TPM Sensor - Battery?


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dragon2000
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TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby dragon2000 » Sun Nov 24, 2013 10:26 am



I managed to pick up a coujle of new rims for my 09 Wing and got them chromed.

For the rim sensor's, are there any batteries (watch, hearing aid, etc) installed in them? I've looked at the Honda Schematic's and they don't show any. Looking at the sensor's themselves, I and the dealer looked and didn't see any. That said, neither of us wanted to start taking them apart to the point where I needed to purchase a new TPMS ($200.00 cost from dealer).

Just trying to save myself time, perhaps agrevation and funds should the new TPMS sensor's not work once I get everything back together. Any info would be appreciated.

Thanks,


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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby jinx » Sun Nov 24, 2013 2:49 pm

I believe the batteries are not replaceable from the manufacture. I think the normal procedure is to replace the sensor when the battery goes bad. If they are like the ones in by 08 Civic then they will normally last longer than your tires. The batteries in my civic are over 6 years old and the batteries in my Smarttyre are over 8 years old.

I have one that was removed from 2012 rim that I will look at if I can find it.

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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby dragon2000 » Sun Nov 24, 2013 5:52 pm

Thanks Jinx for the info.

I was wasn't sure what the life of the sensors/batteries were. That said, it is a pretty expensive replacement when they are needed.
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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby Sally » Sun Nov 24, 2013 8:11 pm

TPMS the biggest joke ever.. What a money grab for manufracters.I don't care if it's on cars bikes or trucks they're all junk.

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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby jinx » Mon Nov 25, 2013 7:24 am

Although I agree that the ones from the manufacturers are almost useless I will not ride without a good one.
I have ridden with the Smartyre system for over 7 years and and 5 punchers. Unlike the one that comes with
the wing ,almost useless , the Smartyre system tells me the tire pressure and temp of each tire while on the go
and it will warn me if something is wrong. If something is wrong it indicates what. The Honda one gives you
a warning and leaves it up to you to figure it out.

Hopefully in the future the manufacturers will supply systems that are more than idiot lights.

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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby dragon2000 » Mon Nov 25, 2013 9:06 pm

I have the TPMS system on my car and it saved me when I picked up a nail on a trip.

Even though I have the OEM system on my Wing I check tire pressure religiously. Main reason other than safety is to avoid cupping and premature wear. I trusted a dealer once when I got my bike out of storage. Checking tire pressure was one of their todo's. Big mistake not checking their work, it cost me two tires.

The system you have Jinx, IMHO is the one that should be on the Wing if they are going to provide one. Why a GW sensor is $200.00 here vice half for a car is beyond me.
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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby 2008retiredplb » Sun Jun 01, 2014 2:34 pm

The TPM sensor battery is charged or activated by the rotation of the wheel and should not need to be replaced for a long time. Currently they run around $170 each.
I also advise those with the factory TPMS to be sure and have someone that knows how to remove tires from a wheel with the monitors or else you could end up with a situation like I did and the mechanic tuned both monitor units and the rear wheel. I am going to court next week to try and get the $1500 (includes the filing fees) that it cost to repair the damages he inflicted. Actual cost was $900+ (not including the tires which supplied). What a poor excuse for a mechanic. Never again will I try to skimp on repairs by using a non-Honda certified mechanic.
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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby jinx » Sun Jun 01, 2014 5:04 pm

Are you saying that the manufactures TPMS charge the battery while moving ? That would be a sweet setup.

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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby 2008retiredplb » Mon Jun 02, 2014 8:38 am

jinx wrote:Are you saying that the manufactures TPMS charge the battery while moving ? That would be a sweet setup.


No they produce enough energy for the TPMS monitors, therefor they do not have replaceable batteries. I believe they must be replaced when they no longer produce that power.
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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby WingAdmin » Mon Jun 02, 2014 3:33 pm

jinx wrote:Are you saying that the manufactures TPMS charge the battery while moving ? That would be a sweet setup.


No. They have very long-life lithium batteries inside them. They have motion sensors that activate them only when the wheel is actually moving. They are not recharged by the motion of the wheel. Eventually the battery will die, and the sensor will have to be replaced.

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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby 93aspy » Mon Jun 02, 2014 9:57 pm

Although the batteries are not user replaceable, you can replace them... Look at Fred Harmon's pictures of how it's done or you can send your sensor's to him and he will replace the batteries for you... You can find Fred on the GL1800 Riders Forum...

http://www.pbase.com/fredharmon/tiresensor

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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby jinx » Tue Jun 03, 2014 4:34 am

Be careful of fred's info. Some of his info is for entertainment only for a reason. The info he posted in very old news.

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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby 93aspy » Wed Jun 04, 2014 9:16 pm

Hummmmm???? Would you like to explain that comment???

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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby jinx » Thu Jun 05, 2014 5:45 am

Sure the info on replacing the batteries in the tpms has been around for a long time. So it is old news.
I have the DVD's and they are good for entertainment only very little GOOD tech knowledge in them.
In the 8 yrs I've worked on my bike I can't think of once were the info on the DVD's was of any help
and in couple of cases I would call in backyard hillbilly mechanics.

