Broken (not stuck) hazard switch and possible work around.


Information and questions on GL1500 Goldwings (1988-2000)
  • Sponsored Links
User avatar
erikwillke
Posts: 45
Joined: Thu Jan 30, 2014 10:34 am
Location: Peoria, IL
Motorcycle: 96 GL1500SE
12 HD XL1200C- Sold!
80 Suz GN400
73 CB750 SOHC
Contact:

Broken (not stuck) hazard switch and possible work around.

Postby erikwillke » Mon Feb 24, 2014 12:33 pm



First off, thank you, everyone, for being the wonderful group that you are. I have gleaned a ton from this forum already. I've searched this forum for an answer and have been led down some promising avenues but they have not panned out. I think I found a workaround but I would like some feedback before I proceed.

When I test-rode my latest girl, 96 GL1500SE it was close to 0 degrees F. Of course I checked to see if all the lights and switches functioned before my test ride. Upon depressing the hazard switch, the switch closed and operated the hazards normally. However the switch would not open when I tried to depress the switch a second time. From what I can tell the switch, from an open condition, is supposed to go in until it hits a stop and then retract a tad resting in the closed position. To open the switch you need to press it in until it stops and then it will travel back to it's normal open position. This is not happening.

I briefly tried to pry the switch back out but only briefly thinking it might be stuck. That's when I found the article about stuck swtiches on here and purchased some dielectric cleaner and sprayed the switch as instructed, with the switch housing cracked and from beneath using the straw. I worked the switch for a good 5 minutes and multiple sprays. The switch is not stuck as far as I can tell in the sense that it's gunked up. I can feel the switch hitting the stop but it then returns the 1mm (approx) to where it was, still closed.

Before I acquired the repair manual I tried a couple of quick fixes. Chiefly to remove the accessory fuse. That worked insomuch as to kill the all-four flashing until I tried to use the turn signals. That makes sense now that I have access to the schematic since, with the hazard switch closed, all the lights are effectively bridged.

The way I see it I have two options and one really won't work. By the way. I do plan on purchasing a new left side switch but i don't have the funds right now.

The first option was to remove the connector on the hazard relay but that won't work because that has the same net effect as pulling the fuse. The left and right systems will still be bridged by way of the hazard switch. The only option I can see working which will allow me to operate the turn signals properly is to cut the Orange and Light Blue wires at the hazard switch before they bridge to the left and right turn signal wires. Trouble is, I have a sneaky suspicion that bridging happens very closely in the switch assembly and may be very hard to get to even after I clamshell the switch.

Does anyone have any suggestions? My immediate goal is to be able to ride the bike normally without hazards and with operating turn signals. My ultimate goal is to replace the left side switch in it's entirety.

Thank you

see attached.

Left Switch diagram
Left Switch diagram


Finally bought the same bike that brought me so much joy as a kid from the backseat.

User avatar
virgilmobile
Posts: 7659
Joined: Sun Sep 19, 2010 5:39 pm
Location: Denham Springs,La.
Motorcycle: 1988 GL1500 I
Previously owned
78 GL1000
81 GL1100
82 GL1100 I
83 GL1100 I
83 GL1100 standard
84 GL 1200 I

Re: Broken (not stuck) hazard switch and possible work aroun

Postby virgilmobile » Mon Feb 24, 2014 12:56 pm

If I read correctly,your turn signals operate all the lamps,just like a hazard .
If so,the hazard switch is stuck on.Cutting either feed/jumper will alleviate the problem.

User avatar
virgilmobile
Posts: 7659
Joined: Sun Sep 19, 2010 5:39 pm
Location: Denham Springs,La.
Motorcycle: 1988 GL1500 I
Previously owned
78 GL1000
81 GL1100
82 GL1100 I
83 GL1100 I
83 GL1100 standard
84 GL 1200 I

Re: Broken (not stuck) hazard switch and possible work aroun

Postby virgilmobile » Mon Feb 24, 2014 1:04 pm

Also.dont go by the picture exactly.The way its shows,can't Be right.it shows left and right lamp circuits tied together just below the hazard switch.In this configuration both left and right would flash on hazards or turns.There must be a separation in the switch.
Not confirmed but I believe the hazard should have 3 contacts.Flasher input and 2 separate outputs ,one for each side.

User avatar
robb
Posts: 1040
Joined: Mon Jul 19, 2010 7:46 pm
Location: Lexington, North Carolina
Motorcycle: 1989 Honda GL1500 Aspencade

Re: Broken (not stuck) hazard switch and possible work aroun

Postby robb » Mon Feb 24, 2014 1:11 pm

It could also be a bad flasher relay.

