Altenative fix for the shifter shaft issue


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RBGERSON
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Altenative fix for the shifter shaft issue

Post by RBGERSON » Tue Apr 03, 2018 2:23 pm



I was looking at my shifter, it is loose..wiggles a fair bit..so I was was looking into the bracket device that cyclemax sells. But then it occurred to me if one could weld a bearing into the opening in the header shield flush with the outer skin it would stabilize the shifter arm, you'd have a bearing action on the shaft so it wouldn't bind and you'd have a much cheaper solution. All you'd need is a bearing sized to fit the shaft, a little spot welding of the bearing's outer race to the shield. Maybe a little mod/shaping of the hole through the shield??? I think the header shield is stiff enough to handle the pressures of shifting.

So what am I missing..


HAD LOTS OF GOLDWING 75-83
NOW INTO 1500'S..RIDING A 1998 SE

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virgilmobile
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Re: Altenative fix for the shifter shaft issue

Post by virgilmobile » Tue Apr 03, 2018 3:01 pm

Not missing anything.If...and I use that word carefully...If you could measure the shaft size and the shell size and depth..then source a bearing to those specs...secure it in the housing....it could be done...Maybe...I went through this many years ago and came up with my solution.viewtopic.php?f=6&t=9365.
This is just one possible fix.Another member devised a easier method..The shifter pivot...I'm sure there's more engineered designs out there.

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Re: Altenative fix for the shifter shaft issue

Post by virgilmobile » Tue Apr 03, 2018 3:48 pm

Welding the bearing is out of the question.Not only would the weld damage the bearing but this is an aluminum casting the shifter goes through.You cant weld the two together.
It does have a bearing behind the seal.Im guessing a small needle sleeve bearing.I couldn't find much about it tho.
The add on bearing would have to be secured mechanically but there's not much there to connect to.
Keep after it..who knows what you can come up with and keep us posted.

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Re: Altenative fix for the shifter shaft issue

Post by wingdings » Thu Apr 05, 2018 2:42 am

I fully agree with vigil on this - Indeed this guy always gives best advice too !! and in the past has helped me no end with my wing problems I have in the past on my wing - " There is a saying in the US - "If it works it don't need mending " - Your problem you are having was the same problem I was having too - So took off the toe and heel shifter replaced it with a stock shifter - replaced the shifter oil seal and fitted the pivot shifter mod and also replaced the brass bush in the clutch leaver and bled and replaced the clutch master cylinder seals and changed out the clutch fluid as well - this resulted in the problem being solved .. better shifting works like new now ... :D :D :D :D :D :D

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Re: Altenative fix for the shifter shaft issue

Post by WingAdmin » Thu Apr 05, 2018 7:45 am

wingdings wrote:
Thu Apr 05, 2018 2:42 am
I fully agree with vigil on this - Indeed this guy always gives best advice too !! and in the past has helped me no end with my wing problems I have in the past on my wing - " There is a saying in the US - "If it works it don't need mending " - Your problem you are having was the same problem I was having too - So took off the toe and heel shifter replaced it with a stock shifter - replaced the shifter oil seal and fitted the pivot shifter mod and also replaced the brass bush in the clutch leaver and bled and replaced the clutch master cylinder seals and changed out the clutch fluid as well - this resulted in the problem being solved .. better shifting works like new now ... :D :D :D :D :D :D
I did the EXACT same things to my GL1500. It went from a sloppy shifter that often didn't make it into gear, to a sharp, precise shifter that shifted perfectly and securely, every time, with little effort.

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Re: Altenative fix for the shifter shaft issue

Post by virgilmobile » Thu Apr 05, 2018 8:59 am

Yes this was our solution but don't dismiss another possibility.
I'll entertain any designs or modifications.
One person can't possibly design the only possible solution to this problem...
That's why this site is so great....
Many intelligent people with different ideas.
Keep the ideas coming :ugeek:

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Re: Altenative fix for the shifter shaft issue

Post by WingAdmin » Thu Apr 05, 2018 11:02 am

virgilmobile wrote:
Thu Apr 05, 2018 8:59 am
Yes this was our solution but don't dismiss another possibility.
I'll entertain any designs or modifications.
One person can't possibly design the only possible solution to this problem...
That's why this site is so great....
Many intelligent people with different ideas.
Keep the ideas coming :ugeek:
What I like about the design of peppilepew's shifter pivot brace is that the outer end support is pretty much as far outboard as possible. The only way this can be accomplished is with the particular type of pivot he uses, with a pivot in the same plane as the actual shaft, and a pivot with an arc that mirrors the arc of the shifter arm. Without this outboard pivot (i.e. using just a bearing to support the end of the inner shaft), you still have some leverage being applied to both bearings every time you shift. It's a clever solution to an obvious design shortfall by Honda.