But if you want to risk your ride on that info be my quest.

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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby 93aspy » Fri Jun 06, 2014 8:44 am

Well, guess that depends on your point if view eh Jinx??? I also have Fred's DVD's and consider myself to be a pretty fair wrench both on the 1500 and the 1800 and I never though his dvd's were for "entertainment only" although he says that for liability purposes...

Fred commands a pretty large audience on the GL1800 Riders board and I personally have had a few e-mail conversations with him and my opinion is quite a bit different of him that yours... But hey - ya know what they say ??? Everyone has an opinion - - - and that's fine with me...

Personally, I was just trying to help the OP with his TPMS problem... For myself, when mine go out, I'll change the battery rather than shelling out 200 bucks for a new TPMS sensor...
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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby 2008retiredplb » Fri Jun 06, 2014 3:05 pm

dragon2000 wrote:I managed to pick up a coujle of new rims for my 09 Wing and got them chromed.

For the rim sensor's, are there any batteries (watch, hearing aid, etc) installed in them? I've looked at the Honda Schematic's and they don't show any. Looking at the sensor's themselves, I and the dealer looked and didn't see any. That said, neither of us wanted to start taking them apart to the point where I needed to purchase a new TPMS ($200.00 cost from dealer).

Just trying to save myself time, perhaps agrevation and funds should the new TPMS sensor's not work once I get everything back together. Any info would be appreciated.

Thanks,



With all the messages posted it gets a little confusing with the answer.

If Honda does not show a battery in their parts book, then it is probably not serviceable by a Honda mechanic. That doesn't mean there is not a replaceable battery in the sensors. I would think if you took the sensors off the wheels and put them in new wheels on the same bike you should not have to do anything to them and they should work correctly. You would want to change the o'ring seal on the valve stems any time you remove the stems. Kinda like when you have rubber valve stems you should replace them when you change tires. I don't think there is anything in the service manual stating information on sensor batteries.
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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby WingAdmin » Fri Jun 06, 2014 4:07 pm

2008retiredplb wrote:
dragon2000 wrote:I managed to pick up a coujle of new rims for my 09 Wing and got them chromed.

For the rim sensor's, are there any batteries (watch, hearing aid, etc) installed in them? I've looked at the Honda Schematic's and they don't show any. Looking at the sensor's themselves, I and the dealer looked and didn't see any. That said, neither of us wanted to start taking them apart to the point where I needed to purchase a new TPMS ($200.00 cost from dealer).

Just trying to save myself time, perhaps agrevation and funds should the new TPMS sensor's not work once I get everything back together. Any info would be appreciated.

Thanks,



With all the messages posted it gets a little confusing with the answer.

If Honda does not show a battery in their parts book, then it is probably not serviceable by a Honda mechanic. That doesn't mean there is not a replaceable battery in the sensors. I would think if you took the sensors off the wheels and put them in new wheels on the same bike you should not have to do anything to them and they should work correctly. You would want to change the o'ring seal on the valve stems any time you remove the stems. Kinda like when you have rubber valve stems you should replace them when you change tires. I don't think there is anything in the service manual stating information on sensor batteries.


There is a battery in each sensor, a CR2032 lithium cell. It is soldered permanently into each sensor, and is not (intended to be) replaceable.

That said, if I was faced with paying hundreds of dollars for new sensors vs. $3 for two new CR2032 batteries, I think I would definitely try disassembling the sensors and replacing the batteries. It's not like you have anything to lose. I've replaced "non-replaceable" batteries in many things that I own when faced with having to replace something that still works fine, but just has run out of juice. I've replaced the "non-replaceable" rechargeable batteries in my shaver several times now when they would no longer hold a charge.

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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby Red Ron » Fri Jun 06, 2014 7:42 pm

2008retiredplb wrote:The TPM sensor battery is charged or activated by the rotation of the wheel and should not need to be replaced for a long time. Currently they run around $170 each.
I also advise those with the factory TPMS to be sure and have someone that knows how to remove tires from a wheel with the monitors or else you could end up with a situation like I did and the mechanic tuned both monitor units and the rear wheel. I am going to court next week to try and get the $1500 (includes the filing fees) that it cost to repair the damages he inflicted. Actual cost was $900+ (not including the tires which supplied). What a poor excuse for a mechanic. Never again will I try to skimp on repairs by using a non-Honda certified mechanic.


I was just curious as to what led to the damage or how it occurred. Maybe be able to give my guy a heads up when he mounts and dismounts on my rims.

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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby 2008retiredplb » Fri Jun 06, 2014 10:33 pm

Red Ron wrote:
2008retiredplb wrote:The TPM sensor battery is charged or activated by the rotation of the wheel and should not need to be replaced for a long time. Currently they run around $170 each.
I also advise those with the factory TPMS to be sure and have someone that knows how to remove tires from a wheel with the monitors or else you could end up with a situation like I did and the mechanic tuned both monitor units and the rear wheel. I am going to court next week to try and get the $1500 (includes the filing fees) that it cost to repair the damages he inflicted. Actual cost was $900+ (not including the tires which supplied). What a poor excuse for a mechanic. Never again will I try to skimp on repairs by using a non-Honda certified mechanic.


