2006 1800 Vibration When Powered at high speeds


Information and questions on GL1800 Goldwings (2001-Present)
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dadiam
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2006 1800 Vibration When Powered at high speeds

Postby dadiam » Mon Jun 23, 2014 10:49 am



I have a 2006, 32K miles, Navi/ABS. I purchased last October as an upgrade for my old and tired 1500.

Lately, I have noticed that the right mirror vibrates so much I can't see anything in it: motorcycles appear as a horizontal white line. The left mirror, while shaking as expected on rough roads, does not vibrate. If I feel the mirror housing and fairing on the right, it, too, is vibrating, and if I hold it hard, the vibration in the mirror stops. The left side does not have this vibration on the fairing or housings.

After reading other threads, I was convinced that the rear tire was out of balance, but I no longer think this is the reason. While riding about about 65mph, the mirror starts its vibration. As I accelerate up to 75+, I can start to feel the bike vibrating. If I let off the throttle, the vibration almost immediately quits. It makes no difference if I coast with the clutch in or out.

This vibration only seems to appear at higher speeds with the engine working: it disappears when coasting. The tires are feathered, and howl like crazy when in any position other than straight up and down. They are Elite 3s, so I am used to the howling. Same as on the 1500.

My best guess is the U-joint??? How big of a job is it to replace? What other things should I look at?

Thank you!


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WingAdmin
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Re: 2006 1800 Vibration When Powered at high speeds

Postby WingAdmin » Mon Jun 23, 2014 2:55 pm

I was thinking "U-Joint" before I even got to the part where you mentioned it.

Unlike the GL1500, the GL1800 U-joint is not replaceable separately from the driveshaft - it is an integral part of the driveshaft, so the whole thing has to be replaced.

GL1800 Driveshaft
GL1800 Driveshaft


The part number for a GL1800 2001 through 2005 is 40200-MCA-010. It is 49cm (19 5/16 inches) long.

The part number for a GL1800 2006 through 2008 is 40200-MCA-A60. It is 51.5cm (20 1/4 inches) long.

Replacement involves removal of the rear wheel and final drive, after which it can be pulled free.

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JerriEric
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Re: 2006 1800 Vibration When Powered at high speeds

Postby JerriEric » Mon Jun 23, 2014 4:21 pm

Interesting explanation stating only one side vibrates. I would think both sides would vibrate unless the vibrating side has a loose bolt on the mirror. I just turned 92,000 on my '06 today and have never experienced this issue. I did do the Trax suspension upgrade at 54,000. I have always run the tire brand that came with the Wings(GL's) I have bought since '76. I just went to Bridgestones at 88,000. So far they seem ok but do not see a big difference from the E3's. I only have 4,000 on them so time will be the deciding factor. I have had my '06 at 125mph with no vibrating issues. Of course that is if you can believe the speedo. Why not take it to a dealer and have a mechanic take it out for a high speed run? I know my dealer would probably do that at no charge.

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2003

Re: 2006 1800 Vibration When Powered at high speeds

Postby flash2002 » Mon Jun 23, 2014 5:28 pm

Hi, I would be suprise that the drive shaft is bad, you only have 32K on the bike, I have 135K on mine and still have the same shaft. If it was the shaft you should feel the vibration at any speed. I'm maybe way off but, is it possible the engine is missing at that speed, in other words one of the spark plugs missing causing the vibration. Maybe the hole problem is tires, but I doubt-it :?: I'm sure there will be someone with a fix.

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MikeB
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Re: 2006 1800 Vibration When Powered at high speeds

Postby MikeB » Mon Jun 23, 2014 10:43 pm

It might be as simple as a loose mirror. I experienced that on my GL1500 a few years ago.
MikeB
Tacoma, WA, USA

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dadiam
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Re: 2006 1800 Vibration When Powered at high speeds

Postby dadiam » Tue Jun 24, 2014 11:40 am

Thank you all for your input!

I checked the mirrors again, and all screws are tight, and there is no rattle in them. I an live the mirror vibration, as it can probably be fixed by adding some weights to dampen it.

