Pre Carb Rebuild Questions


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lake_harley
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Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by lake_harley » Tue Feb 26, 2019 9:44 am



After getting over 6 years of riding on a "make-do" carb cleaning and checking when resurrecting my '83 Interstate, I am facing pulling the carbs again. Last start-up of the bike last Fall resulted in a badly flooding carb so I know I have a float needle/seat issue of some sort. Generally the bike had run fine but this is a must-do repair.

I know the rebuild kit(s) many swear by is the one from Randakk. At over $200 that's a tough price to swallow and it doesn't include float needles and seats. It would be especially tough to spend the money knowing that I have an issue with parts that are not included and might need replacing. Can anyone speak from experience on the quality (or the lack of it) of carb kits from other sources like Bike Bandit or others?

BTW....I'm not bashing Randakk's parts or prices but I'd like to get the carbs lined out without spending more than necessity.

Lynn



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RBGERSON
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Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by RBGERSON » Tue Feb 26, 2019 10:14 am

HAD LOTS OF GOLDWING 75-83
NOW INTO 1500'S..RIDING A 1998 SE

FAIR WINDS,
RB

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Maz
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Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by Maz » Tue Feb 26, 2019 1:42 pm

It's worth removing the carbs first and checking the floats, needles and seats as they will likely only need cleaning. No point in paying for these items unless you need them, whereas the seals, o-rings , gaskets etc will almost definitely need replacing.
Maz
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lake_harley
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Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by lake_harley » Tue Feb 26, 2019 2:05 pm

Thanks for the replies and suggestions. I do have time to get this done, so I think I'll pull and disassemble the carbs to evaluate just what parts I need to replace, and which will suffice with a good cleaning. I followed the link to NGW and found the article on carb kit comparison. LOTS of info there for sure. I think it would take a couple careful readings to absorb everything.

Thanks!

Lynn

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newday777
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1983 GL1100A Wineberry 36,000 miles

1975 CB750 K5 Planet Blue 7,800 miles

1976 CB750 K6 Anterris Red 25,000 miles

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Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by newday777 » Wed Feb 27, 2019 7:35 am

Hmm. NGW site says the topic doesn't exist????

Float needles should always be replaced with the seats as sets.

Yes, buy the brass parts like the needle sets from Honda.

I've tried to go cheap on my first carb kit experience on my 83 GL1100 and had leaks galore from gaskets to float needle sets. I put in Randakks master kit after that experience. No more leak problems.
I've heard good reports of the K&L carb kits but haven't tried them.
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newday777
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1975 CB750 K5 Planet Blue 7,800 miles

1976 CB750 K6 Anterris Red 25,000 miles

Past rides
1999A Restored and sold at 19,000 miles

1999SE Totaled by cager at 105,000 miles

Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by newday777 » Wed Feb 27, 2019 8:03 am

Lynn

The Randakks master kit has everything you'll need other than float needle sets. The cheaper kits don't come with the accelerator pump or the air cutoffs, both which are usually needed, and are expensive from Honda if you find are cracked, (are at $60.55 x 4=$242 for the air cut offs alone) and the accl pump is discontinued from Honda.

Yes these carbs are expensive to properly rebuild, but done right and stored properly will last far longer than going cheap and not let you down miles from home.

Also, pull the float out of the fuel tank and clean and inspect the tank for rust and if needed, do an electrolysis rust removal followed with a fogging of Marvel Mystery Oil to prevent flash rusting.

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RBGERSON
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Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by RBGERSON » Wed Feb 27, 2019 9:48 am

HAD LOTS OF GOLDWING 75-83
NOW INTO 1500'S..RIDING A 1998 SE

FAIR WINDS,
RB

hrobinson
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Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by hrobinson » Thu Mar 07, 2019 1:14 pm

I have bought two of Randakk's kits. Yes its an investment but if you are going to do it correctly with seals using the correct materials, Randakk's kits are the best there is. Each needle and seat will cost you 15 dollars for each carb which I purchaced from Honda. Randakk also has a video covering the carb rebuild process. It might be worth purchasing as well. It covers the 1000 carb but the 1000 and the 1100 carb are similar. I bought the video and it was very comprehensive and worth the money.

lake_harley
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Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by lake_harley » Fri Mar 22, 2019 7:13 pm

I finally pulled the carbs, disassembled and cleaned the parts. Really didn't find any particular issues other than what appeared to be a tiny piece of what I suspect as something from inside the fuel line. I replaced the fuel line and filter, blew everything out with compressed air and reassembled the whole works. Bike started and ran just fine but I still had a leak at the rear carb on the right side (#3?) and it appeared similar to the issue that started this all......a suspected failure of that carb's needle and seat to do it's job.

