Blacking forkbrace


Information and questions on GL1500 Goldwings (1988-2000)
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BikerBuck
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Blacking forkbrace

Postby BikerBuck » Mon Feb 29, 2016 9:13 am



I'm getting ready to install a blackwing forkbrace. The four original Allen bolts you remove are 7 mm with a 1.0 thread pitch. The bolts supplied are 1/4 in x 28 thread. Is this correct to force a different size and thread into the fender stay? Seems odd. Just want to make sure I do it right. Thanks for any replies.



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tfdeputydawg
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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby tfdeputydawg » Mon Feb 29, 2016 9:36 am

First, I'd like to "hear" why you would install a fork brace? Thanks
Secondly, no it's not wise to try to use the wrong size/thread pitch fasteners!
I'd contact Blackwing for advice!

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WingAdmin
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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby WingAdmin » Mon Feb 29, 2016 9:52 am

The reason for a fork brace installation is to stabilize the front end, and improve the handling, stability and feel of the bike. You can read about the experiences of people who have installed them here: viewtopic.php?f=18&t=28654

However...I am fairly sure that Blackwing does not make a fork brace for the GL1100. Are you sure what you're trying to install is meant for your bike?

Lastly, the fork brace that the GL1100 came with from the factory is fairly substantial, I don't know if it really needs to be replaced.

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BikerBuck
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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby BikerBuck » Mon Feb 29, 2016 10:36 am

WingAdmin, my neglect on first post. Haven't updated my profile. Brace is going on a 2000 SE 1500. Brace is labeled for a gl1500. Installation sheet is labeled for a gl1500. In these instructions is states to remove stock cap screws (which are 7mm x 1.0) and mount new brace with 1/4 x 28 countersunk screws. I know you and many others have installed these with great results, the mismatched screws just seems odd to me. Just would like some experienced input before I proceed.

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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby WingAdmin » Mon Feb 29, 2016 10:54 am

BikerBuck wrote:WingAdmin, my neglect on first post. Haven't updated my profile. Brace is going on a 2000 SE 1500. Brace is labeled for a gl1500. Installation sheet is labeled for a gl1500. In these instructions is states to remove stock cap screws (which are 7mm x 1.0) and mount new brace with 1/4 x 28 countersunk screws. I know you and many others have installed these with great results, the mismatched screws just seems odd to me. Just would like some experienced input before I proceed.


OK...first, you can update your profile here:

ucp.php?i=164

Next, are you sure the screw threads on the supplied screws are incorrect? I know when I installed mine, the screws went into the lower bracket with no problem whatsoever. They bracket was a little bit stiff to screw into/out of at first due to corrosion, but using some penetrating oil freed it right up.

I do know the use of countersunk screws is important to the function of this brace.

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BikerBuck
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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby BikerBuck » Mon Feb 29, 2016 11:39 am

Odd, the pic of the blackwing on your product review page shows the countersunk holes. I don't think anything else would work properly. I'll shoot a pic of the instructions later and post.screws that came with the blackwing are definitely 1/4 x 28.

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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby firey1 » Mon Feb 29, 2016 1:50 pm

put the blackwing brace in my 96 aspy last week wow what a difference

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dovesdrummer
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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby dovesdrummer » Mon Feb 29, 2016 4:27 pm

I've been a machinist for 30 years. A .250-28 screw equates to a 6.35mm x 1.102 thread pitch. A 7mm screw is. 275 OD. Not even close. I think I'd talk to Blackwing also.
:mrgreen:

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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby BikerBuck » Mon Feb 29, 2016 6:30 pm

Thanks for the tech info. Have e-mail into blackwing now. Attached is pic of instructions. With the many that have been sold I'm curious as to whether my purchase is different. 40+ years of turning wrenches and never been instructed to install a mismatched bolt.
Attachments
Pic of instructions
Pic of instructions

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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby golden highway » Mon Feb 29, 2016 9:04 pm

I installed a blackwing brace on my GL15OO and the bolts I removed from the fender and the bolts came with the blackwing brace were the same thread. I never read the instructions I just watched the video. Maybe a misprint.

