How to remove and replace your water pump


Step-by-step tutorials on how to maintain and fix your GL1100
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WingAdmin
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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by WingAdmin » Fri Jul 29, 2011 9:49 am



TooTall2 wrote:The drip has slowed down to about 1 drip every 13 seconds. Both timings (1 per sec. and 1 per 13 sec.) were taken with the engine cold, radiator cap off, radiator full of water.
Can I hurt it letting it idle for a while to give the seal some time to settle in? I am really not wanting to do this again. It's been said that they ocassionaly leak for a while after this repair. Did I mention that I'm REALLY not wanting to do this again? It was 100 to 104 in the shop this whole last week. Thanks for your input.
TT2
I really didn't want to do it again, too. :) :) A lot of swearing in my shop the first time I did it and it started leaking. :)

Don't run it TOO long with just water in it, particularly if it's that hot. Water can't move as much heat as proper coolant.



slydogjeff77
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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by slydogjeff77 » Fri Aug 19, 2011 2:22 pm

NEUTRAL LIGHT STAYS OFF...
I've trouble shot almost EVERYTHING except for opening up the front engine cover and cleaning the neutral switch itself.
*YES the bulb is good!* lol

ok so ALL I want to do is check / clean / change the neutral switch.. I'll HAVE to drain the oil and antifreeze but do I HAVE to take off the radiator to get the front engine cover off? I have not gone down (relax pervs!) that low (ok I was thinking it too) on my bike yet!! :)

It's dirty down there and I don't have a lift.

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TooTall2
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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by TooTall2 » Sat Aug 20, 2011 10:19 am

Well, the second time was the ticket for me, no drips. I want to tell any of you that are contemplating this job to BE SURE AND DO THE "BLOW TEST". I skipped it the first time because it went together so well that I just knew it would be OK. It wasn't. This time I did the test. I could have saved myself a bunch of agravation and work if I did it the first time. BTW I didn't remove the radiator this time, and the labor savings were well worth the loss of visibility.
The trick is to get the bike high enough. I started with the bike on the center stand, leaning the bike left and right while adding a short piece of 2x4 under one side then the other of the stand till I had 6" under both sides.
Before I started this procedure I attached a ratchet tie down to one leg of the center stand and to the front of the left crash bar. A little tension on this will keep the center stand from folding up and dropping the bike. I wished I used 1x4 though because of the uncomfortable angle I had to lean the bike to get them in. It would have been worth my time to go buy a 12' 1x4 and cut it into 1' peices. Then as I lifted the front wheel, my wife slipped a tall block under it. Walah, 6" higher and solid. I just didn't get too rough with it while making my repairs.
1983 GL1100 Standard (newbie)
1979 GS1000L (14000 miles)(FOR SALE)
1957 F100 (beater)
1936 Ford PU (rat rod project)
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chase199c
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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by chase199c » Thu Dec 01, 2011 9:20 pm

Awesome tutorial! I was expecting it to be more complicated.
Thanks.

JG82WING
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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by JG82WING » Sun Jan 01, 2012 3:06 pm

I am replacing the water pump in my 82 1100 and I was looking for torque specs when I found your web site and was reading your instructions on replacing the water pump, and you mentioned the oil pump seal. My old seal is recessed in the pump housing about a 1/8 of an inch, is this correct or should it be flush? Any coment would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
JG82WING

chase199c
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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by chase199c » Mon Jan 02, 2012 10:12 pm

I am having a bit of a new issue, when I took the water pump out of the casing there was some damage around where the pump recessed into the casing. It seems to have cut a grove around the pump on the impeler side of the casing. I don't think this is a bad casting from Honda, and from looking at the picture of the inside of the case in the file you sent this is totally not normal. So now I have the issue of replacing the casing. I know this part is no longer available, and have had little success on locating one on the internet. So do I take the chance on pump replacement with the new seals or just leave the old pump in? I'm afraid of something going through the pump and into the gear drive off the crank. If that happens it's "good bye motor" so I'm not sure what to do?

