Ignition Issue - No Spark


Information and questions on GL1200 Goldwings (1984-1987)
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pappajim0719
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Ignition Issue - No Spark

Post by pappajim0719 »



Hello to all. My 86 Interstate has an intermittent problem with dying while riding, with no warning. While in search of this problem I have:
New Stator, New Starter, New Plug Caps and Plugs, New Pulse Generators
Have replaced: Ignition Switch, Kill Switch, ICM, Coil Pack

and I still have no spark on the yellow side of the coil harness.

Everything works and is functioning, the bike started and ran like a champ, I turned it off, set the tank shelter in place but not bolted down, next morning it wouldn't fire and hasn't started since.

Can someone shed any light on what might be going on? BTW, yellow/blue wire checks good from ICM to coil, so there is no break in the wiring that I can find


Jim
Ride like everyone on the road is trying to kill you, or one of them will.

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twocams
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Re: Ignition Issue - No Spark

Post by twocams »

So you have spent a bazillion $$$ and still wont start. Have you by chance looked at a wiring diagram? Traced out some wires to see where they go. Have checked the pulse generator ( gap is correct) to make sure the new one is good. The belts are both in-tacked. :shock:
Engine will turn over but no spark to the plugs?

twocams

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pappajim0719
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Re: Ignition Issue - No Spark

Post by pappajim0719 »

No Sir, I haven't spent all that much. I've done the work myself, the bike had the problem when I bought it. The bike ran perfectly, then would lose spark without warning.

I'm not a virgin wrencher, this is my 7th Wing and I have worked on all of them. In my search for the problem I found several other issues that needed attention, like the stator, starter, timing belts, plug caps. The bike had previous owners, none of whom understood solder, tape, etc.

Bottom line, everything I have done has had no effect, the bike ran perfectly after each of my efforts, and then it didn't. I can get it to run on two cylinders, Now please pay close attention:

All parts work. The coil is fed from the ICM, the black/white is common to the positive post on both coils. The blue/yellow and yellow/blue feed the negative posts. Remember, the bike started perfectly, now I have no spark on the yellow/blue. Now the fun part, there is no break in the yellow/blue from the ICM to the coil connector, the pulse generators are hard wired to the ICM so no connector issues,

So here I am, I've done no harm, I've done no good, I have a bike that's almost like new :lol: it runs like a Wing with 42k should run, and then it doesn't.
Jim
Ride like everyone on the road is trying to kill you, or one of them will.

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pappajim0719
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Re: Ignition Issue - No Spark

Post by pappajim0719 »

The bike is an 86, there is no air gap issues that I'm aware of, please fill me in on what I'm missing..I thought that was on the 84 only
Jim
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twocams
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Re: Ignition Issue - No Spark

Post by twocams »

Why and how is the pulse gen. hard wired to the ICM? All your grounds on the bike are good/clean. Your battery has a good 12V or more. ill have to get my book out. I sold my 85A months ago/going off of bad 68yr memory. I have 3 BMW bikes and they are totally different....im serious. :shock:

twocams

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pappajim0719
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Re: Ignition Issue - No Spark

Post by pappajim0719 »

I hard wired them due to connector failure,
Jim
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pappajim0719
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Re: Ignition Issue - No Spark

Post by pappajim0719 »

I forgot, the battery is also new, showing 13.5v, and has 340 cranking amps, is on a Battery Tender maintainer
Jim
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twocams
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Re: Ignition Issue - No Spark

Post by twocams »

Do you have the Service manual for 1984-1987. Trouble shooting: Where they talk about Measure cranking voltage, measure voltage drop at coil. And others.




twocaams

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pappajim0719
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Re: Ignition Issue - No Spark

Post by pappajim0719 »

I have the Clymer manual. I did a resistance test, both pulse generators measure the same, did a voltage crank test, voltage output was the same on both generators. Did a coil check, coils are good, wires are good, caps are good, plugs are good, pulse generators are good, timing is perfect, voltage full at battery,

