77 Wing Fuel Injection

[Dmerc]

Fuel injection project . What do you fellas think? Not running yet. Had to build the ECU from a Speeduino kit. Hoping to have it running this summer.

[landisr]

Following. Any details of the build/installation would be nice to see. 'Looks good' so far.

Ron in AZ

[Rednaxs60]

Nice looking bike. FI is an interesting project. I have an '85 Limited Edition and doing an ECU replacement/upgrade project with a Speeduino ECU. Using the v0.4.4 Josh Stewart interface board, and Arduino. Have and recommend the licensed versions of Tuner Studio and MegLogViewer. Interesting crank trigger wheel. The '85 CFI system has the dual wheel configuration, 8 tooth crank trigger wheel and single tooth cam wheel (only use one cam sensor). Couldn't make it work so went with a crank 36-1 trigger wheel, seems to be an optimum solution. Like your crank sensor arrangement.

Have been using the ECU to start and operate the engine for a couple of weeks now. Making progress, but it is slow. Easy to go down the proverbial rabbit hole now that you can "play" with settings and such. Take it slow, don't be rambunctious with setting changes.

When you start to use the Speeduino, remember it is not one of the squirt family. Use the same components, but are calibrated, setup differently.

A crank trigger wheel consideration can be one from a 1500. Think the crank timing belt pulley dimension may be the same - don't quote me on this. It is a 12-1 configuration. There are two choices, one has a 4 degree timing shift built in, the other has a 6 degree. Discussion I have had on the Speeduino forum is that this should not matter?

The PB MAP sensors from the '85 can be used for an external MAP Sensor - depending on your ECU board choice, the second one I have is going to be the real time baro sensor. Placement of the WBO2 sensor controller was a challenge - using 14point7 Spartan 3 Lite with ADV/LSU sensor. The '85 spark igniters work, as does the OEM or aftermarket TPS. Finding specs on the older CFI components has been slim pickings, and can be problematic.

If you use the '85 CFI spark igniters, I have found the TS setting to be GOING HIGH.

The '85 CFI injectors can be used, are low impedance so a resistor pack is required. You can use the resistor pack from an '85 CFI system.

The '86 SE-i has the same CFI system, and the components from it can be used as well.

Still a novice. Just some options was you go forward.

A couple of forum threads you may find interesting:
https://ngwclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=47&t=25983
https://ngwclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=47&t=24220

Good luck, will be following.

[Dmerc]

Hi Ernest, thanks for the links to info. Lots of good info! When I get mine running I'll be adding more details on my build. For me the hardest part will be learning the Tuner Studio program. It has been a fun project so far and has given me something to do during the winter. Dave

[Rednaxs60]

Dave - from my novice perspective, not too daunting. I started thinking about my OEM ECU replacement/Upgrade in 2019, went back to it last October. C-19 got in the way and I did some other motorcycle projects I had on the back burner.

I think I mentioned to have a licensed version of TS and MegaLogViewer (MLV), only way to go.

Print out the latest Speeduino manual, read thoroughly and make notes of the settings you want to make in Tuner Studio (TS) when you get to that point. TS may display a "box" about an upgrade to the software/firmware - can't remember which. I accepted and have not had any problems.

Take note of the settings that can be burned to the eprom without a restart of TS. The easy way to determine this is to load your tune and then make small changes, always revert back to what you started with, and TS will either accept the change being burned into the eprom, or require a restart.

Lower left corner details whether all data has been burned to the eprom.

If you restart TS when connected to the ECU and are operating the engine, the engine will stop.

The easy way to restart TS is to use "CNTRL W". Do this to disconnect, then once more to restart the tune. Took me a while to find this.

When you are going to do a trial, start data logging. Give it a specific name and let it gather the information from the trial. This is where MLV comes to the fore. You can take the data log, open it in MLV and view the various parameter traces, and on the bottom of the screen, the various info is also displayed.

There s a lot of concepts and parameters to understand, understanding is the key. What the table values indicate, operating rich/lean to mention a couple.

I am still learning about these. The inmates on the Speeduino forum are extremely helpful. I found that perusing the Speeduino forum threads regardless of the forum, you can find answers to your questions without going to the collective. There will be a lot of information that is repeated regardless of the forum thread. When this happens, I pay attention, has to be a good reason.

You can trial TS without having the Speeduino interface board, just need an Arduino. You are programming the Arduino microprocessor. The Speeduino interface board, actual or clone, connects the Arduino to the FI system components. If you want to use an engine simulator, you need the Speeduino board. What Speeduino board have you settled on?

Hope this information is relevant. Don't want to highjack your thread.

Cheers

[Dmerc]

Hijack heck! I appreciate the help! I do have the registered version of Tuner Studio. Pretty sure it includes the Mega log thingy. I'm using a gutted Suzuki carb with a TPS sensor for a throttle body and a car inline fuel pump mounted on the right side of the engine. I machined a fuel distribution manifold so that I wouldn't have to modify the gas tank and I'd retain the fuel guage set up. My goal here is to retain the good looks of the engine and stay with the stock looks and function as much as possible. I also machined an adapter plate so that I could use the vacuum advance unit off a GL1100. As you know vacuum advance is a big uprade and should yield several miles per gallon in fuel economy. Heres a couple more pics.

[Rambozo]

No need for the vacuum advance unit. You can duplicate that function via the MAP sensor and the ECU ignition advance tuning.

[Rednaxs60]

As Rambozo mentions, the ECU takes care of engine operation. The Speeduino has warmup enrichment curves, after start enrichment, AFR tables - need a WBO2 sensor. You can have a passive idle air circuit like the '85/'86 FI models - don't need to have a stepper motor. Spark igniters/coil drivers from an 1100 won't work get too hot and fail - check the forum thread I posted that socrace did. He posted wiring schematics of his build. Can have a fuel/oil pressure sensor connected to the Speeduino. Like the fuel pressure aspect, won't have to bleed the fuel rails to connect a fuel pressure gauge.

Do a thorough read and look at the wiring diagram. Recommend this because you want to keep as much of the "before" features as possible, especially for the dash. My ECU project does not affect the majority of the "before" features with the exception of the OEM ECU diagnostic function.

I'm still working on mine. Good luck.

[Dmerc]

Right, but the vacuum advance came before the fuel injection project. so it will stay for now. For starters I'm doing fueling only with the Speeduino but as you say when I figure out how to rig up the camshaft sensor I intend to have fullsequential injection with the ECU controlling ignition and idle speed. But that is a ways off. Here is a pic of the intake set up and accessories. Fuel pressure regulator is at front of plenum. It's huge. Could use a smaller unit off a car but I already plumbed it so it staysfor now.

[Spsesq1754]

April 1, 2023
Please let me know how you make out with this. I have a number of old wings (76, 77, 81, 82 and 84) and the carbs are/can be a real PIA.
Good luck and ... thanks.
Steve
Townsend, MA 978-870-7431