GWRRA Members ???


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What do you think of GWRRA?

I like it fine the way things are, they're going in the right direction
49
7%
Wing World is one big advertisement
108
16%
Wing Ding is a huge money grab
99
15%
I'm not a member, and don't care to be
74
11%
I appreciate the ads in Wing World, I like seeing products that are available for my bike
94
14%
I can't stand all the expanding trike coverage in Wing World
59
9%
I won't be renewing my membership
41
6%
I love my local chapter, that's what it's all about
83
12%
I look forward to Wing Ding all year
13
2%
I'm only a member for the Gold Book/Rescue Plus
49
7%
 
Total votes: 669

1500 Hold Out
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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by 1500 Hold Out » Mon Dec 02, 2013 10:27 am



Have been a member since 1998 until 2014+? Have held only one office during that time period. Took the required officer course to maintain officer credentials. Don't like the way the Rider's Level program has been trashed by upper management in the last few years. Upper levels don't respond to the rank and file members. Chapter membership is declining due to childish bickering and grudges as well as lack of active leadership. [Do "Grownups" ever really learn to "live and let live" or "agree to disagree"? ]Our chapter hasn't had any chapter rides or events this year and only one or two last year. Group gatherings once a month, unless the CD decides to cancel and nothing else. Some of the few remaining members are actively visiting other chapters without our CD's input. We'll see what happens this upcoming year, considering becoming a member-at-large.



wingrider231
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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by wingrider231 » Mon Dec 02, 2013 12:54 pm

I am not a member I once aproched a group of gwrra members getting ready to participate in a prade and inquired about becoming a member and was rather snobbishly told I needed to ride a gold wing , they asked what I rode and I stated I rode a 1200 wing at the time and they gave me a card for a point of contact and then ignored me and went on talking to each other , I do however get copies of old wing magizines 3-7 years old by time they make it to me but I do enjoy stu's articials they have helped me out in certain times and made me aware of other thing to be on lookout for , prefer to come to this site for more detailed info. currently own 1500 wing and average 10k miles plus a year

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Wolfie666
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1972 Honda CB750K2
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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by Wolfie666 » Mon Dec 02, 2013 12:57 pm

OK, my story....
The year was 1982, and I just bought my first wing.
A new chapter just started in the Pittsburg area, I can't remember if it was "D" or "E"...
Anyway, there was this ride...
So I invited my father, who rode a '81 Honda CBX, and his friend who rode a HD Dresser....
Some of the group were none too happy that my dad and his friend showed up...
So while about 1/2 way into the ride, the Harley broke a rear wheel bearing...
We all stopped, and the "leader" of the group stated "You are lucky, you broke down near this gas station,
and you aren't a member anyway, so we are continuing or ride... And they just left...
So... My dad and I stayed with him... and as luck would have it, one of the folks at the gas station lived a couple
doors down, and was a HD guy. He said he had bearings, and we should all go to his place and get it fixed.
So... while working on the bike, the guy offers us a cold beer, which we took...
So, the original group stopped by on thier way back and the only thing thier "leader" had to say was...
"Do you folks really feel the need to be having a beer!"
I exchanged a word or two and that was the last time I had anything to do with them.
the end.

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canuck623
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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by canuck623 » Mon Dec 02, 2013 4:22 pm

Wolfie666 wrote:OK, my story....
The year was 1982, and I just bought my first wing.
A new chapter just started in the Pittsburg area, I can't remember if it was "D" or "E"...
Anyway, there was this ride...
So I invited my father, who rode a '81 Honda CBX, and his friend who rode a HD Dresser....
Some of the group were none too happy that my dad and his friend showed up...
So while about 1/2 way into the ride, the Harley broke a rear wheel bearing...
We all stopped, and the "leader" of the group stated "You are lucky, you broke down near this gas station,
and you aren't a member anyway, so we are continuing or ride... And they just left...
So... My dad and I stayed with him... and as luck would have it, one of the folks at the gas station lived a couple
doors down, and was a HD guy. He said he had bearings, and we should all go to his place and get it fixed.
So... while working on the bike, the guy offers us a cold beer, which we took...
So, the original group stopped by on thier way back and the only thing thier "leader" had to say was...
"Do you folks really feel the need to be having a beer!"
I exchanged a word or two and that was the last time I had anything to do with them.
the end.