Last night I changed the final drive oil. It was definitely old, but I have seen a lot worse. I spun the wheel, and it spun freely (slight drag from the brake as expected). No clicks or ticks, and there is very little slop when in gear and moving the tire back and forth. I pulled sideways and did not feel any give, so I think the swingarm bearings are good.

My concern is the vibration I feel at higher speeds - the mirror vibration is probably a symptom of that. I am taking it to a dealer this afternoon to see what he says. I am getting a new rear tire regardless.

Thanks again, I will post what I find, as I have seen many other similar questions posted about mirror vibrations.
I'd rather fly a Wing than trailer a Harley.
Harley Davidson: For those who prefer to wear a logo than ride a motorcycle.

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JerriEric
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Re: 2006 1800 Vibration When Powered at high speeds

Postby JerriEric » Tue Jun 24, 2014 11:43 am

There was a brake master cylinder recall. Make sure that is checked.

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Re: 2006 1800 Vibration When Powered at high speeds

Postby MikeB » Tue Jun 24, 2014 12:49 pm

After re-reading your post,
If I feel the mirror housing and fairing on the right, it, too, is vibrating, and if I hold it hard, the vibration in the mirror stops. The left side does not have this vibration on the fairing or housings.
Jumps out at me. I know it is far fetched to think that this may be loose but I think checking the mounting of the fairing to the fairing stay and the mounting of the fairing stay to the frame would be in order.

And, since you will be fitting a new rear tire, perhaps try using some Counteract Balance beads or Dyna Beads in lieu of having the tire balanced the conventional way. The beads are easy to install and the tire really doesn't have to be removed to do it.
MikeB
Tacoma, WA, USA

Swadde
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Re: 2006 1800 Vibration When Powered at high speeds

Postby Swadde » Wed Jun 25, 2014 10:04 am

Hello Dadiam,
I think the same as MikeB, want i had the same problem.
I have a 2006 40000KM,

The screw is fast, but the upside from the mirror, sit not in the tabs.

Wenn you now driving and you put your finger on the mirror than you have not the vibraties.
The mirror is not good clicking in the tabs.
You can take the mirror out the house and then you replace the mirror,
with the upside first in the tabs, and than the bottom.

Sorry for me bad Englisch but i come from a other country.

Greetings Swadde.

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dadiam
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Re: 2006 1800 Vibration When Powered at high speeds

Postby dadiam » Wed Jun 25, 2014 11:56 am

Thank you for your input!

I had both tires tires replaced yesterday, and the vibration is still there. I do not necessarily care about the mirror vibrating, but I DO care about the motorcycle vibrating at higher speeds. The mirror vibration is just a symptom that shows the bike starts vibrating at lower speed than I can feel, and it seems to be biased towards the right side.

When I get up to a bout 70-75, the whole bike is vibrating - it is a very strange vibration that almost mast me feel ill. Slightly applying brakes does not make any difference. Letting off the throttle (clutch lever untouched) stops the vibrations (I can feel this), but pulling in the clutch lever does not stop it.

So, my this information, I am thinking it has something to do with the power train AFTER the tranny and AFTER the clutch, and the clutch seems to dampen it when decelerating, or have no effect when the clutch is pulled it.

I have a long trip coming up in a couple of weeks that I need this fixed, as I cannot ride with the vibrations because it is just so annoying and makes me feel "odd".
I'd rather fly a Wing than trailer a Harley.
Harley Davidson: For those who prefer to wear a logo than ride a motorcycle.

"When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own house, his possessions are safe." Luke 11:21

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Re: 2006 1800 Vibration When Powered at high speeds

Postby WingAdmin » Wed Jun 25, 2014 4:26 pm

dadiam wrote:Thank you for your input!

I had both tires tires replaced yesterday, and the vibration is still there. I do not necessarily care about the mirror vibrating, but I DO care about the motorcycle vibrating at higher speeds. The mirror vibration is just a symptom that shows the bike starts vibrating at lower speed than I can feel, and it seems to be biased towards the right side.

When I get up to a bout 70-75, the whole bike is vibrating - it is a very strange vibration that almost mast me feel ill. Slightly applying brakes does not make any difference. Letting off the throttle (clutch lever untouched) stops the vibrations (I can feel this), but pulling in the clutch lever does not stop it.

