Strange noise at engine stop


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JB THEVENON
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Strange noise at engine stop

Post by JB THEVENON »



Hello everyone

My 1982 GL1100 did a strange noise at engine stop after a 150 miles ride. I tried a few days after, and the noise is still there. It looks like a pulley or a whistling like a kind of air intake. But it happens only at the end of engine shutdown.
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Does anyone experienced this already ?
JB


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LAB3
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Re: Strange noise at engine stop

Post by LAB3 »

Two things come to mind: Gas cap venting or possibly valves in need of adjustment. When was the last time you checked valve clearance?
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JB THEVENON
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Re: Strange noise at engine stop

Post by JB THEVENON »

I checked the valve clearance this winter as I changed the timing belts. I think if the adjustments were bad it would have sound like this since I restarded the bike in february, unless the valve clearance changed meanwhile.....I need to check then....
thanks for your answer :)
jb
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Re: Strange noise at engine stop

Post by LAB3 »

When I first saw that post, the video wasn't displaying. Now that I've heard it, it sounds like your starter sprag clutch might be catching just a bit as the engine shuts down. On my bike it was having a hard time catching when it was cold and I read somewhere to give the starter button a quick press while the engine was running. The thinking behind that was it helps sling some oil up to it and after I tried it (plus a fresh battery) it never did it again.
It's difficult for a man to understand something when his salary depends on his not understanding it.
JB THEVENON
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Re: Strange noise at engine stop

Post by JB THEVENON »

interesting insight. thank you.

I did again a test this morning : the sound is made only once the engine is hot. I did many starts and stops (on center stand) and the sound appears once the engin exits the blue area of temperature gauge.
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Re: Strange noise at engine stop

Post by WingAdmin »

I'd try to see if you can localize the source of the sound a bit - maybe a mechanic's stethoscope.
JB THEVENON
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Re: Strange noise at engine stop

Post by JB THEVENON »

still investigating ... the hotter is the engine the more the whistling appears.
On this new video the engine is at its nominal temperature.
1) When it stops, a small whistling can be heard
2) when it restarts the whisling is loud at engine idle, but as I accelerate a bit, it disappears forever, until I cut ignition.

I did another experience : I let the engine idle with the whistling. When the cooling fan starts the whisling stops.
I did also a test withe fake tank open to hear if some noise could come from the air supply and circuit : nothing

The more I think to it the more I am convinced the cooling system is the root cause. I tried to find someone having the same issue on Internet but after 3 evenings I gave up : no insight from that side....I wonder what I could do to confirm that feeling...before I start disassembling the cooling system...

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JB
my philosophy : To do is to be (Kant). To be is to do (Sartre), Do be do be do (Sinatra)
LAB3
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Re: Strange noise at engine stop

Post by LAB3 »

I'm pretty sure you got some good advice from wingadmin, try to find out where that sound is coming from with a stethoscope, a piece of rubber fuel line or other tubing should be all you need. As to the cooling system, that wouldn't be my first assumption since it seems to happen at low RPM, goes away at higher RPM and returns at lower RPM (engine shutdown) Track down the noise before you start tearing things down or ordering parts!
It's difficult for a man to understand something when his salary depends on his not understanding it.
JB THEVENON
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Re: Strange noise at engine stop

Post by JB THEVENON »

ok I did another video showing the sound may come from the engine itself (too bad)
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I leave home for 3 weeks vacation (French way of life :). I'll see with my favorite tool (wooden handle screwdriver) once back home.
Meantime any idea is welcome.
Many thanks
JB
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Re: Strange noise at engine stop

Post by WingAdmin »

It does sound like air whistling. If that's the case, it's possible that it only occurs when the engine is at a specific RPM that causes a specific air flow rate to resonate whatever is whistling. When the fan comes on, it puts extra load on the engine, dropping the RPM below that which the whistle would normally occur. Same goes for when you rev it up.

You might try opening the air filter cover to expose the intake path, removing the restriction of the air filter, and see if it changes at all.

It could also be a vacuum leak in the intake runners, or carb adjustment vacuum ports.
JB THEVENON
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Re: Strange noise at engine stop

Post by JB THEVENON »

I can now reproduce the default each time : engine at nominal temperature, push start button (nothing else), whistling comes instantaneously, if the rpm change (either because acting on accelerator or if the fan starts), the noise disapears. Back to idle rpm no more sound. Then a smal sound at ingnition cut.

I used my smartphone mic to try identifying the source which looks coming from the engine lower front. It really seems coming from the water pump....

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In fact there are a lot of Youtube videos about abnormal noise on GL1100 but none have such a noise.
Is a failure of the water pump quite unusual on this model ?

jb
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Re: Strange noise at engine stop

Post by WingAdmin »

Failure of the water pump is actually quite common. One of the most common failures of any mechanical part on the bike.

