Positive wire to battery SHORTED (Bad Rectifier or Relay)


Information and questions on GL1800 Goldwings (2001-Present)
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TopGunPilot
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Joined: Sun Jul 06, 2014 12:04 am
Motorcycle: 2002 Honda Goldwing GL1800

Positive wire to battery SHORTED (Bad Rectifier or Relay)

Postby TopGunPilot » Sat Sep 13, 2014 12:49 am



Bad relay? But there are 4 of them.... :-(

(I DO HAVE AN Argus Battery Bug hooked up-5 years now)..
Pre-empt, I've been in electronics for 50 years, college, fixed computers, radios, anything with a solder joint, I have fixed it...
(All of my Wiring is protected with wire loom or fuel line in the hot spots next to the engine.)

Last Wednesday, I dropped her during PLP. Two ladies walked up right to the cones, I said shoot, and let her go down.
My front strobes went out. Checked the next day and found the wires burned up inside the switch (no real reason).
REPLACE ALL, it was good day before yesterday, working fine.

I fired up the 2002 GL1800 yesterday, did my normal routine of checking lights, BLEW THE AIR horns etc. and lights flashed and she died.
Found a blown fuse, replaced it. Nothing. No power, no lights, nothing.

Checked Red Wire to battery and it showed to be shorted to ground.
ON the meter (not a DVM), it was like holding the two leads together.

Disconnected the air horns, wires to strobes, everything I could that was electrical. Still shorted.

Pulled the red wire going to + side of battery off of fuse box. STILL SHORTED.

While meter connected, disconnected ONE WIRE ON the first relay next to the battery and the short went away.
GOOD, I said.
Connected the wire back to the relay (BUT NOT THE FUSE BOX YET), and all was normal.

During this process, I checked the Rectifier mounted below the battery. All 3 connections showed they were grounded.
This puzzles me.
IS THIS NORMAL? I checked it both ways =/- and -/+ to ground. Shorted both ways.

Anyway, when I hooked everything back up, the short was back. It starts fine now, runs fine, everything electrical works great.

I have never seen a Red wire show a short when you touch the - wire from the meter to the frame IN MY LIFE!

FOR NOW, THE BATTERY IS DISCONNECTED, WAITING ON THE PRO'S TO HELP ME OUT!
Thanks, Top Gun


TopGunPilot
Over 150,000 miles/48 years safe riding/over 10 bikes, more than 40 + Motorcycle Training classes.

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WingAdmin
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Re: Positive wire to battery SHORTED (Bad Rectifier or Relay

Postby WingAdmin » Mon Sep 15, 2014 9:03 am

I have a couple of questions. I'm not familiar with what you're calling the rectifier - being that the GL1800's rectifier is built into the alternator.

Also, with the DVM, when seeing the short, are you measuring ohms from the positive wire to ground, and seeing zero ohms?

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TopGunPilot
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Joined: Sun Jul 06, 2014 12:04 am
Motorcycle: 2002 Honda Goldwing GL1800

Re: Positive wire to battery SHORTED (Bad Rectifier or Relay

Postby TopGunPilot » Mon Sep 15, 2014 10:06 am

WingAdmin wrote:I have a couple of questions. I'm not familiar with what you're calling the rectifier - being that the GL1800's rectifier is built into the alternator.

Also, with the DVM, when seeing the short, are you measuring ohms from the positive wire to ground, and seeing zero ohms?


Depends on who you talk to. Some call it a Rectifier, others call it Voltage Regulator.
http://www.ebay.ca/itm/2003-Honda-GoldWing-GL-1800-Voltage-Regulator-Rectifier-/360849774302?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item54045296de&vxp=mtr

FYI, I don't use DVM's, it is a MultiMeter. It is set on ohms.
It is a standard Meter (with a needle). You touch the Red and Black wire together and the needle goes all the way to the right. Same thing happens on when I touch a ("Disconnected or Connected" Red Wire/Hot Wire/Positive Wire) with the Red or Black lead from the Meter to ground on the bike or to the black wire (- Negative) on the bike.

I've never seen this before but every bike I checked yesterday (20 or more were like that).
I'm old, senile and have had Brain Surgery but I never remember this happening in my life.
What I remember is is the Positive Wire is disconnected and it shows CONTINUITY to Ground, there was a problem. Hmmmm...

If this is the case, then I know 5 brand new Harley Davidson Bikes, 10 used ones, and 5 Honda Goldwings that have a problem.

BTW, it's all back together and running fine now. I just don't understand why the 3 Wires going into the Rectifier/Voltage Regulator all show CONTINUITY to ground when measured both ways. A Rectifier should show it one direction but not the other unless it is shorted out.



The picture of the needle all the way to the right is what I saw on all 20 bikes yesterday.
Same as touching both "Leads" to the same metal object....
http://www.allaboutcircuits.com/vol_6/chpt_2/2.html
TopGunPilot
Over 150,000 miles/48 years safe riding/over 10 bikes, more than 40 + Motorcycle Training classes.

Techdude2000
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Location: Lexington, KY
Motorcycle: 2004 GL1800

Re: Positive wire to battery SHORTED (Bad Rectifier or Relay

Postby Techdude2000 » Mon Sep 15, 2014 4:48 pm

I explained this over on the Gl1800riders board. It's not a rectifier, it's a resistor assembly that is connected to the starter motor and you will read a near dead short on its wires to ground. This is because you are reading a very low resistance of the resistors in series with a very low resistance of the starter motor's windings directly to it's case and the bike's ground circuit. The Ebay listings that call it a rectifier are listed by folks that don't know what they have.(reverse resistor assembly) I've sent numerous emails to some of them correcting them, but there's always more that show up using the wrong name for it. The heat sink fins on it make them think they are selling a rectifier. :roll:

I believe you have damaged your meter by trying to measure the resistance of the battery cables while the battery was connected and now your meter reads a short on everything you try it on.




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