Turn signal trouble


Information and questions on GL1500 Goldwings (1988-2000)
User avatar
David Doyle
Posts: 37
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:11 pm
Location: Wheatland, CA, US
Motorcycle: 1999 GL1500SE
Contact:

Turn signal trouble

Post by David Doyle »



I replaced my flashers with LED flashers. The new flashers both work for the 4/way flasher but the turn signals will not come on. When I turn the key on the front turn signal lights up but goes out in a few seconds. When I operate the turn signals I get nothing. The 4/way still work. I have not found anything else that does not work. NEED HELP


GoldWinkle :lol:
President of TELGO Golf Club
User avatar
Bluewaterhooker0
Posts: 1010
Joined: Wed Nov 14, 2012 11:27 pm
Location: Tampa, Fl
Motorcycle: 1997 Goldwing GL 1500 SE
2008 GL1800 with 2018 California Side Car Trike Conversion

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by Bluewaterhooker0 »

Have you tried swapping the flasher around for the other one, to see if maybe one is defective ?
Are you sure you have the pin layouts correct, and all pins and spades making good contact ?
User avatar
Charlie1Horse
Posts: 600
Joined: Mon Sep 16, 2013 9:35 pm
Location: Jacksonville, Florida
Motorcycle: 1986 GL1200A Aspencade
1992 GL1500I Interstate

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by Charlie1Horse »

Do you mean that you replaced the flasher units under the seat or you changed all the bulbs to LED bulbs? Were they working properly before the change to LED? If you mean the flasher units you may have one of them wired in backwards. Try reversing polarity. If you replaced the bulbs you may have pulled a connector pin from a plug. The bulbs should not be able to reverse polarity especially since the 4 ways are working. Sounds like you may have a bad ground in that area.
Russell

Those who say it cannot be done should try not to interrupt those who are doing it.
Those who say it cannot be done should try not to interrupt those who are doing it.
User avatar
Erdeniz Umman
Posts: 974
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2015 12:33 am
Location: Ankara Turkey
Motorcycle: 2000 GL1500SE

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by Erdeniz Umman »

As Bluewaterhooker said, you probably did not connect the terminals correctly. I suspect the blu/blk and wht/grn terminals swapped.
Attachments


User avatar
David Doyle
Posts: 37
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:11 pm
Location: Wheatland, CA, US
Motorcycle: 1999 GL1500SE
Contact:

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by David Doyle »

I have changed all of the bulbs over to LED at an earlier time with two load resisters and everything worked fine. To day I wanted to put an LED flashers on and take off the load resisters. I did not change the wiring on the bike just plugged in the new flashers. Both flashers work on the hazard side but not on the turn signal side. I plugged the old hazard flasher in and still no turn signals. What does happen is that when I turn on the key the front turn signal running lights come on for a few seconds and then go out and the turn signals will not come on. All of the other lights work. I do have the saddle bags off which is where the two load resisters are at. WHERE TO LOOK?
GoldWinkle :lol:
President of TELGO Golf Club
User avatar
Erdeniz Umman
Posts: 974
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2015 12:33 am
Location: Ankara Turkey
Motorcycle: 2000 GL1500SE

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by Erdeniz Umman »

Recheck the connections. How did you install the flashers? The contacts may be different from the OEM one.

Hazard light circuit is different, it is a simple circuit and connections may not be important.

But turn signals have an electronic unit (auto cancel unit) which controls the flasher and the connections are important.

To isolate the problem, remove the front LED bulbs, and install the rear bulbs only. Try the turn signals in this way, and report the result you get.
User avatar
David Doyle
Posts: 37
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:11 pm
Location: Wheatland, CA, US
Motorcycle: 1999 GL1500SE
Contact:

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by David Doyle »

I did not rewire the bike to put the new LED flasher on. I add a plug to the new LED flasher to fit the bike. At this time the OEM flasher is plugged in. I took the front turn signal bulbs out with the trunk turn signal bulbs in and turned on the key. Nothing worked. I tried the turn signal switch on the bike and nothing. I check the connectors on the left front turn signal. With key off all three of the leads show ground. With key on the green lead is .1v the org/wht 12v the org lead .1v
GoldWinkle :lol:
President of TELGO Golf Club
User avatar
Erdeniz Umman
Posts: 974
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2015 12:33 am
Location: Ankara Turkey
Motorcycle: 2000 GL1500SE

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by Erdeniz Umman »

Did you check the fuse #2 in the fuse box?
Does the horn work?
User avatar
David Doyle
Posts: 37
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:11 pm
Location: Wheatland, CA, US
Motorcycle: 1999 GL1500SE
Contact:

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by David Doyle »

Yes I check fuse #2 and the horn works. Question does the 10Amp relay come into play with the turn signal issue and how do you check this relay to see if it is working correctly? I also put OEM blubs into the front turn signals the running lights stay on but no turn signal.
GoldWinkle :lol:
President of TELGO Golf Club
User avatar
Erdeniz Umman
Posts: 974
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2015 12:33 am
Location: Ankara Turkey
Motorcycle: 2000 GL1500SE