That's too bad they dissed you over having different bikes. Back in 82 things were different as far as bike ownership. No so much now. Anything is welcome. The only Goldwing provision is if you want to be a CD of a chapter. As far as the group ride as a road captain I have never refused anyone. I might ask someone that has a very loud bike (pipes) to ride near the back of the group so as not to cause everyone to listen to them but that's it. When the Harley broke down the GW guideline for group riding says the tail gunner should stop with the disabled bike and the rest of the group should carry on down the road. They can choose to stop at a safe place or not. That's up to the lead rider. About the beer. Well that's a no no if you are riding in a group and even if you are just by yourself. I have nothing against beer, I enjoy a cold one now and then but NEVER if I am going to be on the wing the same day. Yyour expectaion was different than the actual group ride guidelines. I hear so much about the way CD's run chapters in the great east and it makes me wonder why there are any members left east of the Mississippi. Give it a try again. Get a 2 month trial going and see if things are different now.
All that aside I used to have an 82 CBX. Pearl white and fast. Sure wish I had kept it instead of selling it to get my first GW.
Last edited by canuck623 on Mon Dec 02, 2013 4:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
2008 GL1800
1990 GL1500
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1972 CB750
1966 305 Dream

Paulcf
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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by Paulcf » Mon Dec 02, 2013 4:25 pm

I read their magazine a few times, nothing new or helpful in it...in fact I enjoy GoldwingDocs much more...more timely, more tasteful and most importantly, folks who really do want to help you.

GWRRA is facing the demise of print...face it, it's a digital world out there and forums like this one are far superior. I can search for whatever topic I want and 9 times out of 10, there's someone talking about it and someone willing to help! Plus it's up to date and can include videos/links, etc. that print medium can't touch.

I'm a solo rider and frankly I don't have time for rallies, poker runs, badges or such farkles...I live to ride and with such a short season here, I can't wait up on a group to ride with me, nor can they keep up with my distances...you do what you have to here with 4-5 months of decent riding season (reduced by freakish weather and this thing called 'work').

Organizations such as GWRRA usually start off with lofty goals and get mired in bureaucracy and such. I dismiss it all, and go for a ride on the World's Best Luxury Touring Motorcycle, a GoldWing (of any year/vintage).

Enjoy the open road!

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WheezyRider
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Re: GWRRA just don't get it

Post by WheezyRider » Mon Dec 02, 2013 5:58 pm

I happen to be the first person to ride a GL1800 literally round-the-world … two-up, 2 yrs trip, some 40+ countries.

En route I wrote a 100% non-commercial blog which is well followed. Lots of pictures and technical details which might be of interest to Wingers. So I wrote the GWRRA President in 2009, just offering up the web site in case their readers might be interested.

The web site still has a strong following worldwide 5 years later. It is WheezyRider.com

I wanted nothing, no money -- just an offer to the Winger community to follow this 'enduro' trip on what most consider a highway cruiser only. I was proving otherwise, at considerable personal risk and expense. Plus I was 63 yrs old at the time!

Moreover I was trying to be helpful to THEM, GWRRA. Silly me, I thought GWRRA would be interested in promoting themselves and the Goldwing brand, for free! Piggy back on me. Go ahead … free content for your magazine and web site, decent writing skills, photos/videos included. Plus I was already mid-trip, so it was no long shot.

Was GWRRA interested?
Not even a little bit.
Instead they were quite rude and dismissive. I told them so.

No money in it for them! So who cares? That was the 'tude.
But they were wrong, there was money in it for them -- the blog has sold quite a few Goldwings unintentionally. And other items/locations I endorsed. I hear of it often. It could have marketed GWRRA collegiality and slightly changed the Goldwing 'old man's bike' image even more.

Well, so far I'm at 50+ countries on the same 2006 black GL1800 which looks and runs like new.
140,000 km on the clock, much of it on third-world roads of gravel, mud and sand -- in 2nd-3rd gear for days at a time.
Plus autobahns at 100 mph.
Fantastic machine. It's my 20th motorcycle or so (many BMWs) and finally my keeper bike.

