Rear Wheel 'Spyder' Hard Going In/Out

[1grouch2u]

I was able to get the driven spline with the pins that go into the rear wheel out by slamming the wheel flat on the ground, how am I supposed to get that thing where it will slide on and off of there with only minimal interference? Should I take the nuts lose from the outside of the pins then put it all together and tighten them up with the 'spyder' already in the bushings in the wheel?

(Is anybody understanding at all what I'm even trying to get across in the first place?)

My axle, bearings, splines, spyder pins, splines- all very clean and look really good- just have hard time putting the stuff together

Stuff looks really good from here

Like new?

Problem seems to be the 'pins' on the 'spyder' are off (or seem to be) to one side and won't slide easily into the holes in the wheel- as if they've gotten 'torqued' over to one side of the holes and won't let the assy. slide down in where it belongs- I hammered it down in there part way, but about 12mm from being "home" -or bottomed, or down... it got really tight- in a bind- and I stopped not knowing if I'd be causing an even bigger problem having it all jammed up to where I couldn't get it back out again-

How far does that 'spyder' go down? -All the way, right? Should I have to hammer it together to get it that far? And once it's together, should it come back apart without having to use a puller? Just slamming it on the ground enough? it just seems like it's taking an awful lot of force to get that thing together/apart, it seems like it should go together a lot easier

[WingAdmin]

No no no, there's definitely something wrong. The whole point behind that assembly is that it's SUPPOSED to be able to slide on its own as required. You should be able to slide that thing in and out of the wheel by hand, with no tools used at all.

I'd have a look at the pins and the holes themselves - are they coated with grime or anything else that's binding them up?

[1grouch2u]

Okay cool- I'm glad I checked! -No, everything is super clean actually. When I pulled it all apart there was not even any lube on the pins- I haven't cleaned up the area shown in pictures- it's as if it's never had any but maybe the slightest little amount of moly-paste on just the splines themselves- but that's it!

Perhaps when I had a friend of mine help me get the spyder out we messed it up getting it back tightened down...

I couldn't get the spyder out of there so I took it by a guy from church's shop (automotive) - I figured we were probably going to have to use a puller to get it out- I had one or two of the nuts behind the pins loosened up a little- but anyway, we found out that just whapping it down on the ground a few times slid it right out of there- I wasn't worried about getting it back together at the time, so I thanked him- he took his wrench and put a pry bar between a few of the pins and tightened what nuts I had loose, and I went on my way-

-Only to find that no matter what orientation the spyder wouldn't find a place where it would slide easily into the holes/hub - by hammering it (lightly mind you) I could get it maybe half way -but that's as far as I wanted to go with it as it felt like it was going to get stuck if I went any farther.

-So I'm guessing that in the fiddling with it that I must've gotten the pins out of center- or somehow catawhompus to where they won't ....

Anyway, what I'm thinking is: I'll take this stuff back up to my friends shop, loosen the pins in the spyder to where they'll go in and out of the wheel smoothly, then use his 3/8 impact to snug then tighten them down while making sure they still slide without interference-- whaddya think?

If there's a procedure let me know- I was hesitant to take anything loose myself- and positively flipped when the guy took a pry bar to those fingers on the spyder- but maybe it will go together without throwing everything off kilter- I hope! - it's got 6 pins, should tend to be self-centering to a great extent (I hope!)

Thanks so much for the speedy response- I thought something couldn't be quite right!

[WingAdmin]

I haven't got the manual in front of me, but I'm pretty sure those pins aren't supposed to be loosened/removed at all, so there is no published torque value for them. With any luck you'll be able to get it loosened up and fitting in there correctly.

By the way, the name for that "spyder" piece is the Final Drive Flange, and the pins are Flange Fixing Bolts.

[1grouch2u]

Yeah, I was kinda afraid of that (that it should be treated as an assembly- not to be disassembled AT ALL!) It was just hard to put the brakes on the guy who was helping me already having disclaimed having any motorcycle-repair abilities, just helping me 'out of the goodness of his heart', and being as he was on his shop's time I didn't know how to go about telling him 'hold your horses" and to 'slow down and look at what you are doing!'

-I'm going to have to do just that anyway since he's the only guy I know in this town with any tools that has offered to help me- and I'm sure that he'll be fine with it, I just hate having to point out to him such an obvious screw up (I know I certainly wouldn't have stuck a long bar between those "Flange Fixing Bolts" as a way to hold the assy. to tighten them down.) -Maybe on something a lot less precision, although I can't begin to imagine what in that configuration that might be...

