3G shutdown - will it affect the Goldwing?

[thboyd29]

So. I got a note from my cellular provider, telling me I'm going to need to do something fairly soon in order to keep my phone working once the current 3G network goes dark. Having no clue what they were talking about, I started browsing the interwebs. One thing led to another, and apparently a bunch of car makers' products (including some Hondas) are going to lose some features.

Which leads me here.

Given that the GW's infotainment system gets closer and closer to that of a car with each generation, is it reasonable to infer that the current generation GW may contain 3G-based features/services which might be affected by the shutdown? And if so, is there anything either we as individuals or Honda can do about it? I haven't seen anything at all specifically mentioning the GW, so if this turns out to be a non-issue, great!

As always, thanks for your thoughts.

[joecoolsuncle]

shutting down 3g sounds almost as believable as y2k. when are they going to be able to send/receive data over 5g for any appreciable distance? your 3g may actually work better soon, as the 5g will take a load off the existing towers/networks.

[blupupher]

... your 3g may actually work better soon, as the 5g will take a load off the existing towers/networks.

No, it won't.
3G is shutting down in the US, any device using 3G only for network connection will no longer have a connection.
Link to FCC article
Same as what happened with 2G a few years ago. Technology is supplanted by newer stuff, and older bandwidth is allocated for other things.

So to answer the OP question, if the Goldwing uses 3G to connect, it will no longer work at some point in the near future (or may already be cut off).
Some companies have already turned it off (AT&T), and all will be completed by December 31, 2022.

[Andy Cote]

For example, my 2021 Honda Passport is able to receive software updates either "over the air" or directly at the dealer. Is has happened a handful of times. I do not know what cellular network it uses but it is NOT using my personal phone. I think this is the same network that connects for their emergency system (ONSTAR equivalent).

Everything I have read on the 2018+ bikes is that they require a memory card to update the software.

[joecoolsuncle]

... your 3g may actually work better soon, as the 5g will take a load off the existing towers/networks.

No, it won't.
3G is shutting down in the US, any device using 3G only for network connection will no longer have a connection.
Link to FCC article
Same as what happened with 2G a few years ago. Technology is supplanted by newer stuff, and older bandwidth is allocated for other things.

So to answer the OP question, if the Goldwing uses 3G to connect, it will no longer work at some point in the near future (or may already be cut off).
Some companies have already turned it off (AT&T), and all will be completed by December 31, 2022.

so, the majority of the U.S. will lose cell coverage by the end of this year? everything so far points to delays in implementing 5g. the biggest problem is distance, 5g will not travel nearly as far as 3g or 4g.
question? if 2g is no longer, what is the signal i receive most of the time when phone shows weaker signal than 3g? maybe they just renamed 2g as they already are calling 4g something like extended, or expanded 5g?

[WingAdmin]

2G has been gone for years.

Carriers will be shutting down 3G this year. This was announced and scheduled years ago.

The reason is that once the old networks are shut down, the carriers can repurpose the spectrum for new 5G networks.

Phones that don't run on at least 4G networks (i.e. 3G only) are extremely old. 4G phones came out in 2010, 12 years ago...so if you are still using a phone that is older than 12 years, then yes, it's going to stop working.

4G on the other hand is not scheduled to be phased out until 2030, so your existing 4G phones will work at least until then.

The exception is Sprint's legacy 4G LTE network, which T-Mobile acquired along with the purchase of Sprint. Sprint's 4G LTE network will be shut down in June of this year, so if you are still using an old Sprint 4G LTE phone, you will need to upgrade.

The problem is that car manufacturers use the cheapest/oldest technology for their telematics, because it costs them less to have all those cars on the old networks. My 2013 Ford originally came with a 2G modem in it, which was replaced for free by Ford in 2016, because the 2G networks were being shut down. Short-sighted and penny-pinching as ever, Ford replaced those 2G modems with 3G modems. All of the cars with 3G modems in them (and there are millions) will lose connectivity when 3G networks are shut down. My car has already lost connectivity, and being that Ford wants to charge me $1000 to upgrade to a 4G modem, it will not regain that connectivity.

So I lose things like remote door lock/unlock and start, notifications about the alarm sounding, and warnings about low tire pressures and so on being sent to my phone.