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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by WingAdmin » Tue Jan 03, 2012 12:03 pm

JG82WING wrote:I am replacing the water pump in my 82 1100 and I was looking for torque specs when I found your web site and was reading your instructions on replacing the water pump, and you mentioned the oil pump seal. My old seal is recessed in the pump housing about a 1/8 of an inch, is this correct or should it be flush? Any coment would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks
JG82WING
It should sit recessed slightly - not flush with the housing, as shown in this picture:

Oil pump seal
Oil pump seal


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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by WingAdmin » Tue Jan 03, 2012 12:07 pm

chase199c wrote:I am having a bit of a new issue, when I took the water pump out of the casing there was some damage around where the pump recessed into the casing. It seems to have cut a grove around the pump on the impeler side of the casing. I don't think this is a bad casting from Honda, and from looking at the picture of the inside of the case in the file you sent this is totally not normal. So now I have the issue of replacing the casing. I know this part is no longer available, and have had little success on locating one on the internet. So do I take the chance on pump replacement with the new seals or just leave the old pump in? I'm afraid of something going through the pump and into the gear drive off the crank. If that happens it's "good bye motor" so I'm not sure what to do?
This can happen when the bearings in the old water pump are so damaged that the impeller scores the inside of the case as it flops around. You absolutely need to change the water pump if this is happening.

Failing to find a replacement case, you might want to clean the case as well as humanly possible, score the surface slightly, and use some JB-Weld to fill in the groove (the scoring is to help the JB-Weld to adhere). Smooth it in place as well as possible before it cures, and sand it down once it has fully cured. There is no mechanical abrasion (normally) in that area, so the JB-Weld should last pretty well forever.

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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by david4752 » Mon Jan 09, 2012 9:40 pm

On the gasket set that you first mentioned in this how-to is that the same one I would use for my "86 1200a or would there be another aftermarket one that would be complete? I plan on buying an OEM water pump. Also i checked prices and OEM Honda car antifreeze is cheaper in gallon jugs tha Honda motorcycle quarts are they the same type?
David4752

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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by WingAdmin » Mon Jan 09, 2012 11:12 pm

david4752 wrote:On the gasket set that you first mentioned in this how-to is that the same one I would use for my "86 1200a or would there be another aftermarket one that would be complete? I plan on buying an OEM water pump. Also i checked prices and OEM Honda car antifreeze is cheaper in gallon jugs tha Honda motorcycle quarts are they the same type?
David4752
The gasket kit is different for the 1200. You can find one at Partsnmore.

I would be surprised if the auto antifreeze is the same as the bike antifreeze - they have different purposes in life. Bikes don't often get ridden in -40F weather, while a car antifreeze is expected to operate just fine at those temperatures.

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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by beechum1 » Wed Feb 15, 2012 10:49 pm

Just finished up on my 1200. For anyone that is wondering, the radiator doesn't have to come off at all. Unless you forget to put the top 3 bolts in the front cover back in before mounting it to the engine on reassembly. yeah. Just FYI. I have a friend that told me....

Thanks for the great writeup. i couldn't have done it as quickly without your help!!!

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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by petethedrummer » Wed Mar 28, 2012 12:59 pm

I am having trouble with step 121 trying to remove the dowel from the cover.
I put a screwdriver into the dowel and wiggeled it.. it wont come off.
can i attach the cover without taking this dowel out and putting it into the engine?
Also I tryed the waterpump leak test.. how is it suppose to hold water
if you only finger tightend on bolt to hold it onto the case?

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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by WingAdmin » Wed Mar 28, 2012 1:18 pm

petethedrummer wrote:I am having trouble with step 121 trying to remove the dowel from the cover.
I put a screwdriver into the dowel and wiggeled it.. it wont come off.
can i attach the cover without taking this dowel out and putting it into the engine?
Also I tryed the waterpump leak test.. how is it suppose to hold water
if you only finger tightend on bolt to hold it onto the case?
If you can line it up correctly and get it to fit into the engine block, then sure, leave it in the cover. It's just tough to clean the mating surface of the cover leaving the dowel in place.

That's a good point about the leak test - you'll want to squeeze the cover on. Mainly what you're looking to do is to make sure that you seated the O-rings around the pump body correctly, and that they aren't leaking. Otherwise, the only way to find this out is to reassemble everything, fill the coolant...and discover that you have a leak. I speak from experience on this. :)

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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by petethedrummer » Thu Apr 05, 2012 10:56 am

I am having trouble interpreting the tourque of the housing bolts.
It says 9 ft lbs.. i am told you multiply it by 12 and get 108 inch lbs.
other people says 9ft lbs is not very much
I bought a small 1/4 inch torque wrench from harbor freight.
It says its in inch lbs but when i set it for just 9 inch lbs i stripped the middle bolt for the water pump.
so i went with just feeling the torque.. put it together and filled all the fluids and seems i have a leak in both the water pump area and bottom casing.
I tried tightening some up but i am afraid of having to got back to step 130. or stripping old bolts..