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Re: Altenative fix for the shifter shaft issue

Post by virgilmobile » Thu Apr 05, 2018 1:20 pm

I agree that his design is great.It does resolve the issue with little effort.
Have you looked at the shifter on the new 1800?
It's a short arm at the block with a link rod back to the shift lever.It resolved the 1500 shift lever design flaw.

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Re: Altenative fix for the shifter shaft issue

Post by WingAdmin » Thu Apr 05, 2018 2:29 pm

virgilmobile wrote:
Thu Apr 05, 2018 1:20 pm
I agree that his design is great.It does resolve the issue with little effort.
Have you looked at the shifter on the new 1800?
It's a short arm at the block with a link rod back to the shift lever.It resolved the 1500 shift lever design flaw.
Yes, it's one of the things I specifically looked at when I first saw it at the Cleveland show.

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Re: Altenative fix for the shifter shaft issue

Post by RBGERSON » Sat Apr 07, 2018 5:23 pm

OK I read your post/fix.. Gave me another idea..re welding to a bearing is not a good idea...so what if I used your idea of a pipe shaft to hold the bearing. Find a bearing that fits the shaft AND a pipe that fits the outer race of the bearing. Weld the pipe to the exhaust protector in exactly the right spot/angle etc. so no pressure is put on the shaft.slide the bearing into the pipe secure it with...?? epoxy, JB, or set screws..or if I am real lucky the pipe will actually fit like a glove the bearing will be wedged in place...

More thoughts from the group???

PS maybe move this to tech forum for more eyes to see it???
HAD LOTS OF GOLDWING 75-83
NOW INTO 1500'S..RIDING A 1998 SE

FAIR WINDS,
RB

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Re: Altenative fix for the shifter shaft issue

Post by wingdings » Tue Apr 10, 2018 4:38 am

Saw this one on the how to's - viewtopic.php?f=14&t=41884 - :D :D :D :D

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Re: Altenative fix for the shifter shaft issue

Post by Rennysoncemann » Wed Sep 04, 2019 2:41 pm

Hi, sorry to pipe up a 1-1/2 years late, I just encountered this thread.

There's a problem with this approach (supporting the shift shaft with some type of bearing at the outboard end) that I don't see anybody talking about. Namely, the rotation of the shaft isn't centered on the shaft itself, it's offset by an inch and a half or so. Because of this the tip of the shaft moves in a circular arc rather than just rotating. A bearing in that spot would prevent this motion, causing bending stresses on the shaft and possibly stressing the (already tired) shaft bearings and oil seal, every time you shift. In fact if there was no wobble or play anywhere, the shaft would bind as soon as you tried to move it.

That's why the CycleMax brace is designed the way it is, it keeps the geometry correct to prevent stressing the bearings and oil seal. The center of rotation of the brace is aligned with the shaft going into the transmission, so it doesn't introduce any stresses (alleviates them in fact).

Of course, in the real world there is some play, and the shaft rotates only a little bit when shifting; so the error is pretty small and might not matter much, and this solution could be better than nothing. But just be aware that it's not an ideal solution.

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Re: Altenative fix for the shifter shaft issue

Post by virgilmobile » Wed Sep 04, 2019 3:06 pm

Sorry you may misunderstood the placement of the bearing I used.Its attached directly to the end of the shifter shaft that comes out of the engine.Not the shift lever offset.
My original findings were back in 2011.My "fix" still is solid.
You can search "88 gl1500 shift arm sloppy??"
There have been a few changes to the design that do not need drilling and tapping the shaft.
The end result is the same.
Stabilize the shaft that comes out of the engine.It is a poor design and needs one of these augmentations

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Re: Altenative fix for the shifter shaft issue

Post by Rennysoncemann » Wed Sep 04, 2019 4:03 pm

I think the OP was talking about attaching a bearing to the outer cosmetic panel, based on this phrase: "weld a bearing into the opening in the header shield flush with the outer skin ". Maybe I misinterpreted what he meant.

I just fixed my own wobbly GL1500 shifter, using the CycleMax device. Pricey but seems to work great, though I hated to attack the heat shield with tin snips as you're required to do.... Were you actually able to mount an auxiliary bearing on the stub coming out of the transmission? I wouldn't have thought that possible, there's no room there. Do you have pictures?

Thanks -

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Re: Altenative fix for the shifter shaft issue

Post by virgilmobile » Wed Sep 04, 2019 4:22 pm

It's possible.Lots of time setting on the floor.
Have a read through my expedition.The second page shows how I did mine 8 years ago.
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=9365

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Re: Altenative fix for the shifter shaft issue

Post by Bogey1963 » Thu Sep 19, 2019 9:25 am

Ok, dumb question and not really relevant to me since I just got the shifter brace installed but... Couldn't the oil seal coming out of the motor just been replaced by a sealed bearing? You'd have to find one the right size which might be impossible but if you could it would definitely have given more support to the rod.... Just my 2 cents...


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