and rider space is great. Radio is OK, but I listen to Loretta Lynn and Patsy Cline tapes when riding around VA and WVA anyway.

Then I put a BlackWing fork brace on the 2000. The bike so completely changed, that I now like riding it in the twisties versus the 1100. What a fun bike to take on any kind of road riding.

I thought about an upgrade to 1800, but with the new 1800s having overheating problems, transmission problems, paint problems, etc, etc, I'm glad I have this one. The 100 hp 1500 is plenty, and I don't think Honda upsized the running machinery and heat rejection enough when they went to 118 hp.

Reading the Harly Tech Forums (http://harleytechtalk.org/htt/index.php/board,3.0.html), there is no way I'm going through that. I have a couple hundred miles on a 2009 Road King (96 inch), and the GL1500 has it beat on low end torque.

Yesterday, came back from a 350 mile round trip from Nokesville to Monterey Va (little Switzerland of the East in Highland County). That was a combined 8 mountain ranges from here. The 1500 just had a blast on it. Filled up in Warrenton, then in Monterey, and got 43.93 MPG, in mostly up/down hill riding, from 300 ft to 3800 ft elevation change.

This includes the potential energy increase of raising about 1100 lbs through 3500 ft. This additional work required an additional 152 watts out of the motor on average, over 3 hours, about 0.2 hp required from the rear wheel.

peppilepew
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Re: 2000 1500 unstable under stress in corners.

Postby peppilepew » Tue Sep 03, 2013 12:05 pm

In all honesty my wife liked the 1500 better than this 1800. Coming from a women's standpoint her decision is based on storage space, bike cost and how much more aggressive daddy has become. I like the 1500 for long trips. The 1800 just plain rocks. She can tone down luggage and I can keep off the throttle riding with her. The 1500 is a beautiful piece of engineering for long tours. The 1800 not so much due to storage. It depends on what one wants from their bike. I wanted a more sport bike characteristics. This 1800 does carve up the corners and push me back in the seat under hard acceleration. I got 43 MPG this weekend. The best MPG from the 1500 was 45. I ride for enjoyment, not fuel economy. If anyone is interested in my 1500 it is for sale. I will list it for forum members first. It is taking up space needed for the 1800. Not a thing wrong with it! As close to a perfect bike as one gets.




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