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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by WingAdmin » Thu Apr 05, 2012 3:04 pm

petethedrummer wrote:I am having trouble interpreting the tourque of the housing bolts.
It says 9 ft lbs.. i am told you multiply it by 12 and get 108 inch lbs.
other people says 9ft lbs is not very much
I bought a small 1/4 inch torque wrench from harbor freight.
It says its in inch lbs but when i set it for just 9 inch lbs i stripped the middle bolt for the water pump.
so i went with just feeling the torque.. put it together and filled all the fluids and seems i have a leak in both the water pump area and bottom casing.
I tried tightening some up but i am afraid of having to got back to step 130. or stripping old bolts..
You're right 9 ft-lbs is not very much, and that's because they are small screws that are screwing into soft aluminum. You really are likely going to have to helicoil that stripped bolt and get it in there - as you've discovered, it will leak if the cover isn't torqued equally around.

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Regarding DIY R&R Water Pump Front Cover "O" Rings

Post by newomij » Thu May 03, 2012 9:51 pm

This is an awesome forum that has taught me so much about my motorcycle and that I can do a lot of the maintenance myself. I really appreciate those of you who take the time to answer our questions and especially you who take the time to photograph hundreds of individual steps and post them in the DIY Forums.

My question this time is regarding the DIY R&R of the water pump and the process of putting everything back together. I have done this once a few months ago and then it developed a significant oil leak determined to be caused by an "O" ring that didn't seat properly. This question is regarding a different "O" ring that goes around a so called dowel that helps align the cover when replaced. In that DIY process, photo/step 109 and dowel/'o' ring #3 (missing in this particular photo). Dowel #4 (same photo) has a channel around it that accepts the 'o' ring on my '82 Aspencade. The #3 dowel has no such channel for the 'o' ring. When I pulled the front cover off, that 'o' ring (#3) was flattened paper thin like a pancake run over by an asphalt roller. The front cover gasket kit from Japanese company "KP" has only one 'o' ring of the size to fit those dowels. Is there any reason to think that there should only be one dowel with an 'o' ring around it? If this dowel was meant to have an 'o' ring, wouldn't it have the same channel that the other has? And, this is the second gasket kit purchase with only one dowel sized 'o' ring.

The last time I did this, that gasket kit only had one dowel 'o' ring in it. I ran to the hardware store and bought a duplicate to the kit included one and put it on that dowel. Just as I was about to do so this time, I decided to describe this to you all and get your take on it.

By the way, I (and a couple of you) figured the oil leak that developed was a result of improper seating of the #2 (in that same photo) 'o' ring. The southeast quarter of the 'o' ring was sitting outside the channel when I removed the cover. Maybe the leak could have been helped along by an extra 'o' ring that wasn't supposed to be there??

Sorry I got so wordy here but I hope you follow what I am trying to describe. And, again, thank you, guys, for your help!!

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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by WingAdmin » Fri May 04, 2012 1:25 pm

Not too wordy, you described your procedure very well.

I had a look at several Honda parts diagrams as well as the Honda service manual - and NONE of them specify where the O-rings go. I think you may well be correct. Having a look at the enlarged version of my picture, there is a chamfer around dowel 3:

Dowel 3 hole
Dowel 3 hole

However, with the O-ring installed, it definitely is not large enough to recess the O-ring, especially compared to the large O-ring next to it, which quite obviously is recessed.

Image

Lastly, looking at the front cover, the #4 dowel is supplying (oil, I think? I don't recall) to the front cover, as you can see where it fits into the front cover, the top left recess. This obviously needs an O-ring to seal this. The #3 dowel does not supply anything, and there is no real reason for there to be an O-ring there, as the main front cover gasket would do the job of sealing that area.

Image

I'm going to say that you are correct, and fix this error.

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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by bfrawley » Mon Jul 02, 2012 8:38 am

I did this job over the weekend. First of all, great instructions!!! They helped tremendously. One note, if you have an 83 aspencade, you don't have to disconnect all of the air lines to and electrical connections to pull the false tank, at least I didn't on mine.

I do have a question about your blow test. I tried doing it 2 or 3 times and couldn't get it to work they way you describe. Air and water would blow out the ports on the back of the engine cover. It also blew out around the water pump housing where it mounts to the engine cover because there is only one finger tight bolt holding them together. I put some tape on the ports on the back of the cover and pressed as hard as I could on the pump housing and no matter what I did, i couldn't keep it from spraying around the housing. So I crossed my fingers and hoped that the o ring was good. What was I missing?

