Anyone in the Pacific Northwest? Need a rebuild kit


Information and questions on GL1100 Goldwings (1980-1983)
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crumbliss.r639
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Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2017 12:26 am
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Motorcycle: 1981 Honda Goldwing GL1100

Anyone in the Pacific Northwest? Need a rebuild kit

Post by crumbliss.r639 » Sat Dec 16, 2017 8:08 pm



So, the GL1100 I bought for 300$ with no timing belts on it is in serious trouble. I put timing belts on it, as best I could, because I got no compression out of the #1 or #3 cylinders. but I did out of the #2 and #4 cylinders. So basically I am just going to rebuild the entire motor. Does anyone know if there are any reputable dealers here in the greater Seattle area that would have these in stock, or is there a specific website that I could go to and order the parts? I would rather not have to pay a 2 month salary for them either. I think I need to rebuild the starter as well, because nothing happens at all when I try to bump it over, even when I short across the solenoid. Also, I notice that spinning the rear wheel doesnt move the direct drive shaft coming off the transfer case. I can manually spin that when its in Neutral, but it doesnt move the wheel at all. Is that normal, or am I looking at rebuilding the rear axle as well? I have a feeling that before I am done with this project its going to cost me a lot of money;



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RBGERSON
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had every year from 75 to 83

Re: Anyone in the Pacific Northwest? Need a rebuild kit

Post by RBGERSON » Sun Dec 17, 2017 7:42 am

Before yoiu spend any money pull the 1/3 head ad see if you have bent valves or holed pistons. If holed pistons..get another motor..cheaper than a rebuild, if bent valves buy another head. They sell complete kits on eBay people have had good luck with Versa kits. But add OEM head gaskets.

are you sure you put the belts on correctly..IE when turn by hand the correct valves open and closed as they should in order.
HAD LOTS OF GOLDWING 75-83
NOW INTO 1500'S..RIDING A 1998 SE

FAIR WINDS,
RB

crumbliss.r639
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2017 12:26 am
Location: Seattle Washington
Motorcycle: 1981 Honda Goldwing GL1100

Re: Anyone in the Pacific Northwest? Need a rebuild kit

Post by crumbliss.r639 » Sun Dec 17, 2017 5:56 pm

Update:

I started by purchasing a new battery, and pulled the starter to bench test it. It worked on the bench so I put it back on the bike, and for whatever reason its now working.

So, with starter working, I put the compression gauge back on the bike, and have about 70psi on cylinders 2 and 4, and 0 on 1 and 3.

Next, I wanted to see how the valves were moving, to ensure the timing belts were properly aligned. I pulled the valve cover off and bumped it over a few times and the valves were all actuating properly. That led me then to turning the engine by hand to verify that I had the #1 cylinder at TDC on the compression stroke to align the timing. I did this by turning the crank until the intake valve had opened and closed, and the next time the marks on the head and gear lined up, I knew i was at TDC. I pulled the inspection plug and was showing that I was in fact at the #1 timing mark, thus I am in the right place.

With confidence that my timing belts are properly installed, I wanted then to observe the valves moving, so I removed the intake ports that go from the head to the carbs. I suppose you could call this the intake manifold? Not sure about that. Once those were off, and with the spark plug removed a shined (shone?) a light into the spark plug hole and turned the engine by hand. This is where I discovered the source of the problem. The intake valves never fully close on either the 1 or the 3 cylinder. They must be bent or something.

I pulled the head from that side, and put it up on the bench. it is difficult to turn when the intake valves are moving, and then suddenly just kind of pops and gets really easy to turn suddenly until the next intake valve actuates. The pistons and piston walls look great, the head itself looks in excellent condition, only the valves not seating.

NOW, I am faced with either fixing or replacing the head. I found a few online on Ebay, but those all scare me. There is no guarantee I am getting a good head if I order from ebay, but it seems the only place I can find one. It used to be that Bent Bike was the place to go, but they are closed forever. Sad face.