With some further investigation it appeared the problem might have been a hose clamp not clamping the fuel line tight enough on the fuel inlet "tube". I replaced the clamp, but still a leak if I ever-so-slightly wiggled the flexible fuel line at the carb. It appears to me that the fuel inlet tube (brass?) is pressed into the carb body. There's no retainer clip or anything so I guess it's just the press fit that provides the seal.

Has anyone had a similar issue? I'm considering various fixes, the first being to try a small bead of J-B Weld where the inlet tube enters the carb body. Honestly, I don't have very high hopes of that being successful, but I figure it's worth a try. The better option would likely require pulling the cars again (argh!) and I would plan to pull out the brass tube, find or make a tube with 1/16" NPT thread and then tap the hole in the carb body. Finding 1/16" NPT fittings might prove very difficult, but I'm almost certain they're out there.

I'm open to suggestions, hopefully short of replacing the carb rack ;) , if anyone else has any experience with such a problem.

Thanks, in advance.

Lynn

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newday777
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Location: Milford NH summer and fall Oceanside, CA winters(N San Diego) with lots of miles riden between
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1983 GL1100A Wineberry 36,000 miles

1975 CB750 K5 Planet Blue 7,800 miles

1976 CB750 K6 Anterris Red 25,000 miles

Past rides
1999A Restored and sold at 19,000 miles

1999SE Totaled by cager at 105,000 miles

Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by newday777 » Sat Mar 23, 2019 6:54 am

Lynn
The inlet is pressed in.
I have not read of any leaking in the past 10 years of working on these and being on the forums.
JB weld might do it.

Do you shut off the petcock every time you shut the bike off? Honda recommends that it be done and I've found it is best to do so to prevent siphoning the tank of gas into the crankcase and now this leak of yours added into the mix.

lake_harley
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Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by lake_harley » Sat Mar 23, 2019 7:26 am

Thanks. I expected it was pressed in. I'm going to give the JB Weld a shot. I'll clean the area with MEK and then let the JB Weld cure at least 24 hours. I do religiously turn the petcock off every time I get off the bike even if it's just to go into a convenience store to pay for gas.

The leak is so slight now that riding down the road the air moving would evaporate the gas as quickly as it seeps out, but I'd hate to get out on the road and have it get worse. Buddy Holly's "Great Balls of Fire" comes to mind. :o

Lynn

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redbug
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Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by redbug » Sat Mar 23, 2019 5:13 pm

Just replaced the fuel inlet tube o-rings two days ago. Now this was a 83 1100. The bolt is just above the inlet pipe. I missed these on my rebuild. The o rings come in the carb kits or you can source them out. Two o rings will be needed. The fitting pulls out and lube it good before reinstalling I used petroleum jelly.
" Riding on Tulsa Time "

lake_harley
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Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by lake_harley » Sat Mar 23, 2019 11:14 pm

Thanks, redbug....I'll take another look.

Lynn

Good Hondog
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Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by Good Hondog » Sun Mar 24, 2019 12:27 am

lake_harley wrote:
Sat Mar 23, 2019 7:26 am
Buddy Holly's "Great Balls of Fire" comes to mind. :o

Lynn
Actually that was a Jerry Lee Lewis hit.

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tigercub
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Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by tigercub » Sun Mar 24, 2019 7:10 am

I'm in the process of doing the Randakks carb rebuild on my 1980 GL1100....I have pulled the carbs and opened the float bowls and inspected all. I have noticed that the float needles have a rubber tip (ok good) but the little "projecting tit" on the other end is "fixed" in place and I was under the impression that it should be spring loaded and move in and out of the main needle's body? Is this correct? or have these needles been replace with the incorrect needle?

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ekvh
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Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by ekvh » Sun Mar 24, 2019 9:13 am

**** should move up and down. LOL Try soaking just the non-rubber part for a while and carefully exercising the spring with a small flat bladed screwdriver. The clip can be removed. They usually clean up for me that way.

lake_harley
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Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by lake_harley » Sun Mar 24, 2019 10:21 am

Good Hondog wrote:
Sun Mar 24, 2019 12:27 am
lake_harley wrote:
Sat Mar 23, 2019 7:26 am
Buddy Holly's "Great Balls of Fire" comes to mind. :o

Lynn
Actually that was a Jerry Lee Lewis hit.
Oops.....correction appreciated and noted. :oops:

Lynn

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tigercub
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Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by tigercub » Sun Mar 24, 2019 4:54 pm