Related to that, after getting it all back together. I did the test with the distilled water. When it first fired up, water was dripping from where the pump housing meets the engine cover. Once things warmed up, it seemed to stop, so I assumed it was ok. I drained it, filled her up with antifreeze, ran it and no leaks. I got everything back together and took her for a quick 15-20 minute ride and everything seemed fine. The next night there was a very small puddle of antifreeze under it, (size of a quarter). It looks like it is coming from the same place and not the weep hole. I am going to run it a little bit to see if the gasket will seal up. If not, should I replace the gasket or maybe use some rtv?

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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by WingAdmin » Mon Jul 02, 2012 11:00 am

I went back to read the "blow test" and realized the instructions were not that clear. I rewrote them to read:
Helpful hint: To check for leaks at this point, fill the water pump with water (pour it in the hose fitting on the front). Put your thumb over the coolant drain hole, another thumb over the coolant supply hole on the back, and blow hard into the hose fitting on the front (use your mouth - not compressed air!) and watch for water dripping out of the weep hole. If you see some - your O-rings are leaking.
The idea is, you fill the pump with water, cover up anywhere the water could get out, and blow into the hose fitting. There shouldn't be anywhere for the water to go, so nothing should come out. You could use a plastic clamp to help hold the cover in place I suppose if it was leaking out around the pump cover gasket - that said, I was able to hold it in place enough to keep water from coming out.

As for your leak - did you replace that gasket when you put it back together? If not, it sounds like it is time to do so. Fortunately, you can do this fairly easily without taking much else apart - however, you'll have to drain and refill the coolant before taking that cover off.

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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by bfrawley » Mon Jul 02, 2012 11:48 am

I did replace the gasket. I also replaced the O-ring between the hose end piece and the actual water pump cover. Either the new gasket isn't sealing, or maybe I got a little ruff getting the old gasket off. I rode it to work today. I am going to check it after work, and when I get home tonight to see if it has stopped. If not, do you think there would be any problem with putting a light coat of Permatex Gray on either side of the gasket to help it seal, assuming the gasket stays in one piece when I take it off?

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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by WingAdmin » Mon Jul 02, 2012 1:25 pm

bfrawley wrote:I did replace the gasket. I also replaced the O-ring between the hose end piece and the actual water pump cover. Either the new gasket isn't sealing, or maybe I got a little ruff getting the old gasket off. I rode it to work today. I am going to check it after work, and when I get home tonight to see if it has stopped. If not, do you think there would be any problem with putting a light coat of Permatex Gray on either side of the gasket to help it seal, assuming the gasket stays in one piece when I take it off?
Or perhaps there was a bit of old gasket left behind?

If you can keep it in one piece getting it off, and as long as you can make sure none of the sealant squeezes out into the coolant stream, you should be OK.

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When do I know that I need to replace the water pump?

Post by montgomery63 » Wed Jul 04, 2012 10:57 am

I have a fair amount of oil (no coolant, just oil) seeping out of the weep hole at the bottom of the water pump. However, judging from the operating temperature of the bike, it seems to be functioning just fine. It never overheats, and when it does get warm enough, the fan kicks in and cools it off just fine.

When do I know it's time to replace the water pump? Is it likely to suddenly fail, leaving me stranded?

Thanks.

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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by WingAdmin » Thu Jul 05, 2012 11:04 am

You can't tell - it might just be an O-ring failed, it could be an internal pump seal gone due to failed bearings. Without taking it apart to see, you won't know which it is - but whichever it is, something has failed. Will the bearings seize tomorrow or two years from now? You can't know. If you're happy riding it as is, do so for the season, and plan to replace it in the off-season.

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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by tom84std » Tue Sep 25, 2012 8:30 am

Admin, thank you for taking the time. I know it took many hours but it turned out wonderfully.When I did this job I made several mistakes causing me to have to do it twice, spending the money on a second gasket set. If I'd had this step by step pictorial back then, it would have taken half the time and half the expense. You/we need to make sure this pictorial post never gets lost!

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Re: How to remove and replace your water pump

Post by WingAdmin » Tue Sep 25, 2012 9:53 am

tom84std wrote:Admin, thank you for taking the time. I know it took many hours but it turned out wonderfully.When I did this job I made several mistakes causing me to have to do it twice, spending the money on a second gasket set. If I'd had this step by step pictorial back then, it would have taken half the time and half the expense. You/we need to make sure this pictorial post never gets lost!
I ended up doing it twice the first time as well, as I rolled one of the O-rings on the pump, which caused it to leak. Fortunately I was able to save the gaskets on the re-disassembly, so I didn't have to buy another set.



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