Has anyone ever done a valve job on one of these heads? How difficult is it? Are there aftermarket valves specific to these motors? Is there a comparable valve replacement, such as something from a Honda car engine around that year? Where is a good place to find replacement valves, or can the bent valves be successfully straightened? Is it possible to reuse a head gasket? Do I need to buy the entire kit for the one gasket? I can get an aftermarket gasket kit for the upper end for around 80, but the cheapest I could find just the head gasket was around 60.

Ok, I think that is enough for the questions for one day.

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MikeB
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Re: Anyone in the Pacific Northwest? Need a rebuild kit

Post by MikeB » Sun Dec 17, 2017 8:45 pm

Maybe you need to buy another GL100 for a parts bike.
MikeB
Tacoma, WA, USA

crumbliss.r639
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2017 12:26 am
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Motorcycle: 1981 Honda Goldwing GL1100

Re: Anyone in the Pacific Northwest? Need a rebuild kit

Post by crumbliss.r639 » Sun Dec 17, 2017 11:12 pm

Another update on this.

I have pulled the head, and the valves are indeed bent. Shining a light through the intake openings, with the valves closed, you can still see the light shining through. So as I asked, can you unbend the valves... I decided to go one further and just ask google. There are actually a couple of youtube videos that talk about using a hammer to tap the valves back into position. Well, I couldnt believe that is true, so I found a head on Ebay for $65.00 and ordered it, along with a boot for the drive line boot and the keeper ring for the shaft (since the bike has neither... glad I found THAT little gem before I tried riding it) and including shipping it all came to exactly $80. Now I just need a gasket.

Well, replacement head ordered, I thought... why not see if this works? So, back out to the "shop" (which is just a canopy with tarps around it) i went. I took my head, set it down on the concrete, positioned it as instructed, and WHACK. Nothing broke... WHACK is the valve shifting back into place? Oh, I need to turn it some and ... WHACK WHACK Whack. it worked? IT WORKED?!? Umm, so lets try the other one. Whack whack whack and it looks good too. No way this is right I say to myself. There is one way to know for sure... Place the head up on it's side and do a weep test. I have a partial bottle of Power Steering Fluid here, how about I use that. After pouring enough PSF to fill the intake with the valves closed, I wait. Surely this wont work, no way... 5 minutes, 10 minutes, 15 minutes go by and not a single drop seeps out? Oh my goodness that worked!!!!!

I drained the PSF out of the heads, and spun the cam around and felt a major difference. Before when the bent valves were moving it became almost impossible to spin it by hand. Now, it spins by hand without binding. The question is.. dare I try to use this head when I have another coming? And what guarantee do I have that the new head will be any better? It is a used head after all. I still dont have a gasket, so I cant put it back together right now regardless. I am simply dumbfounded that that worked. I see no evidence of cracks or damage to the valves, and believe me I looked. They seat well enough to hold back the PSF for 15 minutes. I am having a hard time seeing the down side on this $300 bike. I will have a spare head either way.

I know what you will all probably say. hitting the valve with a hammer like that has to ruin them. But I am not so certain of that. I am not an engineer who knows about metals and tensile strengths and such, but why cant it be okay? I think I am going to try this head back on the old girl and see what happens. Worst case scenario, I have to replace the motor completely, best case ... I get another 50k miles out of it before I have to rebuild it again.

Further updates after I get a head gasket.

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MikeB
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Re: Anyone in the Pacific Northwest? Need a rebuild kit

Post by MikeB » Sun Dec 17, 2017 11:35 pm

At least head gaskets are still available, unlike the valves. The part number for a 1981 Honda GL110 head gasket is 12251-MG9-306. They sell for less than $50.
MikeB
Tacoma, WA, USA

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RBGERSON
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Re: Anyone in the Pacific Northwest? Need a rebuild kit

Post by RBGERSON » Mon Dec 18, 2017 5:47 pm

How/where did you hit the valves?? to straighten them?? Never heard of that??
HAD LOTS OF GOLDWING 75-83
NOW INTO 1500'S..RIDING A 1998 SE

FAIR WINDS,
RB

crumbliss.r639
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2017 12:26 am
Location: Seattle Washington
Motorcycle: 1981 Honda Goldwing GL1100

Re: Anyone in the Pacific Northwest? Need a rebuild kit

Post by crumbliss.r639 » Mon Dec 18, 2017 7:24 pm

Without removing the valves from the head, you SLIGHTLY open them and then knock them with the hammer on the side that is not seating. Then reseat the valve and turn it, see where it is not seating. If it looks like it seats properly then seat the valve again, hit it a couple times, rotate the valve 90 degrees, hit rotate hit through a couple full turns. WARNING this has the potential to destroy your head, do it at your own risk. I only did it because I had another one already purchased.