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by Erdeniz Umman »

David Doyle wrote: Thu Sep 21, 2017 8:06 pm Yes I check fuse #2 and the horn works. Question does the 10Amp relay come into play with the turn signal issue and how do you check this relay to see if it is working correctly? I also put OEM blubs into the front turn signals the running lights stay on but no turn signal.
If the horn works, the fuse and the relay#1 is good.
By the way it is a 20A relay.
User avatar
Erdeniz Umman
Posts: 974
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2015 12:33 am
Location: Ankara Turkey
Motorcycle: 2000 GL1500SE

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by Erdeniz Umman »

I suspect you toasted the Turn Signal Cancel Unit, if you had applied positive voltage to the blu/blk wire in a way.
Attachments


User avatar
Erdeniz Umman
Posts: 974
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2015 12:33 am
Location: Ankara Turkey
Motorcycle: 2000 GL1500SE

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by Erdeniz Umman »

Install the OEM bulbs, the flasher etc and check the system according to the procedure below to check the TSCU.

Notice the instructions about the connector connected or disconnected.
Attachments


User avatar
David Doyle
Posts: 37
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:11 pm
Location: Wheatland, CA, US
Motorcycle: 1999 GL1500SE
Contact:

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by David Doyle »

Just to be correct you are talking about testing the connectors that are just above the fan on the right side?
GoldWinkle :lol:
President of TELGO Golf Club
User avatar
Erdeniz Umman
Posts: 974
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2015 12:33 am
Location: Ankara Turkey
Motorcycle: 2000 GL1500SE

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by Erdeniz Umman »

David Doyle wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2017 1:30 pm Just to be correct you are talking about testing the connectors that are just above the fan on the right side?
This connector is on the left side when you sit on the bike.
User avatar
David Doyle
Posts: 37
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:11 pm
Location: Wheatland, CA, US
Motorcycle: 1999 GL1500SE
Contact:

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by David Doyle »

lead wht/grn ignition switch on 12.35v
lead pnk no battery or ground
speed pulse can't do front wheel is off
cancel output blu/blk turn signal on 12v turn signal pushed 11.9v
ground grn continuity all the time
GoldWinkle :lol:
President of TELGO Golf Club
User avatar
Erdeniz Umman
Posts: 974
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2015 12:33 am
Location: Ankara Turkey
Motorcycle: 2000 GL1500SE

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by Erdeniz Umman »

David Doyle wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2017 2:55 pm lead wht/grn ignition switch on 12.35v
lead pnk no battery or ground
speed pulse can't do front wheel is off
cancel output blu/blk turn signal on 12v turn signal pushed 11.9v
ground grn continuity all the time
Please re-read the test procedure and perform it step by step. It seems you haven't done the pink wire, Ltgrn/wht wire and blu/blk wire tests correctly.

Be careful, some tests are done as the connector connected, some disconnected, some ignition key on etc.

By the way, do you know how to do a continuity test?

You can rotate the speedo cable with a power drill counter clockwise to see the pulses.
User avatar
David Doyle
Posts: 37
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:11 pm
Location: Wheatland, CA, US
Motorcycle: 1999 GL1500SE
Contact:

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by David Doyle »

WHT/GRN switch on 12.35v
PNK turn signal on continuity yes (continuity is through my meter to ground on oms)
PNK turn signal on pushed no continuity
LT/GRN WHT turn signal off (switch off) turn signal L or R no continuity
LT/GRN WHT turn signal off (switch off) turn signal pushed has continuity
WHT/BLK switch on turn speed cable counter clockwise no voltage
BLU/BLK plug connected switch on turn signal L or R 12v I'm checking for battery to ground through my meter
BLU/BLK plug connected switch on turn signal pushed 11.9v
GRN continuity to ground through my meter on oms

Am I doing the test right?
GoldWinkle :lol:
President of TELGO Golf Club
User avatar
Erdeniz Umman
Posts: 974
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2015 12:33 am
Location: Ankara Turkey
Motorcycle: 2000 GL1500SE

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by Erdeniz Umman »

David Doyle wrote: Mon Sep 25, 2017 6:39 pm WHT/GRN switch on 12.35v
PNK turn signal on continuity yes (continuity is through my meter to ground on oms)
PNK turn signal on pushed no continuity
LT/GRN WHT turn signal off (switch off) turn signal L or R no continuity
LT/GRN WHT turn signal off (switch off) turn signal pushed has continuity
WHT/BLK switch on turn speed cable counter clockwise no voltage
BLU/BLK plug connected switch on turn signal L or R 12v I'm checking for battery to ground through my meter
BLU/BLK plug connected switch on turn signal pushed 11.9v
GRN continuity to ground through my meter on oms

Am I doing the test right?
Yes you have done the tests correctly, with these results I can say the Turn signal cancel unit is not working.

