1986 gl1200 Aspencade question


Information and questions on GL1200 Goldwings (1984-1987)
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Ohara
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Motorcycle: 1986 Interstate
1986 Aspencade

1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by Ohara »



Hi, It is my turn to ask Probably a silly question. I have an 86 Interstate that runs great. The other day I bought a 86 Aspencade that is in amazing shape, it has a dead stator so the price was right. I will do the poorboy conversion over the winter. After trailering the bike home of course I charged up the battery and took it for a ride. It ran a bit rough for about 20 minutes and died about 1 mile from home. (These bikes are heavy to push). Could this have been the result of the battery running low. The starter turned over very good, the bike would not start, it did however back fire like a shot gun a couple of times. After sitting for a while with the charger on it started right up, I ran it for a few minutes and shut it off. Then it would not start again. The next morning it started just fine several times. I am going to go through all the electrical connection and test every thing the manual suggests. I am quite interested in your opinions.........



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roadwanderer2
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Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by roadwanderer2 »

from what you said about it backfiring, personally, i wouldn't start that bike up again until at least at a minimum taking the spark plugs out and do a compression test on all 4 cylinders, change out the timing belts and check the timing mark with the T1 mark on the flywheel with the arrows on the cam pulleys, take the valve covers off and check the valves, change out the fuel filter, oil and filter.

once all that is done, then try to fire it up and see how its running and go from there. question....does it have carbs or fuel injectors.

stuart.

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Ohara
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1986 Aspencade

Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by Ohara »

Thanks for the fast reply, it has carbs, I will be doing the things you suggested before this winter is over. I have already started ....

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SilverDave
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Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by SilverDave »

Its all a very related system : Stator ( Alternator ) Reg/rect/battery ... and all the connections .

A flaw in any one of them can take the others down .
I would take the battery to a battery shop to be professionally load tested ( They are NOT forever things )
and then , starting at the dogbone fuse check each and every connection.. braided ground, key , shut-off, battery cable , etc , etc .

We can assume that the new Poorboy is working , but is its (internal ) Reg/rect working properly ? Is the main Fuse ok ? ( not cracked ).
Do you have a parasitic voltage drain ?

For some reason , its not charging .. I'd ride with a voltmeter / multimeter until you find out just why its not charging .

Good Luck !

SilverDave

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Rednaxs60
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Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by Rednaxs60 »

Dave and Stuart are giving good info. The 1200s have an electrical system that is dependent on all its parts. The battery is just big enough to start the bike and keep it operating until the stator starts producing sufficient power then the stator provides the power for the bike. This is similar to cars of late, take the battery out and cars will stall, system is all interrelated. These bikes like power and a drop in the battery voltage (these batteries discharge quite quick when not being assisted by the stator) will cause your bike to backfire and not operate correctly. The starter has quite the draw and it does not take much for the battery to discharge or not turn the bike over. I'd recommend you do the alt mod install sooner than later if you want to do any late season riding. You'll probably find that most of these issues will go away when you have lots of power under the hood so to speak.

Look for a 40-50 amp alternator for your bike, this is more power than you presently have and will fit nicely under the lower fairing. I am using a three wire alt and like the idea of having a light that can alert me as to whether the alt is working or not. A single wire alt is also good. You should be able to go to an auto electrical shop and get a good used one or have one refurbished at a reasonable price.

Hear there is snow flying in the Ottawa and Barrie areas already (family and friends there).

Good luck.
"When you write the story of your life, don't let anyone else hold the pen"

Ernest

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Ohara
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1986 Aspencade

Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by Ohara »

Thanks again for the replies, I will complete the poor boy conversion first, while I am at it I will check the fuel pump and relay, pulse generators and pretty much every other related cause. After all I have a few months (TOO MANY) of very cold weather and of course SNOW to get through. I have a wood stove in the garage and this project will help pass the time. I will report back in the spring/ early summer and let you know how this turns out. Now does any one have a favorite alternator to recommend? I plan to purchase the kit with out the alternator from Don fairly soon... The best part of winter here is chilling your beer in a snow bank.

Later ohara....

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SilverDave
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Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by SilverDave »

Ohara :
I have little claim to 1200 electrical fame ( except ,I have managed 11 years and 70,000 on the same old stator )

but ...

Randakks has been advising 1000 / 1100 . 1200 owners for years ..