User avatar
WingAdmin
Site Admin
Posts: 17047
Joined: Fri Oct 03, 2008 4:16 pm
Location: Strongsville, OH
Motorcycle: 2000 GL1500 SE
1982 GL1100A Aspencade (sold)
1989 PC800 (wife's!)
1998 XV250 Virago (sold)
2007 Aspen Sentry Trailer

Re: Broken (not stuck) hazard switch and possible work aroun

Postby WingAdmin » Mon Feb 24, 2014 1:25 pm

Cutting the pink/white wire will disable your hazards, while letting your turn signals continue to function normally.

Here's the reason why it gets stuck. This is a very simple version of the push on/push off mechanism inside the switch (drawing from memory, so it's not going to be exact, just a representation):

Switch mechanism
Switch mechanism


Inside the switch is a track (in red). There is a follower, which has a little piece that rides in the track, like a needle in the groove of a record. The followers usually have a little spring that helps encourage it to go the right way around the track (but not always).

When the switch is off, the follower is in position 1. You press the switch, and as the switch moves in, the follower moves until it is at position 2, where the switch is fully depressed. You then let go of the switch, and the spring causes the follower to move to position 3. The switch is now on. Pressing it again causes it to move to position 4, and releasing it moves to position 1 again, where the switch is now off.

The problem is when the spring gets weak, or gunk fouls up the movement of the follower. You're in position 3 ("on") and you press the switch to turn it off. Instead of going to position 4, it goes back to position 2. You then let go of it, and it goes back to position 3. It's still "on". Every time you press it, it just keeps doing the same thing. You need to clean it out and lubricate it so that the follower moves correctly to position 4 instead of position 2.

You normally can't get to the "follower" part of the mechanism without actually opening the switch cluster up, then popping the switch itself open, exposing the mechanism. Then you can flush it out with a non-residue solvent, and lubricate it.

User avatar
erikwillke
Posts: 45
Joined: Thu Jan 30, 2014 10:34 am
Location: Peoria, IL
Motorcycle: 96 GL1500SE
12 HD XL1200C- Sold!
80 Suz GN400
73 CB750 SOHC
Contact:

Re: Broken (not stuck) hazard switch and possible work aroun

Postby erikwillke » Mon Feb 24, 2014 1:38 pm

WingAdmin wrote:Cutting the pink/white wire will disable your hazards, while letting your turn signals continue to function normally.

Here's the reason why it gets stuck. This is a very simple version of the push on/push off mechanism inside the switch (drawing from memory, so it's not going to be exact, just a representation):

Inside the switch is a track (in red). There is a follower, which has a little piece that rides in the track, like a needle in the groove of a record. The followers usually have a little spring that helps encourage it to go the right way around the track (but not always).

When the switch is off, the follower is in position 1. You press the switch, and as the switch moves in, the follower moves until it is at position 2, where the switch is fully depressed. You then let go of the switch, and the spring causes the follower to move to position 3. The switch is now on. Pressing it again causes it to move to position 4, and releasing it moves to position 1 again, where the switch is now off.

The problem is when the spring gets weak, or gunk fouls up the movement of the follower. You're in position 3 ("on") and you press the switch to turn it off. Instead of going to position 4, it goes back to position 2. You then let go of it, and it goes back to position 3. It's still "on". Every time you press it, it just keeps doing the same thing. You need to clean it out and lubricate it so that the follower moves correctly to position 4 instead of position 2.

You normally can't get to the "follower" part of the mechanism without actually opening the switch cluster up, then popping the switch itself open, exposing the mechanism. Then you can flush it out with a non-residue solvent, and lubricate it.


Thank you WingAdmin. The diagram and description was what I had in my mind. I will try to disassemble the switch assembly and see if i can work it free.

as for the Pink/White wire, as I see it cutting it will not correct the problem because the left and right are still connected via the closed hazard switch. Do you agree with that?
Finally bought the same bike that brought me so much joy as a kid from the backseat.

User avatar
erikwillke
Posts: 45
Joined: Thu Jan 30, 2014 10:34 am
Location: Peoria, IL
Motorcycle: 96 GL1500SE
12 HD XL1200C- Sold!
80 Suz GN400
73 CB750 SOHC
Contact:

Re: Broken (not stuck) hazard switch and possible work aroun

Postby erikwillke » Mon Feb 24, 2014 1:40 pm

virgilmobile wrote:Also.dont go by the picture exactly.The way its shows,can't Be right.it shows left and right lamp circuits tied together just below the hazard switch.In this configuration both left and right would flash on hazards or turns.There must be a separation in the switch.
Not confirmed but I believe the hazard should have 3 contacts.Flasher input and 2 separate outputs ,one for each side.