Last summer we rode two-up 18,000 km from Moroccan Sahara desert to Norwegian Arctic Circle.

Who cares? Many adventuresome Wingers would care.
They like raiding stories and new riding ideas.
But not GWRRA as the iron but riders' magazine.

Somehow we managed to do all that riding without GWRRA interest.
They also didn't get mine!

Big opportunity they screwed up, not just in my case, but for the Wing industry's dramatic promotion.
It could be a fine organization of enthusiasts.
For me it's just a self-promotional advertising rag.
Only RTW rider on GL1800
Inventor/manufacturer of HandGuards™

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cbx4evr
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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by cbx4evr » Mon Dec 02, 2013 6:01 pm

canuck623 wrote: All that aside I used to have an 82 CBX. Pearl white and fast. Sure wish I had kept it instead of selling it to get my first GW.

I had an 81, actually an 80 too. (pictures in the gallery). Didn't sell it to get a Goldwing but it sure was a fun bike. Wasn't a great two up bike though, which was the motivator for getting a wing.
"It´s a friggen motorcycle, it´s not supposed to be comfortable, quiet or safe. The wind noise is supposed to hurt your ears, the seat should be hard and riding it should make you s**t your pants every now and then. "

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cbx4evr
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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by cbx4evr » Mon Dec 02, 2013 6:06 pm

Welcome Wheezy. I'll have to check your web site out. Sounds like a good way to spend a winter afternoon.

I too have gotten "tude" from GWRRA. Everytime I have had reason to contact them via email the response I get is cold and abrupt. Not exactly what I would have expected from something I support financially.
"It´s a friggen motorcycle, it´s not supposed to be comfortable, quiet or safe. The wind noise is supposed to hurt your ears, the seat should be hard and riding it should make you s**t your pants every now and then. "

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canuck623
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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by canuck623 » Mon Dec 02, 2013 6:56 pm

cbx4evr wrote:
canuck623 wrote: All that aside I used to have an 82 CBX. Pearl white and fast. Sure wish I had kept it instead of selling it to get my first GW.

I had an 81, actually an 80 too. (pictures in the gallery). Didn't sell it to get a Goldwing but it sure was a fun bike. Wasn't a great two up bike though, which was the motivator for getting a wing.
Yes the two up comfort was my motivation to look to a wing. I got an 83 and am now on an 1800, my 4th wing. I wish I could have kept them both.
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Sally
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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by Sally » Mon Dec 02, 2013 7:18 pm

WOW :o When I started this post I never figured that it would have so many post and to read how people feel about the gwrra amazed me. I think after reading these post and how you guys feel I will not be renewing next April either. I was leaning that way anyways. I think I'm just to young for this group anyways only 47 I don't have a lot in common with the older group I found out.I stop joining groups years ago because it seem that 3 or 4 in the group did everything an the others just wanted to bitch about what them 3 or 4 did and how they run thing but no one would step up to make changes just complain.. I'm out.. Sally :shock: :shock:

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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by windrider » Mon Dec 02, 2013 7:34 pm

I was a Member, but no more. When I pay my dues every year, and have no say in club matters ,something is wrong.
The gwrra has no member input other than the chapter directors , their word is law. To me it's not right. I feel any paying member should have a vote in club matters.

GWRRA says no!

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Sally
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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by Sally » Mon Dec 02, 2013 7:47 pm

I agree voting would be great... Also I forgot in my last post THANKS Wheezyrider I will be reading about your trip I love to read story of others rides.. I find that a pet pee of mine. If anyone has stories of ride they took and have a post of web site let us know. Maybe I should start a post No I will stories about our ride ya that sound good..

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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by cbx4evr » Mon Dec 02, 2013 9:41 pm

I reviewed my first post in response to this thread and realized I neglected make one point which in my case was the actual reason I joined.

When I bought my 1500 the purpose was for two up travelling. One thing I soon realized was that this bike was a bit of a beast. I had owned an 80 CBX which too was a big bike to handle. It was actually my starter bike getting into biking at a late age in life. I once met a riding instructor who also owned a CBX and he suggested I might want to find something smaller to learn on. Well I just blew that comment away and carried on. Fast forward a few years and my riding changes to a KLR 650 dual sport. Man what a difference from riding a CBX I could actually handle the thing instead of it handling me.