Read what he says here ...in RED, near the bottom :

http://randakks.com/products/upgraded-s ... and-gl1200

<<"You must diagnose and solve whatever problem(s) killed the stator you are replacing.
Throwing a new stator at your charging problem is NOT a sufficient solution! " >>


So ... somewhere in your system ( Stator /battery / Reg / rect ) you have a serious problem ,
which adding aa Poorboy will not solve .

so.......
BEFORE tearing out the old stator, be sure you do the 4 part rect/reg test , and the 3 part stator test :

http://iwing.org/Tech%20info/testingstator.htm
http://www.goldwingfacts.com/forums/2-g ... lator.html

You must find the problem before you do any extensive replacements

Good Luck

SilverDave

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Ohara
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1986 Aspencade

Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by Ohara »

Thanks for the advise Silver Dave, It is much appreciated.. I will do a complete check

ohara

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Rusty Bike
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Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by Rusty Bike »

Amazing shape! How long did it set? Was there fuel stabilizer in it? A Triumph dealer told me six weeks is max time with ethanol gas in the carbs. After that time, figure on trouble. When you buy these old bikes you need to go thru about everything because few folks take care of 30 yr old bikes. I put about a grand in parts in mine but it's doing well now. Just got off it AAMOFact. Sweet. Good luck with your new baby...Rusty

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Ohara
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1986 Aspencade

Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by Ohara »

Hi Rustybike, according to the PO it has sat for a couple of weeks. However I will be draining and refilling the tank and carbs with fresh stabilized fuel tomorrow.

Thanks for the heads up, I am glad you have you bike up and running.. I have been running regular grade gas in my Interstate with the occasion addition of ATF, should I be using the supreme? (High Octane?)

Take care, ohara
Once I get organized I will post pictures of it and the Aspencade...

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Rednaxs60
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Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by Rednaxs60 »

Using higher octane in an engine designed for regular octane is just giving tax dollars to the Feds. Higher octane fuel prevents ignition of the fuels when an engine runs extremely hot or has high compression. When an engine runs hot, the recommended fuel can ignite before it should causing the engine to "ping" so to speak. In this case using a higher octane fuel is beneficial. In our case living and riding mostly in Canada, there is no need to use a higher octane fuel. Using higher octane gas than regular in a 1200 can actually reduce the efficiency of the engine resulting in unburnt fuel going out the back end, hence reduced fuel economy as well.

SeaFoam fuel additive is also an excellent fuel system cleaner.

Having mentioned the above, there is actually no substitute for carb removal and cleaning especially if the fuel has turned and has coated (shellacked) the inside passages of the carbs.

Good luck.
"When you write the story of your life, don't let anyone else hold the pen"

Ernest

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Rusty Bike
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Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by Rusty Bike »

I'm running mostly ethanol free lawn mower fuel and MMO. Ran three tanks of the E Free and Red Line fuel injector cleaner when I put my SEi on the road. That combination defiantly made a difference in performance. The owners manual states that ethanol fuel will cause low RPM problems! I have found this to be true.
Your bike only sat a couple of weeks, thats a good sign but who knows about those carbs??. Process of elimination. Make dam sure that stator is bad before you proceed. Study this site and others for info. BUY the MANUALS if you don't have them currently. That's how mine got fixed. I actually enjoyed the process. Good luck

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roadwanderer2
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Motorcycle: previously owned 83 GL1100A aspencade traded for a motorhome, 1981 honda GL500i silverwing interstate, 1974 yamaha xs400, 1974 Honda cb450 twin cam, 1983 honda vt30, 1982 honda 700 shadow, 1972 cb750four, and my first bike, a brand new 1982 honda CM400e. now own-1986 GL1200 aspencade SEi
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Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by roadwanderer2 »

from my own personal experience, using regular unleaded fuel, 87 octane in my 83 1100 made it run terrible. it would bog down on hard throttle, ping and rattle when trying to pick up speed in a higher gear going up hill, to put it bluntly, it ran like s**t even with using some sea foam and non ethanol fuel 87 octane in the fuel tank.

what i had to do was drain the entire fuel tank and carbs and refill it with premium 93 octane fuel. once the higher octane was running thru it the bike had a LOT more power. absolutely no hesitation, bogging down, pinging or rattling, just pure power at any speed in any gear. i dont care what anybody says or what the gas prices are or what the "manufacture recommends", i for one will never put anything less than 93 octane in my 83 1100 and that also applies to my 86 1200 SEi CFI.

stuart.