I hadn't noticed that but I agree. I'm sure it is for illustration only. It would need to be three contacts.
Finally bought the same bike that brought me so much joy as a kid from the backseat.

User avatar
WingAdmin
Site Admin
Posts: 17047
Joined: Fri Oct 03, 2008 4:16 pm
Location: Strongsville, OH
Motorcycle: 2000 GL1500 SE
1982 GL1100A Aspencade (sold)
1989 PC800 (wife's!)
1998 XV250 Virago (sold)
2007 Aspen Sentry Trailer

Re: Broken (not stuck) hazard switch and possible work aroun

Postby WingAdmin » Mon Feb 24, 2014 2:40 pm

erikwillke wrote:as for the Pink/White wire, as I see it cutting it will not correct the problem because the left and right are still connected via the closed hazard switch. Do you agree with that?


I agree that going by that circuit diagram, that is the case. However, going by that circuit diagram, any time you turned the turn signal on, both turn signals would flash! That diagram is clearly wrong.

I had a look in the service manual, and the circuit diagram is correct there:

Service Manual Hazard Switch Diagram
Service Manual Hazard Switch Diagram


Extrapolating this to the ETM diagram, I modified the ETM diagram to draw it correctly:

Electronic Troubleshooting Manual Hazard Switch Diagram
Electronic Troubleshooting Manual Hazard Switch Diagram


So based on this, cutting just the pink/white wire will disable the hazard lights. However...that is assuming that the hazard switch is disengaged! If the hazard switch is depressed, even if the pink/white wire is disconnected, both left and right signals will flash whenever the turn signal is engaged, because it will backfeed through the depressed hazard switch. If you cannot get the hazard light switch to disengage, the Light blue and Orange wires need to be cut in order for the turn signals to function normally.

User avatar
erikwillke
Posts: 45
Joined: Thu Jan 30, 2014 10:34 am
Location: Peoria, IL
Motorcycle: 96 GL1500SE
12 HD XL1200C- Sold!
80 Suz GN400
73 CB750 SOHC
Contact:

Re: Broken (not stuck) hazard switch and possible work aroun

Postby erikwillke » Mon Feb 24, 2014 5:52 pm

That's what I was thinking thinking. Thank you.
Finally bought the same bike that brought me so much joy as a kid from the backseat.

User avatar
virgilmobile
Posts: 7659
Joined: Sun Sep 19, 2010 5:39 pm
Location: Denham Springs,La.
Motorcycle: 1988 GL1500 I
Previously owned
78 GL1000
81 GL1100
82 GL1100 I
83 GL1100 I
83 GL1100 standard
84 GL 1200 I

Re: Broken (not stuck) hazard switch and possible work aroun

Postby virgilmobile » Tue Feb 25, 2014 10:06 am

Keep us up to date and take pictures of what you do to get by with...
Side of the road emergency repairs are good info....
I always keep some wire,fuses,a relay and electrical tape in the trunk....Just a few hand tools too..

User avatar
erikwillke
Posts: 45
Joined: Thu Jan 30, 2014 10:34 am
Location: Peoria, IL
Motorcycle: 96 GL1500SE
12 HD XL1200C- Sold!
80 Suz GN400
73 CB750 SOHC
Contact:

Re: Broken (not stuck) hazard switch and possible work aroun

Postby erikwillke » Tue Feb 25, 2014 10:57 am

virgilmobile wrote:Keep us up to date and take pictures of what you do to get by with...
Side of the road emergency repairs are good info....
I always keep some wire,fuses,a relay and electrical tape in the trunk....Just a few hand tools too..


Will do. I plan on attacking it this week. It's been brutally cold for the past month or so but I'm just hoping to get home before dark anymore.

as for the roadside kit... I made a video a while ago on a field soldering kit and put it on youtube. Basically it's a "get home" soldering kit. I keep on in all my vehicles.... just in case.



Finally bought the same bike that brought me so much joy as a kid from the backseat.

User avatar
Uncle Fester
Posts: 1003
Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2012 6:21 pm
Location: Bethany, Ok, right off Route 66 !
Motorcycle: 1996 GL-1500 Cali model 'Wing, blue in color, named Ol'Blue

Re: Broken (not stuck) hazard switch and possible work aroun

Postby Uncle Fester » Tue Feb 25, 2014 3:07 pm

I am at the mall, with their crappy wifi, right now, so I can not watch the video, but will be watching it tonight ! Thanks for sharing that with us !


Reputation is what other people know about you. Honor is what you know about yourself. Our stress about it happens when the two aren't the same. Be true to yourself and to hell with what everyone else thinks!

Image


Return to “GL1500 Information & Questions”




Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google Adsense [Bot], wingdings and 2 guests