Fast forward again and we get a GL1500. I rode it alone for a bit before the wife joined me adding even more to the bike handling. I realized I had to do something to gain some more confidence on the bike. I started doing some research into riding classes and that is actually when I learned about the existence of GWRRA. As it turned out the Chapter Rider Educator happened to live in the same town as I. I gave him a call and 30 minutes later he had picked me up and was buying me coffee. He told me about the Advanced Riding Courses that were available and the Parking Lot Practices. Sounded good to me so I signed up and we are the best of friends from this chance meeting.

For me those riding courses have been the biggest benefit of membership in GWRRA. The volunteers in our Chapter doing these courses and giving freely of their time to enhance your abilities are in a word fantastic people. I know I've benefited from it. After taking the courses my wife even commented that I was handling the bike a lot better.

I just wanted to add a positive comment. A lot of the time the negatives are front and center. Yes there are some things I don't like about GWRRA but then the same can be said for the corporation I worked for, the government etc.
"It´s a friggen motorcycle, it´s not supposed to be comfortable, quiet or safe. The wind noise is supposed to hurt your ears, the seat should be hard and riding it should make you s**t your pants every now and then. "

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Kactus59
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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by Kactus59 » Mon Dec 02, 2013 10:50 pm

I have been a member of GWRRA for 5 years I guess, the same time I upgraded to my Wing. I enjoy the magazine for the tips and tricks as well as the submitted articles from members trips and such. I don't mind some of the advertisements and as a matter of fact I learned of a new product that was advertised and I purchased it and there is another article that was brought to light that I will follow and it will most likely prompt me to purchase or upgrade to that. The magazine is valuable to those that read into it. I do not belong to a chapter and at the time desire not to. I am a member of the Benevolent and Protective Order of Elks and have been CEO of my Lodge for 2 years and give back to my community through those avenues. I dedicate a lot of time to raise a lot of money to give a lot away! I love to ride my 1500 se as often as the weather permits. My wife and I used to each have a bike and we sold off and never looked back. I love to ride two up together and sometimes reading some of the GWRRA members stories gets us heading out the door and riding off. I agree with too much hype over the Wing Ding but hey, I go to Laconia every year, eventually I WILL make it to Wing Ding. Got my sights set on Sturgis first though! :D

sweimer
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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by sweimer » Mon Dec 02, 2013 11:33 pm

I was a member years ago but lost interest in it,to many chiefs and not enough Indians. Also to expensive.

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HALBUDD
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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by HALBUDD » Mon Dec 02, 2013 11:34 pm

I am a member for now,but cant stand that all the advertisement is about 1800s. There are more older Goldwings out there then 1800s. I do like the gold book and the rescue plan but so far have not needed to use either one.I have been to Wing Ding and I did like seeing all the bikes that members where riding and some cool stuff. I dont ride with the local chapter as I only ride with one group and thats the Patriot Guard on missions I dont have to worry about any body clowning around. So I dont think I will be renewing my membership this year unless things change.-----------------Hal
A woman that can use tools is worth her weight in gold !!

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paysnoattn
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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by paysnoattn » Tue Dec 03, 2013 6:37 pm

My wife and I were members for 2 years. Next time, I'll just do a single's renewal to keep the magazine and gold book. The local chapters in our area are all about themselves. There is never a word about local charity event such as Toys For Tots, or any activity not directly tied to the GWRRA. After being told last time I arrived for a chapter ride not dressed in ATGATT, that I had to ride separate from everyone else because they considered my attire hazardous and a bad example, I haven't been back. The current membership of both chapters are an aging clique-centric group of bitter old couples who's only claim to fame is how many christmas ornaments they can get to hang from their non-functional decorative vests. The GWRRA seems to be all about milking their membership of every dollar of disposable income, without returning anything back to the communities that tolerate them.

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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by redial » Tue Dec 03, 2013 7:48 pm

As you are most likely aware, I live in Australia. We do not have a Chapter of GWRRA here, at all! So why am I still a member, you might ask?

Information, how-to, and information (you can never get enough info). I originally joined for the information :roll: , and went to a Wing Ding, and next time I go to the USA, I will go to another Wing Ding. Why, you might well ask? We are starved of add-ons, customising, and good things to have, because there are so few GW sold in Oz. The reason, probably price tag! You can buy two new small cars for the price of one new GW!