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RoadRogue
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Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by RoadRogue »

Not to hijack k this thread but..........
Stuart, it is your right to waste your money on over priced ,higher than needed octane fuel for your machine. It is also your right to ignore the very engineers who designed and built the engine powering your bike. It is also your right to believe you know more than those same engineers and the real world experience of tens of thousands of riders who put regular 87 octane into the fuel tanks of those bikes everyday and have absolutely no problems with engine performance in their properly tuned rides. Higher octane will only benefit a ride that has higher compression motors than these bikes have. Higher octane used in a lower compression engine does not give better performance, it actually gives poorer performance because the fuel is less volatile, not that you could feel it. If you want to tell yourself that 93 octane is better than 87 octane fuel for your bike go ahead, after all it is your hard earned money you are wasting. 8-)
Ride safe, Todd
Over night campers welcome

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Ohara
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1986 Aspencade

Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by Ohara »

Thanks for your input fellows, I see that octane rating is a thing of personal choice. I did put Sea Foam in my Interstate this year, a few ounces every third fill up. I too find it is an excellent cleaner. I am going to check the three yellow wires all the way down to the stator to see if anything silly is going on. They did fail the ohm test and I have not tried the out put test yet. I would be a happy man if the stator in the Aspencade actually is working.. Now to make some time and dive in. Thanks again Ohara ... I will be back with my findings, mean while I really enjoy your input..

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roadwanderer2
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Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by roadwanderer2 »

RoadRogue wrote:Not to hijack k this thread but..........
Stuart, it is your right to waste your money on over priced ,higher than needed octane fuel for your machine. It is also your right to ignore the very engineers who designed and built the engine powering your bike. It is also your right to believe you know more than those same engineers and the real world experience of tens of thousands of riders who put regular 87 octane into the fuel tanks of those bikes everyday and have absolutely no problems with engine performance in their properly tuned rides. Higher octane will only benefit a ride that has higher compression motors than these bikes have. Higher octane used in a lower compression engine does not give better performance, it actually gives poorer performance because the fuel is less volatile, not that you could feel it. If you want to tell yourself that 93 octane is better than 87 octane fuel for your bike go ahead, after all it is your hard earned money you are wasting. 8-)
RoadRogue, i wasn't trying to hijack this thread, and i never meant to be knowing more than the people that designed my bikes engine, i was merely pointing out my personal real world experience about fuel and my bikes performance. what i AM saying is i don't mind paying a few more cents per gallon if it will make my bike perform better. the difference in price between regular and premium around here is about 15 cents per gallon and costs less than $12.00 to fill up.

now, let me ask you a question..........i've used almost every brand of gas @ 87 octane, Exxon, mobile, marathon, shell, Sunoco, Hess, BP, and some of the off brand names, why would my bike run so poorly on 87 octane, and as soon as i put 93 octane in it, it will run perfectly. am i missing something here?

also if i need to move this conversation to a new thread, please advise me as to where it would belong.

stuart.

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ekvh
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Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by ekvh »

Don't want touch that old octane question, but towards fall, I start running 91 Shell because it's ethanol free. I don't know of anywhere else to get e-free fuel and if I have to drive to a marina, well I'll just buy the 91 octane. Here it's as much as a dollar per gallon more. I use stabil as well. Opening a carb up in the spring and finding it full of jelly is not fun. Never had my bike carbs turn to jelly over winter, but lawn mowers and weedwacker and generators have.

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Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by WingAdmin »

It's true that our bikes are designed and rated for regular fuel, and don't require high octane.

However, if an engine designed for regular fuel is pinging (detonating) under load, one way to solve the problem is to use high octane premium, which is what this type of fuel is designed to do. This will without a doubt stop the detonation.

Of course, another way to solve the problem is to fix whatever is causing it to happen in the first place - too lean a mixture, cylinder head deposits, etc.

That said, once upon a time I had an old 1994 Ford Explorer that would wheeze and detonate every time you went up a hill at highway speeds. I really didn't want to put time into fixing that old thing, so putting premium fuel into it was an easy solution.

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Rusty Bike
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Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by Rusty Bike »

I am not a snake oil salesman but I will tell a story here. I had a small engine repair shop while i was in apprenticeship electrician. I once dumped MMO into a badly carboned Briggs engine. That engine sat for about 6 weeks. Upon disassembly I found, to my amazement, that the carbon had turned to black goo. I was able to clean the combustion chamber with a wooden stick!
Nother story, I bought a 42 Dodge WD21 pickup. Chrysler Spitfire flat six engine. Engine had 30 PSI on one cylinder, the rest were zero! I dumped a can of MMO in the carb and cranked it. Truck sat for four months till my brother and I got into a case of beer. Bert said, lets start that truck. I told him about the compression but then stated" Well I did dump MMO in it, lets try it". Guess what...that SOB started! We strapped a gas tank to the roof and drove that sucker thru the fields. So now, I am a snake oil salesman when it comes to Marval Oil!