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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby keithg64 » Mon Feb 29, 2016 9:08 pm

The blackwing brace does come with 1/4-28 bolts. I think he said that in the youtube video that he has. The stock bolts are definitely 7mm. I've been a machinist for over 30 years and have made my our brace. I retapped the 7mm thread's to clean them up and tried the 1/4-28 bolts and did not like the lack of torque you can put on the bolts. Also there is about a .035 difference in diameter that I didn't like. I'm using 7mm bolts hex head .
It's not what you buy, it's what you build.

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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby keithg64 » Mon Feb 29, 2016 9:10 pm

The thread pitch between the 2 are close and seems it work's with the difference in diameter.
It's not what you buy, it's what you build.

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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby dovesdrummer » Mon Feb 29, 2016 9:57 pm

keithg64 wrote:The thread pitch between the 2 are close and seems it work's with the difference in diameter.
I would think that by Blackwing sending screws to mount the brace that are .250" in diameter by 28 tpi vs the .275" diameter by 25.4 tpi (M7x1.0 equivalent) would be a real no no. It's just not good machining practice. We strive as machinists to be as close as possible with tolerance.
:mrgreen:

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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby Charlie1Horse » Mon Feb 29, 2016 10:08 pm

Maybe these instructions were 'farmed out' to some other nameless country that doesn't know the difference between SAE and Metric. There's no way I would ever replace a metric bolt with an SAE bolt. They are enough different that it could possibly even cause catastrophic failure.
Russell

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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby dovesdrummer » Mon Feb 29, 2016 10:20 pm

Actually a M5x.8 and a10-32 are interchangeable . Other than that I agree completely
:mrgreen:

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BikerBuck
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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby BikerBuck » Mon Feb 29, 2016 10:37 pm

It's Not just the instructions being wrong, it' also the bolts sent with the product. They're not metric bolts. Still waiting for a reply from blackwing. Will post when I hear from them.

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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby keithg64 » Mon Feb 29, 2016 10:45 pm

When I made mine and was looking for a 7mm countersink bolt, there are none made, made my own.
It's not what you buy, it's what you build.

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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby keithg64 » Mon Feb 29, 2016 10:47 pm

dovesdrummer wrote:Actually a M5x.8 and a10-32 are interchangeable . Other than that I agree completely


I concur.
It's not what you buy, it's what you build.

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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby dagibbons » Tue Mar 01, 2016 3:18 am

I took a 7mm Allen cap bolt at 30lg and machined a 82 deg. countersunk. It worked fine.
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Slowride84
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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby Slowride84 » Tue Mar 01, 2016 9:09 pm

I have an 81 gl1100 no fork brace. My spare parts bike has a fork brace. Spare Is an 83 gl1100. Will I be able to remove and install on 81?

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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby keithg64 » Wed Mar 02, 2016 9:08 am

Yes you can replace the 83 for the 81.

On the 1500, you can take the fender stay out and Helicoil it for a 1/4-28.
It's not what you buy, it's what you build.

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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby BikerBuck » Wed Mar 02, 2016 1:55 pm

Keithg64, have considered the helicoil. Also considered drilling and tapping for 8mm. I can buy countersunk flathead 8mm screws anywhere. What's your thoughts?

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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby keithg64 » Wed Mar 02, 2016 2:39 pm

I thought of the 8mm bolts also. Thought that it would be easy enough. They would be about .040 bigger than the 7mm. I don't have a fender stay out so I'm not sure of any clearance or wall thickness. But I thought it could work.
It's not what you buy, it's what you build.

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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby keithg64 » Wed Mar 02, 2016 7:34 pm

You can use 8mm bolts. You'll have to take the front tire off and front half of the fender and drill out the mounting holes in the forks for clearance for the 8mm bolts. You have to take the fender stay out, do this when you take front fender off, and drill and tap. There is plenty of material. Not a job for everyone but can be done.
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Re: Blacking forkbrace

Postby BikerBuck » Thu Mar 03, 2016 9:11 am

Keithg64, I have 3 1500's to mount these on. With the 8mm option available, I decided to try the stock 1/4 x 28 first. They work surprisingly well and tightened as much as I would have had I used the original 7mm. Always have the option of going to the 8mm if need be. Sometimes I think to much. BTW I grew up down the road from you, Walnut IL. Thanks for the input from everyone. Ride safe!




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