I bought my GW from Ronn Moss (one of the stars of the Bold and the Beautiful), and have not been able to get much out of it, mainly because it is in OK, and I am in South Australia. I want to get it triked, and the USA range of trikes is much superior to what we have here, but, until I get around to selling my motorhome/RV, I really cannot afford to have it triked and brought to Oz. So in the meantime, I have a Honda 250 to go into the villages nearby to get my fix; or, if I would like to wander up to Darwin (3 000Km/2 000miles), I could have a ride on my brother's BMW road bike.

So I joined GWRRA, for information, and eventually found a few other sites, like GoldwingDocs, and think that I have found the right place for knowledge, info, how-to, and comradeship, which all seem to have disappeared from GWRRA. I shall remain a member for the time being, but I dont believe in paying for something and not getting any benefits in return. Even the GoldBook is not very useful to me, and the magazine is getting too full of non-relevant adds (like watches, jewellery, and other non-motorcycle relevant items). It is the only organisation that I belong to that does not have an Annual General Meeting, where the membership can bring up matters, either directly or through their delegate - who is my delegate/regional director? I feel orphaned.
Len in Kapunda

The world is not going to finish today, as it is already tomorrow in Australia and New Zealand, and other islands of foreign nations such as Guam and Samoa.

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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by finnrider » Tue Dec 03, 2013 9:02 pm

paysnoattn wrote:There is never a word about local charity event such as Toys For Tots, or any activity not directly tied to the GWRRA.
At last year's Christmas party we opted to not have a gift exchange but rather take up a collection for a local home for abused children. The Director came and spoke to us. One of the best Christmas parties ever.
After being told last time I arrived for a chapter ride not dressed in ATGATT, that I had to ride separate from everyone else because they considered my attire hazardous and a bad example, I haven't been back.
That's a tough one. One of the three top priorities of GWRRA is stressing safety, which means ATGATT. Do you really expect the chapter and its members who believe 100% in the value of proper riding gear to disregard a core belief just because you weren't adhering to it? Why weren't you dressed with ATG? Was it because that was a riding requirement you were unaware of, or do you choose to ride without all the safety gear? If you wanted to ride without a helmet, and/or without adequate gloves or a crash jacket or with tennis shoes, I'm not sure I would want you along either, particularly if the ride is a sanctioned chapter ride. If you have a wreck and get injured or killed, GWRRA could very well have a liability lawsuit on its hands because they failed to enforce a riding principle they preach. Now, if you weren't wearing chaps or crash pants but at least long jeans, then they were overboard in their reaction, IMO. In any case I imagine the situation could have been handled more diplomatically.

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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by cbx4evr » Tue Dec 03, 2013 10:35 pm

finnrider wrote:That's a tough one. One of the three top priorities of GWRRA is stressing safety, which means ATGATT.

Whoa there just a minute. You didn't have to come on so strong.

I'd like to know what the definition of ATGATT is by GWRRA standards or any other for that matter. Seems to me that every individual rider has a different definition of ATGATT. I know what mine is but am confused about others.

Part of that confusion is what ATGATT message the GWRRA is trying to send. In every issue of WingWorld I have recieved I see pictures of people riding in either short sleeves, no gloves, low shoes, blue jeans and nylon wind breakers either individually or in combination. To me neither of those pieces of "gear" can be defined as ATGATT or should they qualify in some category of safety from GWRRA.

I questioned our Chapter Safety Educator about this and was told that the minimum standard was blue jeans and that's as far as it went. Then there was the time we were in South Dakota and I watched the Chapter Director drive away without a helmet. What kind of message are you trying to send there??

Personally as far as ATGATT goes the GWRRA is a long way from it. It's very hypocritical to preach one thing and then publish a magazine that shows otherwise. I know I'm not the only one that feels this way.