The 2018+ Goldwing supposedly has telematics, but I've been completely unable to find any information as to whether it uses 3G or 4G networks - or that it even has two-way telematics. That said, Honda has been fairly proactive in contacting owners of cars affected by the 3G shutdown, so it would be very surprising to hear that the Goldwing had a 3G modem in it and that Honda had not contacted any of the owners. This leads me to believe that either the Goldwing has no 2-way telematics (hence no modem), or that it is a 4G modem.

[joecoolsuncle]

wow! thanks for that. here in rural areas, its more common to see 3g service and even no service than to see 4g. so by the end of the year, rural America will not get service? phones capable of 4g have to have 4g signal! and no 5g around here unless you drive for an hour. its been that way forever in rural America.
Maybe i am missing something?
thanks for the info.

[thboyd29]

<<snip>>

...The problem is that car manufacturers use the cheapest/oldest technology for their telematics, because it costs them less to have all those cars on the old networks. My 2013 Ford originally came with a 2G modem in it, which was replaced for free by Ford in 2016, because the 2G networks were being shut down. Short-sighted and penny-pinching as ever, Ford replaced those 2G modems with 3G modems. All of the cars with 3G modems in them (and there are millions) will lose connectivity when 3G networks are shut down. My car has already lost connectivity, and being that Ford wants to charge me $1000 to upgrade to a 4G modem, it will not regain that connectivity.

So I lose things like remote door lock/unlock and start, notifications about the alarm sounding, and warnings about low tire pressures and so on being sent to my phone.

The 2018+ Goldwing supposedly has telematics, but I've been completely unable to find any information as to whether it uses 3G or 4G networks - or that it even has two-way telematics. That said, Honda has been fairly proactive in contacting owners of cars affected by the 3G shutdown, so it would be very surprising to hear that the Goldwing had a 3G modem in it and that Honda had not contacted any of the owners. This leads me to believe that either the Goldwing has no 2-way telematics (hence no modem), or that it is a 4G modem.

I certainly understand your point, but if Ford needs a grand *now* for a 4G modem, imagine what the price would've been back in 2016, when 4G tech was new (and certainly more expensive as now). *Giving* you a 3G modem instead to keep your 3-year car working as new for the remainder of the warranty period would be a no-brainer - especially if there were warranty/legal issues to consider. I can certainly see Ford wanting you to pick up most (all?) of the cost of installing a 4G modem into a 9-year-old car that's well out of warranty, and I can certainly understand you not wanting to do so. I wouldn't do it either (I've got a 2015 Mazda 3, and don't think it has a modem of any kind, but if it turns out that I do, I'm with you.)

Now, back to the Goldwing. Living with my 19 tour, I haven't seen anything that leads me to believe there's any cell-based stuff on it that would require a modem. Also, Honda hasn't sent any communications yet. Once my back clears up enough to bring the bike out of it's corner, I suppose I'll find out.

[thboyd29]

shutting down 3g sounds almost as believable as y2k. when are they going to be able to send/receive data over 5g for any appreciable distance? your 3g may actually work better soon, as the 5g will take a load off the existing towers/networks.

Duuuude...

Never. Ever. EVER. Underestimate the real work that people had to do to make Y2K the non-event that you, in your ignorance, think it was.

I could go into gory, boring detail about what it took for the company that I worked for (National Steel, a major steel producer whose assets are now owned by U.S. Steel) to make the Y2K transition *look* so easy to outsiders that some Millys-and-beyond *think* it never happened. Maybe that's the best compliment the millions of people worldwide can expect, even if you didn't mean it as one...

Instead, as a ride recommendation, I'd suggest a trip to any/all of these, and take a good hard look at real evidence of events that some looneys *still* claim never happened...
Kennedy Space Center, FL
Johnson Space Center, TX
U.S. Space and Rocket Center, Huntsville, AL
National Museum of the U.S. Air Force, Dayton, OH (extra credit, 'specially if you like old aircraft)
Kennedy is on my bucket list, I've been to the others and still marvel at the brass balls at the men (and, later in the Shuttle, women) who rode in glorified tin cans with a sh!tload of loose wiring hanging around.