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roadwanderer2
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Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by roadwanderer2 »

from the way my 1100 runs like crap with regular 87 octane in it and runs great with premium 93 octane, is it possible that if i were to use some MMO in the fuel tank it might help it to run better on the lower octane fuel?

when i did the timing belts on my 83 1100 and took the valve covers off to adjust the valves @ 89,000 miles, the outside of the cylinder heads looked brand new, but i never removed either head to see what was inside them as far as carbon buildup on the valves or the piston heads.

stuart.

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Rusty Bike
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Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by Rusty Bike »

Maybe, blow out the spark plug wells then pull the plugs. Dump MMO in cylinders, crank it over a few revs then put plugs back in and let it set all winter. See what happens in the spring?? Whatever you do, don't pull the heads! You need at least one bike to ride.

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RoadRogue
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Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by RoadRogue »

roadwanderer2 wrote:
RoadRogue wrote:Not to hijack k this thread but..........
Stuart, it is your right to waste your money on over priced ,higher than needed octane fuel for your machine. It is also your right to ignore the very engineers who designed and built the engine powering your bike. It is also your right to believe you know more than those same engineers and the real world experience of tens of thousands of riders who put regular 87 octane into the fuel tanks of those bikes everyday and have absolutely no problems with engine performance in their properly tuned rides. Higher octane will only benefit a ride that has higher compression motors than these bikes have. Higher octane used in a lower compression engine does not give better performance, it actually gives poorer performance because the fuel is less volatile, not that you could feel it. If you want to tell yourself that 93 octane is better than 87 octane fuel for your bike go ahead, after all it is your hard earned money you are wasting. 8-)[/quote

RoadRogue, i wasn't trying to hijack this thread, and i never meant to be knowing more than the people that designed my bikes engine, i was merely pointing out my personal real world experience about fuel and my bikes performance. what i AM saying is i don't mind paying a few more cents per gallon if it will make my bike perform better. the difference in price between regular and premium around here is about 15 cents per gallon and costs less than $12.00 to fill up.

now, let me ask you a question..........i've used almost every brand of gas @ 87 octane, Exxon, mobile, marathon, shell, Sunoco, Hess, BP, and some of the off brand names, why would my bike run so poorly on 87 octane, and as soon as i put 93 octane in it, it will run perfectly. am i missing something here?

also if i need to move this conversation to a new thread, please advise me as to where it would belong.

stuart.
I was referring to myself about hijacking the thread not you Stuart. Carbon build up could be one reason for pinging in your engine with 87 octane. Without actually working on your bike I am just making suggestions as to what the issue might be. While it may run well on the higher octane it is just a band aid solution. Kinda like taking a pain killer for a toothache, sure the pain is gone but the problem is still there.

Now back to the OP question. a weak battery/ no charging system will cause those ignition issues. weak spark means poor combustion and unburnt fuel in the exhaust resulting in popping and farting. 8-)
Ride safe, Todd
Over night campers welcome

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roadwanderer2
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Contact:

Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by roadwanderer2 »

hey Road, thank you for clearing up the mix up about the thread thing, and also about the poor performance with low octane fuel. im gonna try some MMO in the fuel tank a few times and see if that makes any difference. with over 111,000 miles on it now, im not about to go taking the heads off just to check for carbon buildup. im gonna leave well enough alone.

stuart.

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Ohara
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1986 Aspencade

Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by Ohara »

Hi guys, say would a 35 amp mini denso alternator work for the conversion?

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Rednaxs60
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Re: 1986 gl1200 Aspencade question

Post by Rednaxs60 »

Would be more than adequate for the conversion, and fit quite nicely under the lower fairing. The electrical system on the bike has a main fuse of 30 amps, ergo 35 amps is better than what the system requires.

When you do the conversion use #8 wire from the alt to the starter solenoid/battery through a maximum 50 amp reset circuit breaker. Princess Auto has these at a reasonable price.

Cheers


"When you write the story of your life, don't let anyone else hold the pen"

Ernest

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