.
"It´s a friggen motorcycle, it´s not supposed to be comfortable, quiet or safe. The wind noise is supposed to hurt your ears, the seat should be hard and riding it should make you s**t your pants every now and then. "

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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by finnrider » Tue Dec 03, 2013 11:34 pm

cbx4evr wrote:I'd like to know what the definition of ATGATT is by GWRRA standards or any other for that matter. Seems to me that every individual rider has a different definition of ATGATT. I know what mine is but am confused about others.
From page C-8 of the GWRRA Rider Education Program Handbook, 11th Edition, January 2013:
Wear proper riding apparel at all times while riding. Proper riding apparel, a.k.a.: proper riding “gear” will in-clude, at a minimum, a DOT approved helmet, eye protection, long sleeved jacket/shirt (no "riding pull on/off sleeves"), long legged sturdy pants, full fingered gloves and over the ankle footwear. Some have coined the acronym ATGATT standing for All the Gear, All the Time.
GWRRA instructor PPT slides also include the comment, "Only cover those parts of the body you wish to use later in life"
cbx4evr wrote:Part of that confusion is what ATGATT message the GWRRA is trying to send. In every issue of WingWorld I have recieved I see pictures of people riding in either short sleeves, no gloves, low shoes, blue jeans and nylon wind breakers either individually or in combination. To me neither of those pieces of "gear" can be defined as ATGATT or should they qualify in some category of safety from GWRRA.

I questioned our Chapter Safety Educator about this and was told that the minimum standard was blue jeans and that's as far as it went. Then there was the time we were in South Dakota and I watched the Chapter Director drive away without a helmet. What kind of message are you trying to send there??

Personally as far as ATGATT goes the GWRRA is a long way from it. It's very hypocritical to preach one thing and then publish a magazine that shows otherwise. I know I'm not the only one that feels this way.
You say every issue of WW. I have to take exception to that because I just looked at the July and Sept 2013 issues. There are no pictures that I see showing riders on a moving bike who are not dressed properly. Several photos show riders posing with their bikes without helmets, etc., but does that mean they ride without them? No way to know without asking them. One photo shows a guy riding his bike off of a ferry without a helmet, but probably everyone of us has ridden our bikes across the parking lot without a helmet. But seminars I've been in even that has been roundly criticized as not being safe.

If you can cite specific issues and pages of WW that show riders without ATG on moving bikes, then I wholeheartedly endorse the idea that we call GWRRA on it. If in fact what you are saying is correct, then it is hypocritical. I just haven't noticed that being the case.

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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by redial » Wed Dec 04, 2013 1:05 am

Does the ATGATT principle apply to the advertisements as well? If so the Bushtec add with the rider on his yellow GW pulling a yellow trailer is one where the t-shirt and bare arms are prominent.

Gloves should go all the way, and not stop half-way along the fingers. And from the couple of random WingWorld magazines that I selected, these are obvious in the photos. So the full-fingered gloves are optional? - especially in the hot weather?

You can still get road rashes in the hot weather!

As for riding the mc from a ferry without a helmet, the obvious place for a spill is where the ferry ends and the land begins. I do not ride even the short 10 metres to the front gate without my helmet on and strapped on. Slackness is no excuse when riding, so do the job properly and get covered.
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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by finnrider » Wed Dec 04, 2013 2:23 am

redial wrote:Does the ATGATT principle apply to the advertisements as well? If so the Bushtec add with the rider on his yellow GW pulling a yellow trailer is one where the t-shirt and bare arms are prominent.

Gloves should go all the way, and not stop half-way along the fingers. And from the couple of random WingWorld magazines that I selected, these are obvious in the photos. So the full-fingered gloves are optional? - especially in the hot weather?
Which issue are you looking at? The Bushtec ad in the July issue shows the riders properly attired. I find no Bushtec ad in the Sept issue. I do see some ads showing riders w/o proper gear, but guess what? They are all on Harleys! As we all know Harley riders are known for being rebels.

Ideally, even the riders in ads should be wearing proper gear, but I'm sure the rejoinder will be that, as in all print media, the act of selling advertising space in no way implies an endorsement of the product or service being advertised. Sadly, it looks like money trumps principle at WW as it does in almost all of the business world. In the fight for business survival pragmatism wins over principle. Doesn't make it right, it just is.

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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by redial » Wed Dec 04, 2013 8:42 am

The ATGATT principle has been around for a while, and the WW that I randomly selected was Jul11. Sure it is a couple of years old, but that should not detract from the principle. Money talks, and to hell with principles - is that how advertising works? You dont see temperance organisations taking ads for alcohol, do you? So why should WW take ads that are against their principles?