I've run all the tests three or four times, each time the results are the same. The blue side will generate spark, both coils spark when hooked to the blue, the yellow side won't generate spark, even though the parts all check out, the solder joints are good, there's nothing shorting out, everything worked, it started and ran like a champ, then it didn't and it wasn't due to heat breakdown, the bike only ran for a couple of minutes before I shut it down. It started over and over, ran great, and then it didn't and it still won't start :x :( :?
Jim
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twocams
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Re: Ignition Issue - No Spark

Post by twocams »

You have the coils going to the right plugs One coil has 1&3 the other has 2&4 think thats right/ Right? On my 85 A I didnt have a full 12 Volts going to the coils. One had 11 V the other had 11.5. So I ran wires threw a relay direct from the battery to the coils. This gave both 12 Volts. Just left the other wires there. I have a Clymers also but not as good as the Gold Wing Service Manual.
You maybe able to down load it here.

twocams

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virgilmobile
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Re: Ignition Issue - No Spark

Post by virgilmobile »

This wouldn't be the first time I've heard of all external parts testing OK and having just half of the ignition module generating a spark.
There are two separate trigger circuits in the ignition module.Do verify that the module is getting the correct voltage with reference to its green ground wire (not the frame).There is a ground lug for it nearby.Do actually measure the DC volts across the pulse coils and watch your analog meter wiggle a bit when you crank it.This is very low voltage...below 1 volt and the pulse is even smaller.

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virgilmobile
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Re: Ignition Issue - No Spark

Post by virgilmobile »

Take a read through this post..viewtopic.php?f=5&t=11800&p=60034&hilit ... est#p60034

I would suggest that you probe at the module plug for the pulse coil volts and compare with the working side.
Volts with the key on and engine not running should be the same for the pulse coil and ignition coil.Always reference DC power measurements (12volts) to the module green wire.Never assume that it has a good ground connection.

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Re: Ignition Issue - No Spark

Post by Rednaxs60 »

Just a thought on how to proceed. The 12 VDC supply to the positive side of the coils is via the black/white wire from the engine stop switch (kill switch). The other wires on the coils go to the spark units to ground the coils, no ground no spark. The spark units are the same so you could switch the spark units and see if the issue switches cylinders as well.

Good luck. Cheers
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pappajim0719
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Re: Ignition Issue - No Spark

Post by pappajim0719 »

Yes, I've tested that as well, both pulse generators are working as described in the manual, the coils are good, both will fire using the blue lead, am getting nothing out of the yellow side to the coils.
Jim
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twocams
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Re: Ignition Issue - No Spark

Post by twocams »

According to my book the Y/BU comes from the Ign. control unit then goes to a 4 pin connector then to the coil. But that same Y/BU also goes to a 24 pin connector then to a 9 pin connector. From there the same Y/BU go to the Tachometer. What its doing over there I have no Idea. :shock:
So Is it possible there is a problem as it goes on its merry way to the Tach? If not it must be a problem with the Ign. Control Unit?

twocams

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pappajim0719
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Re: Ignition Issue - No Spark

Post by pappajim0719 »

I've checked and double checked all the connectors, all check out okay. The ICM has already been changed and eliminated. I may dig out the old one tomorrow and give it another try just in case something got fried on this one.
Jim
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pappajim0719
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Re: Ignition Issue - No Spark

Post by pappajim0719 »

Thanks to all for sharing your wisdom. I have narrowed the problem down, although I'm not sure what to do about it. I connected the multimeter red lead to the black/white (+) side of the coil, the black lead to the blue/yellow (-) side, and turned the key on. It registered no voltage present, I turned the engine over there was a +1 voltage change when it fired.

I did the same to the yellow/blue side. The meter registered full battery voltage when the key was turned on, and dropped to 0 voltage when I cranked the engine.

WHY? :oops:


Jim
Ride like everyone on the road is trying to kill you, or one of them will.

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