So, my this information, I am thinking it has something to do with the power train AFTER the tranny and AFTER the clutch, and the clutch seems to dampen it when decelerating, or have no effect when the clutch is pulled it.

I have a long trip coming up in a couple of weeks that I need this fixed, as I cannot ride with the vibrations because it is just so annoying and makes me feel "odd".


This really sounds like the symptoms of a universal joint. If it is that bad that it is vibrating that much, I would not want to do a long trip, because if/when it fails, you will be stranded. If nothing else, pull the rear drive off, pull the driveshaft out, and check the joint for free play. If there's obvious free play, then you have your answer.

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Re: 2006 1800 Vibration When Powered at high speeds

Postby themainviking » Wed Jun 25, 2014 4:27 pm

What Wing Admin said, and then if that is not the problem, here are a few things that popped into my head.

If possible, you need to find out the history of this motorcycle to ensure that it has not been in an accident serious enough to have warped the frame. Barring that, and sorry it has come to it, but a dealership might be able to help you. I personally do not have enough mechanical experience with the GL1800 to even guess what else the problem might be, and all I can think is that the bike is twisted somehow. I hope it turns out to be something much simpler. Writing to Stu Oltman, of Goldwing Magazine, might get you an answer. Whether it will be in time or not is the rub.

When you replaced the front tire, did you torque the axle nut prior to the axle pinch bolts, and did you then only use 16 ft lbs of torque on the pinch bolts? If these are over torqued, theoretically, it can slightly twist the front forks, which could cause an out of alignment condition and so, perhaps vibration. Bearings are another possible culprit, mainly steering head bearings.

As you can tell, I do not have a clue about what could be the actual cause, but these are some things that I believe could contribute.

Oh, one more thing could be the frame to engine mounting. Is it at all possible that it could be loose?
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dadiam
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Re: 2006 1800 Vibration When Powered at high speeds

Postby dadiam » Fri Jun 27, 2014 3:13 pm

This started less than 500 miles ago, did not really notice until I started riding on the highways - it's been very rainy here in MN. I replaced tires on Tues, and made no difference for vibes. Rides better, but still vibrates.

I brought it to one mechanic who rode it and said that he thought it was normal :evil: . I cannot ride it like this. My hands tingle form the vibes going 65. It is NOT normal. Needless to say, not going there again.

Brought it to another, who rode it, and agreed that it was not "normal." He put it on the center-stand and rev'd to about 70mph. He had to shut it off because it was making such a racket.

He is putting on a new shaft and final (he trikes Gold Wings). He thought that it probably was the u-joint, but gave the usual "might not fix it." I also asked him to change plugs while he's got his hands dirty. Plugs first, to see if that fixes it. I am waiting to hear the results. If this does not fix it, guess I will have to start spending the big bucks to tear it all apart.
I'd rather fly a Wing than trailer a Harley.
Harley Davidson: For those who prefer to wear a logo than ride a motorcycle.

"When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own house, his possessions are safe." Luke 11:21

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dadiam
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Re: 2006 1800 Vibration When Powered at high speeds

Postby dadiam » Mon Jun 30, 2014 1:31 pm

Well, I dropped off the bike on Thursday, and picked what seemed to be a brand new one on Saturday! He said he looked at the shaft and knew right away that the U-Joint was the problem. It was toast - I could turn the U_Joint until the "U's" touched!

Replacing this not only totally fixed the vibrations, but also some clunking and slop I had in the clutch while shifting, and a lot of other odd noises.

What a change!

So, two lessons:
1. Listen to your gut and the forums!
2. If a mechanic is not listening or says things you don't agree with, go somewhere else!

Unfortunately, we could not determine any specific causes for the failure.

Thank you all for you input!
I'd rather fly a Wing than trailer a Harley.
Harley Davidson: For those who prefer to wear a logo than ride a motorcycle.

"When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own house, his possessions are safe." Luke 11:21

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Re: 2006 1800 Vibration When Powered at high speeds

Postby WingAdmin » Mon Jun 30, 2014 1:38 pm

Glad to hear that you got it fixed, and now you can go confidently on your long trip!