I just hope I can get that all centered back up adequately- it does look like like it should have been left alone- maybe I'll VERY CAREFULLY- back on the kitchen counter- loosen just enough of the pins (and hopefully determine which are preventing it from going smoothly) hand-tighten everything, then take it and use a hand impact for final tightening ... (I sure hope I haven't trashed the old thing, gosh, the splines are in such great shape and everything so clean- it's a shame )

[WingAdmin]

If you think some of the pins are bent, and they're coming out anyway, set a mirror down on a table and roll them across the mirror. That will make it fairly obvious quickly if any of them are bent.

[Fred Camper]

I have a wheel off the bike where the spider is real tight too, and was thinking of trying a puller. Maybe I will try vibration.

[1grouch2u]

I really doubt any of the pins are bent- I never applied anywhere near enough force to have done any of that! -What I would like to ask you is do you think it will be okay to take all of them loose, set it all up in the wheel- then tighten them down with the pins in the bushings- maybe put the final torque on them with a small impact, all the while making sure the flange assy. stays free enough to pull out and replace by hand?

Looks like decent weather for tomorrow so I'll hopefully get my radiator and all that back on the bike- maybe run it up to op temp and retorque the head- gettin' pretty close to having her on the road again. Thanks so much for your valueable insight and advice, you're a real lifesaver!


Oh yeah, by the way- the guy that was helping me was a guy from church -mounted my tire and tube, put a valve stem in my VW wheel (on my car) and only charged me $10- really nice guy, I just needed a little help because of this right-side-stroke-weakness. -It's hard to ask for help sometimes, let alone ask to stop somebody who you've asked for help (ddid that make sense?)

[WingAdmin]

I really doubt any of the pins are bent- I never applied anywhere near enough force to have done any of that! -What I would like to ask you is do you think it will be okay to take all of them loose, set it all up in the wheel- then tighten them down with the pins in the bushings- maybe put the final torque on them with a small impact, all the while making sure the flange assy. stays free enough to pull out and replace by hand?

The only issue I'd have with that - especially using an impact wrench - is that you are putting an awful lot of pressure on those rubber discs, which are supposed to absorb driveline shock. Too much pressure on them, they get loose, and now you have increased driveline lash.

[1grouch2u]

Okay now I'm paranoid about the splines- how far they intermesh- (that's not a real word, is it...?)

Turns freely enough, doesn't go any farther, right? Do I have a wrong nut on this axle?

If it was in a jam the wheel wouldn't turn at all, right?

I can't remember how far the axle used to protrude...

(and you can see light where the cotter pin goes through the axle in the axle; this nut I'm thinking might be out of something else?)
But if anything wasn't engaging the "pumpkin" wouldn't even begin to fit in there along with the caliper and the spacer, right?

And I was able to get the pins to slide in/out of the wheel relatively smoothly...

Maybe it's a nut off a CB750 or something...

But does that look like about how far the axle is supposed to come through?

PLEASE could you tell me why I keep thinking something doesn't look quite right here~!!!

I hope I'm not wasting your time - it's just been down for a really long time and what with my pronounced brain-damage I really want somebody to go behind and check my work just a little bit before I tear something up (I've got to put my left head's coolant tube back on when the O-rings get here, then I suppose I'll start it up and run it up a little bit, see if everything feels alright before I buckle everything together.)

Thanks for bearing with me when I get like this!

[Fred Camper]

The stock GL1000 nut is thinner and a think washer is used behind it. But your nut looks fine(did I say that) with the exception that torque will be more difficult to set due to no washer to slide against. Seems workable since the castleations are fine.

[1grouch2u]

The stock GL1000 nut is thinner and a think washer is used behind it. But your nut looks fine(did I say that) with the exception that torque will be more difficult to set due to no washer to slide against. Seems workable since the castleations are fine.

Okay cool- thanks Fred~! So best you can tell the stuff looks prety much together the way it ought to be? Yeah, something is wierd about that nut- like maybe it's the ball-joint nut off a Toyota truck or something (maybe even an American metric something?) Yeah, but you see what I mean about it not looking quite right, don't you? (Or am I just crazy- is what I was concerned with...)

Ya know what? I think I'll jump over to Partzilla real quick and order me up a nut and washer- Thanks Buddy

[1grouch2u]

Just an update~
Camper, yeah, it must've been paranoia on my part- I've been running it this long with that setup and everything seems just fine. Thanks again for the input!

[1grouch2u]

-The doctor upped my time on the dialysis machine from 3 1/4 hrs. to 4 hrs. today, and I think I can already tell an improvement. -Hopefully I'll get to feeling better and duck in a little more often. I've been feeling really crappy- 3 yrs. ago my kidneys still did part of their job, but now toast!

-Just thought I'd sneak in here and say "hi"