I was just curious as to what led to the damage or how it occurred. Maybe be able to give my guy a heads up when he mounts and dismounts on my rims.


These are the factory TPM sensors that were broken. The mechanic did not follow the Honda service manual instructions, Tire Pressure Sensor Replacement section, that states:
"When removing and installing the tire, be carful not to damage the tire pressure sensor built into the valve stem."

"Position the wheel so that the valve stem is at least 30°(5 inch) from the bead breaker of a tire mounting machine and break the tire bead to loosen it from the wheel rim."
Than when removing the wheel from the rim on a clockwise tire machine. "Insert a tire lever against the tire rim at 30° (5 inch) counter clockwise from the valve stem.
Lever the bead over the rim, set the tire arm and turn the wheel clockwise to pull the entire bead over the rim.
do not turn the wheel through a full rotation. The entire bead should disengage from the rim before the tire reaches the area of the valve stem.
To disengage the second tire bead from the wheel rim, position the wheel, tire lever and tire arm as described above. Use the same procedure to remove the second bead and remove the tire from the wheel."

I don't have a copy of the installation of the tire, but is is similar in keeping 30° (5 inch) away from the valve stem at all times.

This information is found on pages 26-19 & 26-20 of the Honda Service Manual, updated sometime in 2008.

The wheel damage was caused when he tried to clamp the rim onto the tire machine. The arms that clamp the rim went past the rim edge and into the center of the rim, then while pressing down on the rim to catch the clamps he pressed the valve to move the clamping arms outward and that was what caused the deep scratches in the inside center edge or face of the rim. If you look up my post on "Recovering cost of damages to bike by shop", you will see the photo of the rim.

This was a problem when the mechanics first started changing tires after the bike came out with the factory TPMS. The bead breaker hits the sensors or the valve stem, when the bead comes loose, and it will break one or both pieces. It should not be a problem for an experienced tire change mechanic that has done it before. My mechanic was very careless when he did the procedure. Then tried to blame it on the last person that changed my tires. When we inspected the inside of the rim, you could see where the bead breaker had dented the rim near the sensors and put a ding in the valve stem seating area.
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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby jinx » Sat Jun 07, 2014 6:28 pm

93aspy
I have his DVD's and have a good laugh when I have looked at them . I would not recommend anyone use then to repair their bikes. They are for entertainment only and I take that literally after watching them.

My back ground. I spent a year while in the Air Force working in the motor pool repairing and maintaining the support vehicles for our 52 bombers. Ever rebuilt an engine or transmission ? These were the one that carried the nukes and needed to be up and running if Russia ever attacked us.
I also sent 30 yrs in the hi tech industry as a metrologist ( not a misspelling ). I serviced, repaired, engineered mods as necessary to electronic equipment .

If you want to recommend those DVD's be my guest. Hopefully you will also be there to help the guy who screws up his bike because he listened to your recommendation.

Now I'm done with this. Let this thread go back to the OP's original topic.

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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby Red Ron » Sun Jun 08, 2014 7:34 am

2008retiredPLB; Thanks for the info. I am sorry for what happened in your case. But because you shared it with us it may help others avoid it.

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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby 93aspy » Tue Jun 10, 2014 7:05 pm

Like I said jinx - your entitled to your opinion... :roll:

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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby buztz » Sat Jan 24, 2015 10:32 pm

dragon2000 wrote:I managed to pick up a coujle of new rims for my 09 Wing and got them chromed.

For the rim sensor's, are there any batteries (watch, hearing aid, etc) installed in them? I've looked at the Honda Schematic's and they don't show any. Looking at the sensor's themselves, I and the dealer looked and didn't see any. That said, neither of us wanted to start taking them apart to the point where I needed to purchase a new TPMS ($200.00 cost from dealer).

Just trying to save myself time, perhaps agrevation and funds should the new TPMS sensor's not work once I get everything back together. Any info would be appreciated.

Thanks,


You must replace the entire sensor I just had to have mine replaced on warranty.

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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby Red Ron » Mon Jan 26, 2015 9:23 am

I have respected Fred Harmon's input on other boards for a long time. I think the reason he markets his videos "for entertainment purposes" is to avoid litigation in a "sue" happy society. BTW, if not mentioned, I believe he is now offering a service whereby one can send their tpms sensors to him for the batteries to be replaced.

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Re: TPM Sensor - Battery?

Postby cihilb » Tue Jan 27, 2015 6:21 pm

93aspy wrote:Like I said jinx - your entitled to your opinion... :roll:

Les

I agree with Aspy93. Fred's expertise on the wings is one of the best. He has solved many problems that eluded the best wrenches. He has come up with solutions and shortcuts to a lot of problems. He, along with Techdude, are an asset to the 1800 community.




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