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Re: 2006 1800 Vibration When Powered at high speeds

Postby MikeB » Mon Jun 30, 2014 1:40 pm

Excellent. Good to know you got it taken care of.
MikeB
Tacoma, WA, USA

Swadde
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Re: 2006 1800 Vibration When Powered at high speeds

Postby Swadde » Mon Jun 30, 2014 2:25 pm

Good luck with your trip en the Goldwing.

Greetings Swadde.

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dadiam
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Re: 2006 1800 Vibration When Powered at high speeds

Postby dadiam » Mon Aug 18, 2014 2:27 pm

*** More Updates...

After traveling about 3000 miles on our trip, I noticed a leak from under the dog-bone-shaped thing hanging from the swing arm just in front of where it connects to the Final Drive. To make a long story short, The local Honda dealer was helpful, but unable to do anything. So filling the FD every night became part of our nightly routine. Glad it was hypoid leaking instead of motor oil!

Also, I noticed a rumble when I let off the throttle. This was dampened if I pushed it off all the way to force engine breaking. Hitting the throttle again also dampened it. This got slightly worse for the remainder of the trip.

With the bike on center-stand, and in gear, the FD really rattled! I Ordered another used FD and Shaft from a trike takeoff (Zero miles - like new). I though if I was going to put in a new FD, might as well do the shaft as well. I got the FD off, and pulled the shaft out. I found the place in the FD where it was leaking: the seal was "oozing" out around the shaft. I also compared the the new shaft against what I pulled out, and found the shaft was not only rather rusty and old, but was the older shorter version. Glad I checked it!

The FD I took off seemed to be OK otherwise - did not have much more slop than the new one, but will donate it to my son's tech-ed teacher.

I am now putting it all back together, and HOPE that I can enjoy the bike with no further incidences!

****The question I have, is that when I took the old FD off, the upper left bolt had a crush washer on it. There is an indent in the end of the swing arm for this as well. The shop manual does not show this, and I have not seen it on any other posts. Is this required? I don't see any purpose for the washer there, except to maybe keep some pressure on the bolt??

The upper left has an indent for a crush washer????????
The upper left has an indent for a crush washer????????




3 Tips I found while doing this that might be helpful to others replacing the final drive:
1. The rear wheel can be loosened and taken off the final drive without removing it. While removing it does give a lot more room, the wheel can stay in the tire well. I have a hitch that makes it hard to remove the wheel, and lifting the bike back onto the center stand after laying the bike down to remove the wheel is nearly impossible. If you can, remove the wheel completely, but it can be done with the wheel in place. Since I so not have a lift, I did lay the bike on the side to get to the wheel. I took it completely out, which made it pretty easy to get to the inner 2 nuts. I then put the wheel back on with 2 lug nuts, which then made it possible to get the bike back up on the center stand with. Once on the stand, tie it in place to ensure that the bike does not roll off. I then took off those 2 lug nuts.
2. Removing the saddlebag is not necessary, and I do not really see how it could give you more room unless you take off all the support brackets as well. The muffler does need to come off, and possibly part of the hitch, depending on what type you have.
3. The upper right nut on the final drive (outside top) is a bugger to get to. There is not enough room to get a ratchet in place. and there is not enough room to get at it and get enough torque with a normal wrench. I found that using a 12-pt box-end on the nut, with a second box-end hooked on the free end works very well as an extension (My dad showed me this trick he learned "on the farm"). You can just put a foot on the second wrench and step down on it to very easily loosen it. My picture of this did not turn out, so I will add a picture of this trick later. Make sure you do not use cheap wrenches, as this puts a lot of strain on them. Be careful the bike does not tip over when you do this as well - the nuts are very tight!


Original shaft on top, Second shaft in center, and new shaft on bottom.
Original shaft on top, Second shaft in center, and new shaft on bottom.


Original shaft - notice the "U's" are touching!
Original shaft - notice the "U's" are touching!


The point of failure for the seal.
The point of failure for the seal.


I'd rather fly a Wing than trailer a Harley.
Harley Davidson: For those who prefer to wear a logo than ride a motorcycle.

"When a strong man, fully armed, guards his own house, his possessions are safe." Luke 11:21


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