You can see the replacement process here: How to remove and replace your water pump
JB THEVENON
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Re: Strange noise at engine stop

Post by JB THEVENON »

I 've seen the procedure : very clear and straightforward;
Thank you WingAdmin :) :) :)
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JB THEVENON
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Re: Strange noise at engine stop

Post by JB THEVENON »

to WingAdmin
Thanks for the water pump procedure. Do you know where I can find torque to apply to all screws involved in the procedure ?
KInd regards
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Re: Strange noise at engine stop

Post by WingAdmin »

JB THEVENON wrote: Thu Jul 29, 2021 5:40 am to WingAdmin
Thanks for the water pump procedure. Do you know where I can find torque to apply to all screws involved in the procedure ?
KInd regards
The service manual will have torque values for all machine screws, bolts and nuts. If it doesn't have a value for a specific fastener, you can refer to the table at the front of the manual, which gives universal torque values based on the size and type of fastener.
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Re: Strange noise at engine stop

Post by JB THEVENON »

Hi everyone

I am currently following the detailed procedure for water pump replacement. I am now 'stucked' because I cannot remove the transmission cover : all screw have been removed (just one is unscrew but cannot be removed because of the frame). I hit several times the cover lower lugs (left and right) with a screwdriver then with a chisel and a hammer and the cover didn't move even a quarter of inch. I don't want to damage anything then I am wandering if someone has any hint that could help me. Here is my current procedure's step



JB
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Re: Strange noise at engine stop

Post by WingAdmin »

JB THEVENON wrote: Wed Aug 11, 2021 1:13 pm Hi everyone

I am currently following the detailed procedure for water pump replacement. I am now 'stucked' because I cannot remove the transmission cover : all screw have been removed (just one is unscrew but cannot be removed because of the frame). I hit several times the cover lower lugs (left and right) with a screwdriver then with a chisel and a hammer and the cover didn't move even a quarter of inch. I don't want to damage anything then I am wandering if someone has any hint that could help me. Here is my current procedure's step P_20210811_193601.jpg

JB
If you're sure all the bolts have been removed, then force is what you have left to remove that cover. It's sealed to the engine block with a gasket that pretty much becomes a part of the smooth, flat metal surfaces to which it mates, so it can be pretty tough to remove. You might try a little bit of heat around the periphery of the cover and then give those lugs a good hit again. Whatever you do, don't be tempted to jam a screwdriver or whatever in between the surfaces to pry them apart, you will gouge out the flat surfaces and have a leak forevermore.
JB THEVENON
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Re: Strange noise at engine stop

Post by JB THEVENON »

OK thank you for the idea. I've a heat gun, I'll try.
Indeed I remember the warning on your procedure : not to insert a small screwdriver at gasket interface :)
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JB THEVENON
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Re: Strange noise at engine stop

Post by JB THEVENON »

you were right : I missed a screw although I red the procedure twice (probably I wanted to go to fast, sun is back : I want to ride).
Unfortunately my small wrench is too thick and the bolt seems a bit used. Do you have a dedicated tooling for that purpose ? a thin wrench that could fit the bolt spacing with the transmission cover ?
JB


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Re: Strange noise at engine stop

Post by WingAdmin »

JB THEVENON wrote: Thu Aug 12, 2021 12:53 pm you were right : I missed a screw although I red the procedure twice (probably I wanted to go to fast, sun is back : I want to ride).
Unfortunately my small wrench is too thick and the bolt seems a bit used. Do you have a dedicated tooling for that purpose ? a thin wrench that could fit the bolt spacing with the transmission cover ?
JB
P_20210812_192440.jpg
A small six-point (not 12-point), thin-walled socket is going to be your best bet for that one, I think.
JB THEVENON
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Re: Strange noise at engine stop

Post by JB THEVENON »

In French we say " we can recognize a machinist based on his own tooling". I bought a Facom wrench (6 point as you recommended it). It works perfect. My old tooling can be discarded...
Now I can proceed, hoping my diagnosis is the good one (the water pump).
BTW how can we recognize a oild pump is failing ?
thanks again for your advice.
JB
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Re: Strange noise at engine stop

Post by WingAdmin »

JB THEVENON wrote: Fri Aug 13, 2021 1:11 pm In French we say " we can recognize a machinist based on his own tooling". I bought a Facom wrench (6 point as you recommended it). It works perfect. My old tooling can be discarded...
Now I can proceed, hoping my diagnosis is the good one (the water pump).
BTW how can we recognize a oild pump is failing ?
thanks again for your advice.
JB
Two ways: One, it's leaking (either coolant or oil) out the weep hole on the bottom.

The other way is that the shaft is loose (has free play) in the housing, which will quickly wear out the seals and cause it to leak.

Also, if it's stiff and hard to turn, that's a good indication that it's nearing end of life.
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Re: Strange noise at engine stop

Post by JB THEVENON »

I am done. A test ride of 20 miles : ok and no more noise. Thank you for the detailed procedure, the torques to apply and the tips. Impossible to do without these.

A near miss to share : due to my bad view, when I installed the new water pump, I had the 3 new washers for the 3 bolts holding the water pump, but I didn't find the old washers. I was then assuming that prior owner didn't set those washers....I was tightening the 3 bolts by hand, and I had a doubt. I checked again and saw the old washers, they are so thin I didn't see them and was near to tighten bolts with news washers above the old ones....






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