For that matter, in the latest edition (Dec13), there are ads that I would not expect to find in a motorcycle publication. (For example, P41, the ad for Nerium; p3, the add for Gravity Defyer (shoes that do not cover the ankles); p17, jewelery ad; p21, ad for an eczema Natures Rite Rash Relief. What is GWRRA promoting? No wonder the members are complaining about the magazine.

On p98 there are two examples of riders, and their passengers, not wearing gloves. They appear to be stopped, as I have found it very difficult to take a photo of myself while riding, and even if I passed my camera for someone else to take the photo, I would not be driving off. So yes, it could be inconclusive.
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Re: GWRRA Members ???

Post by cbx4evr » Wed Dec 04, 2013 11:37 am

finnrider wrote: From page C-8 of the GWRRA Rider Education Program Handbook, 11th Edition, January 2013:
Wear proper riding apparel at all times while riding. Proper riding apparel, a.k.a.: proper riding “gear” will in-clude, at a minimum, a DOT approved helmet, eye protection, long sleeved jacket/shirt (no "riding pull on/off sleeves"), long legged sturdy pants, full fingered gloves and over the ankle footwear. Some have coined the acronym ATGATT standing for All the Gear, All the Time.
GWRRA instructor PPT slides also include the comment, "Only cover those parts of the body you wish to use later in life"
For me that's a pretty weak definition of what ATGATT should be, but, like I said originally, if you ask 100 people you will get 100 different definitions. Along with my GoldWing I ride a KLR650 dual sport. That bike is used to ride the mountain back roads. I've fallen with it a few times with thankfully no injury. I'm wearing the gear to protect me. I wear the same gear on the GoldWing.

I've heard the comment about covering up what you want to use later. It, again IMO, doesn't go far enough. With what do you cover up is the question. Isn't the point of ATGATT to prevent injury? Do you know what a nylon windbreaker does as you are sliding down the pavement? It melts into your skin.

I prefer to go with: "Dress for the slide, not the ride".

finnrider wrote:You say every issue of WW. I have to take exception to that because I just looked at the July and Sept 2013 issues. There are no pictures that I see showing riders on a moving bike who are not dressed properly. Several photos show riders posing with their bikes without helmets, etc., but does that mean they ride without them? No way to know without asking them. One photo shows a guy riding his bike off of a ferry without a helmet, but probably everyone of us has ridden our bikes across the parking lot without a helmet. But seminars I've been in even that has been roundly criticized as not being safe.

If you can cite specific issues and pages of WW that show riders without ATG on moving bikes, then I wholeheartedly endorse the idea that we call GWRRA on it. If in fact what you are saying is correct, then it is hypocritical. I just haven't noticed that being the case.
Firstly I have NEVER ridden my bike anywhere without a helmet.

I'm looking at every picture I see in WW, ads included. GWRRA has control of what goes in there and like REDIAL said why put in ads that are against your principles. And to limit it to pictures of moving bikes throws it wide open. Many pictures in ride reports are obviously quickies at the side of the road. One person gets off and takes a picture of the other and back on the road.

So back to your July issue. Page 2, J&M ad. No gloves. The gal is ready to mount the bike. He is ready to ride away. This ad is in every issue lately.

Page 52, Ride Report - big guy sitting on 1500, short sleeves. Did he take off his jacket for the picture? I doubt it. Looks like one of those quickies I mentioned. Don't see a jacket anywhere. I would have removed my helmet for a picture vs. my jacket.

Page 55, Ride Report, moving bike - Rider is either wearing no gloves or a pair of infamous "nose pickers".

I'm not trying to start a war over this. I've only been in GWRRA for 4 years now. I still consider myself an outsider still learning the ropes. Heck the whole structure of the organization is mind boggling. Some of the things they say and do confuse me. What I am trying to say though, is that, if you say you ARE something then you better BE that something because the world is watching.

Kirk out.

.


"It´s a friggen motorcycle, it´s not supposed to be comfortable, quiet or safe. The wind noise is supposed to hurt your ears, the seat should be hard and riding it should make you s**t your pants every now and then. "

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