Thanks Ekvh,

I tried to free up today using PB Blaster, Carb cleaner and 30 mins in an Ultrasonic Cleaner....I was only able to free one of the needle tabs up, the others are FROZEN ! At least I know that the tit should be spring loaded and I thank you for that....so now I must consider replacements

lake_harley
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Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by lake_harley » Sun Mar 24, 2019 5:58 pm

redbug wrote:
Sat Mar 23, 2019 5:13 pm
Just replaced the fuel inlet tube o-rings two days ago. Now this was a 83 1100. The bolt is just above the inlet pipe. I missed these on my rebuild. The o rings come in the carb kits or you can source them out. Two o rings will be needed. The fitting pulls out and lube it good before reinstalling I used petroleum jelly.
Thank You....Thank You, redbug! You are absolutely right, the fuel inlet tube on the #3 (Right Rear) carb is indeed a removable tube held in by a somewhat "teardrop" shaped tab. I pulled it out and matched the O-ring size as well as I could out a "factional" rather than metric O-ring assortment I have. I believe the size of the O-ring is 3/32" (cross section diameter X 3/8" outside diameter. It was a tad loose in the grooves on the brass inlet tube, but I lubed it with white lithium grease, it went right into place with a little (desirable) drag fit in the carb body, and best of all my leak is fixed! Thanks again. I was w-a-y off track before thinking it was merely an interference press-in fit of the tube into the carb body.

Thanks, one more time!

Lynn

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tigercub
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Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by tigercub » Mon Mar 25, 2019 4:14 pm

with a few days of working the little devils I was finally able to get all 4 needle valve "****" free! the most stubborn had to be put in a vise (very gentility) and tapped with a light hammer to free it ...success is sweat! Thanks GWDs
:D

ConWonTheDon1100
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Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by ConWonTheDon1100 » Tue Mar 26, 2019 11:27 am

just for future reference, that randakks kits is the best kit out there. If you go the K&L route you will pay as much as you would pay for the randakks kit, a high performance fuel filter, and a set of 4 ngk spark plugs. I priced out everything from multiple different sources and even my brother who worked at a motorcycle dealership couldn't get me the K&L kits for any cheaper than buying the randakks kit and the K&L kit comes with jets you don't need and is missing the 4 vacuum diaphragms and the accelerator pump diaphragm and o rings. I'd say unless you really have a grudge against randakks to go with their kit and get a new fuel filter. You'll save some money and have a better filter then oem or a parts store. It's gonna be close to $300 to source all the K&L kits and the other needed parts compared to $229.99.

ConWonTheDon1100
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Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by ConWonTheDon1100 » Tue Mar 26, 2019 11:28 am

if you do go with K&L ebay is your best bet though

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Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by dakotanator » Mon Apr 01, 2019 9:11 am

When all is said and done, you might just end up spending a lot more trying to do it yourself.
I have an '83 Aspencade, and my carbs were TRASHED when I bought it. I finally.....FINALLY....bit the bullet and sent the carbs to Pistol Pete. BEST DECISION I ever made. I put them back on......hooked everything up.....and it turned over and started...AND IDLED....perfectly. I haven't had to do a single adjustment to them. Also.......I am a fairly large guy, and I am still getting 41 mpg on it.

This winter was the first time I have been able to "winter-over" this bike. I will post later how she starts up again this season. I followed WindAdmin's "Wintering your bike" instructions to the letter, and I am fully confident she'll start up with no issues. The weather is getting better every day, and I will be "letting the badger loose" sometime soon. Can't wait to put some miles on her..!!!
It's not WHAT you ride......it's THAT you ride.

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Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by tigercub » Mon Apr 01, 2019 12:01 pm

I was thinking of sending my carb set in to Pistol Pete and since his price list for service in 2018 or 2019 was not updated, I sent them an email for info re cost and if they accepted work from Canada....Alas, got no reply, so I ordered Randakks kit and waiting on delivery so I will be doing the rebuild myself. :mrgreen:
I am an HVAC Tech retired so I'm quite used to detailed instructions and fussy mechanical thing-a-ma-jiggs, so I'm up for the challenge.

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redbug
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Re: Pre Carb Rebuild Questions

Post by redbug » Mon Apr 01, 2019 12:37 pm

You will do just fine and here is one word you need to hear. Clean,clean,clean. Did I say clean? Biggest problem on a rebuild. If you think you have it clean,you do not. Clean again. Ports and passage ways are small especially idle mixture ports to the needle. Clean. Especially #2, No + or- on float levels (mission critical) must be spot on. clean Do not forget the two o-rings on the fuel inlet by #3. Bolt above inlet to remove. Pulls out. lube on install. clean. Sure would like to see pictures. We like pictures. Take lots of pics of carb rebuild for reference and mark main components. clean Keep us informed. carry on...


" Riding on Tulsa Time "

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