After doing that with all 4 valves, I performed the week test as stated previously.

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RBGERSON
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Re: Anyone in the Pacific Northwest? Need a rebuild kit

Post by RBGERSON » Tue Dec 19, 2017 8:23 am

Thanks..very interesting...
HAD LOTS OF GOLDWING 75-83
NOW INTO 1500'S..RIDING A 1998 SE

FAIR WINDS,
RB

crumbliss.r639
Posts: 15
Joined: Wed Dec 13, 2017 12:26 am
Location: Seattle Washington
Motorcycle: 1981 Honda Goldwing GL1100

Re: Anyone in the Pacific Northwest? Need a rebuild kit

Post by crumbliss.r639 » Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:02 am

So here is the latest update.

Don't do this. Ever! As in never!

Since I had two heads I decided if I messed one up I was still okay. Which turned out to be true however it could have been very bad. I got the first head off used this technique to straighten the valves reground the valves with valve grinding compound resurface to the Head bought new gaskets, put it all back together, and after some other tinkering fired it up. It ran well 4 the first minute or so. I decided that I wanted to rev it up and see what happened so I rev the engine to about 4000 RPMs the engine said ping and just died. As I sat there concerned worried and upset I noticed antifreeze dripping out of the exhaust.
Basically what happened was the valve that I straightened snapped in 2 pieces and put a hole about the size of the spark plug hole in the head; luckily it didn't damage the Piston or the wall of the cylinder.
So lesson learned don't do this pay the 20 bucks for a new valve and do it right.
.
. The end at least for now

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Re: Anyone in the Pacific Northwest? Need a rebuild kit

Post by WingAdmin » Thu Jan 25, 2018 10:19 am

crumbliss.r639 wrote:
Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:02 am
So here is the latest update.

Don't do this. Ever! As in never!

Since I had two heads I decided if I messed one up I was still okay. Which turned out to be true however it could have been very bad. I got the first head off used this technique to straighten the valves reground the valves with valve grinding compound resurface to the Head bought new gaskets, put it all back together, and after some other tinkering fired it up. It ran well 4 the first minute or so. I decided that I wanted to rev it up and see what happened so I rev the engine to about 4000 RPMs the engine said ping and just died. As I sat there concerned worried and upset I noticed antifreeze dripping out of the exhaust.
Basically what happened was the valve that I straightened snapped in 2 pieces and put a hole about the size of the spark plug hole in the head; luckily it didn't damage the Piston or the wall of the cylinder.
So lesson learned don't do this pay the 20 bucks for a new valve and do it right.
.
. The end at least for now
I wish I had caught this posting before you did this, I could have told you exactly this.

Valves are hardened - meaning they are heated and cooled in a specific process after they are machined, to make the crystalline structure in the metal (yes, metal is a crystal) less stressed - it reduces internal stresses and aligns internal grain. This hardening is required for the valve to withstand the constant hammering of the cams without deforming.

When a valve is bent, the crystalline structure is re-stressed. Bending it back makes it even worse. Now the valve is not only hard, it is very brittle. When the cams start hammering on a piece of brittle steel...well, you just discovered the hard way what happens.

So the short answer is yes, a damaged valve is scrap. Don't try to fix and reuse them.

cheeky mike
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Re: Anyone in the Pacific Northwest? Need a rebuild kit

Post by cheeky mike » Mon Apr 02, 2018 2:35 pm

Hello Seattle goldwing gl 1100 carb rebuild. I am interested, I am on Vancouver Island, Campbell river



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