[WingAdmin]

shutting down 3g sounds almost as believable as y2k. when are they going to be able to send/receive data over 5g for any appreciable distance? your 3g may actually work better soon, as the 5g will take a load off the existing towers/networks.

Duuuude...

Never. Ever. EVER. Underestimate the real work that people had to do to make Y2K the non-event that you, in your ignorance, think it was.

I could go into gory, boring detail about what it took for the company that I worked for (National Steel, a major steel producer whose assets are now owned by U.S. Steel) to make the Y2K transition *look* so easy to outsiders that some Millys-and-beyond *think* it never happened. Maybe that's the best compliment the millions of people worldwide can expect, even if you didn't mean it as one...

That's so true - I work in IT, and the company I was doing work for at the time spent TENS OF MILLIONS of dollars to upgrade systems and software, plus test it all, so that things would keep running past Y2K. It was a large financial services company that had many legacy systems in place, and they could not afford for systems to go down. There were hundreds and hundreds of people working on millions of lines of decades-old code, plus dedicated testers/QA people. It was a massive project spanning years.

When the clock ticked over midnight on Dec 31, 1999, everything kept running. There were a few minor glitches, but everything kept going like normal. And everybody then said, "well that was a big nothing. What was all the hoopla about?"

[joecoolsuncle]

thats funny but calling me ignorant proved what? fact: nothing happened. y2k was a nothingburger. sure, lots of folks did their jobs and made sure y2k was in fact....a nothingburger. end result? idiots like you calling folks ignorant.

[thboyd29]

Thanks for proving my point...

[thboyd29]

... I work in IT...

If you don't mind my asking, what areas do you work in? I was hired in the mid-70s, and was assigned, along with several others to translate 1410 Autocoder programs (think system-specific assembler language) written by my older colleagues into COBOL for the then-new IBM System 370. I ended up specializing in COBOL-based payroll and HR systems, then transitioning to COBOL/CICS based shipping systems before "retiring" in 09.

[WingAdmin]

... I work in IT...

If you don't mind my asking, what areas do you work in? I was hired in the mid-70s, and was assigned, along with several others to translate 1410 Autocoder programs (think system-specific assembler language) written by my older colleagues into COBOL for the then-new IBM System 370. I ended up specializing in COBOL-based payroll and HR systems, then transitioning to COBOL/CICS based shipping systems before "retiring" in 09.

Much newer than that - I came up from Commodore, with some work in MAI, OASIS/THEOS and UNIX, then into early web technologies in the late 90's, and since then have been doing mostly development on current systems and technologies (lots of e-commerce) with occasional integrations into legacy systems.

[thboyd29]

... I work in IT...

If you don't mind my asking, what areas do you work in? I was hired in the mid-70s, and was assigned, along with several others to translate 1410 Autocoder programs (think system-specific assembler language) written by my older colleagues into COBOL for the then-new IBM System 370. I ended up specializing in COBOL-based payroll and HR systems, then transitioning to COBOL/CICS based shipping systems before "retiring" in 09.

Much newer than that - I came up from Commodore, with some work in MAI, OASIS/THEOS and UNIX, then into early web technologies in the late 90's, and since then have been doing mostly development on current systems and technologies (lots of e-commerce) with occasional integrations into legacy systems.

Sounds like fun. Our newer people's expertise was all client-server and such - they learned COBOL in self-defense, just like I learned Autocoder ages ago. The old Autocoder guys went into systems analysis and then retired. Interesting how things come full circle, even as so many things along the course of that circle have changed.

[Rambozo]

I remember in the late 90s bringing in more than one COBOL programmer out of retirement to do Y2K patches for antique LOB applications.

[AZgl1800]

Fact of life, it just moves on.

I had a Verizon Network Extender that I used for well over a Decade to provide service inside my home, it was on 3g

then it just flat out quit.....
I pissed and moaned for months, then called up Verizon and asked them why?

well, it seems that they turned off 3g in Oklahoma period, gone with the dinosaurs.

okay, as I had paid for my Network Extender, and without it, I still don't have service inside my house, I asked them to replace it with a 4g version....

that took a couple of hours, and two higher level Supervisors, but they approved it, and sent me a replacement free.

.now that one don't work again .... but, they installed a new tower a mile from our home, and all is well.

[joecoolsuncle]

so, without the new tower, you would have been without cell communications?