It should work when you ground the pink wire a few seconds, and it should send ground to the Blu/Blk wire. But it doesn't send the ground when you try L or R.

Instead you see battery voltage there. Be careful, the voltage you see here is not a direct battery voltage, it is the voltage flowing through the relay coils.

So, you shouldn't have seen battery voltage when "BLU/BLK plug connected switch on turn signal L or R 12v I'm checking for battery to ground through my meter".

If you apply ground to the blu/blk wire when the connector is connected you will see the relay clicks. Normally, the Turn Signal Cancel Unit should do this as you may guess.

I am not so sure about the speed pulse, why you couldn't have, if the cruise control or radio auto volume works, you should have the pulses because they share the same signal. And it doesn't cause the turn signals don't work. I mean, if you remove the Wht/blk wire you will have a continuously working turn signal which does not cancel automatically after 500 feet.

So, as a result there may be a broken wire or a loose contact between the connector you have disconnected and the TSCU. You can find the connector of the TSCU in the steering column. Check the continuity of the wires one by one, if they are good you will need a new TSCU.
User avatar
David Doyle
Posts: 37
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:11 pm
Location: Wheatland, CA, US
Motorcycle: 1999 GL1500SE
Contact:

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by David Doyle »

ok first I retested the speed sensor
When I run the speedometer counter clockwise and switch on I see 3.3v on the WHT/BLK
When I stop it goes back to 0v but sometimes it will stick at 4v but if I run the speedometer again the Voltage will drop off.
Next I tested the BLU/BLK again
with the key off there is ground on the BLU/BLK wire (connector plugged in)
with the key on the BLU/BLK goes to 12v and operating the turn signal switch changes nothing.
I turned the key on and put ground to the BLU/BLK (connector plugged in) the 10amp relay would click and
The OEM flasher relay would click. Turn signals work as I selected L or R but the push to cancel would not work.
To stop the turn signal I need to switch the turn signal switch to the center from ether L or R.
Also I put my LED flasher on and the turn signals slowed down as they should.
I removed the WHT/BLK lead, plugged in the connector and turned on the key but no turn signals.
GoldWinkle :lol:
President of TELGO Golf Club
User avatar
Erdeniz Umman
Posts: 974
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2015 12:33 am
Location: Ankara Turkey
Motorcycle: 2000 GL1500SE

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by Erdeniz Umman »

David Doyle wrote: Tue Sep 26, 2017 2:19 pm ok first I retested the speed sensor
When I run the speedometer counter clockwise and switch on I see 3.3v on the WHT/BLK
When I stop it goes back to 0v but sometimes it will stick at 4v but if I run the speedometer again the Voltage will drop off.
Next I tested the BLU/BLK again
with the key off there is ground on the BLU/BLK wire (connector plugged in)
with the key on the BLU/BLK goes to 12v and operating the turn signal switch changes nothing.
I turned the key on and put ground to the BLU/BLK (connector plugged in) the 10amp relay would click and
The OEM flasher relay would click. Turn signals work as I selected L or R but the push to cancel would not work.
To stop the turn signal I need to switch the turn signal switch to the center from ether L or R.
Also I put my LED flasher on and the turn signals slowed down as they should.
I removed the WHT/BLK lead, plugged in the connector and turned on the key but no turn signals.
Ok, all these support my thoughts.
The TSCU does not work. Check the wiring as I said before for continuity and if the wires are fine you will need a new unit.

For a general knowledge, let me tell how the system works.
Turn signal switch (except Interstate) is a little bit complex and different from the regular switch assemblies.

Turn signal can be activated by simply moving the switch either L or R, this will send a ground signal to the TSCU through the pink wire, and then TSCU will send ground to the Flasher through the Blu/Blk wire.

When the switch is released it will come back to the center position, but inner part will stay at the position selected as L or R. The voltage will come from the flasher to this inner switch and go to the related side to light up the turn signals.

Canceling the turn signal can be done by 3 ways.
1. Centering the inner switch will interrupt the flasher voltage going to the turn signals (you can feel the resistance when trying to center the inner switch from the selected position by slightly moving the switch the other way, most of the people aren't aware of this feature, by the way).

2. Pushing the switch in will send a ground signal to the TSCU through the LtGrn/Wht wire, and then TSCU will stop sending ground to the flasher.

3. TSCU will automatically stop sending ground to the flasher, after completing a turn while moving or after completing 500feet (150m). There is not a timer or lean angle input for the TSCU; only Speedometer pulses to calculate the distance and an angular input from the sensor under the fairing are used in the TSCU.
User avatar
David Doyle
Posts: 37
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:11 pm
Location: Wheatland, CA, US
Motorcycle: 1999 GL1500SE
Contact:

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by David Doyle »

OK I tested the wires and connector to the TSCU and looked OK. So I have ordered a new TSCU. Will post how this turns out.
GoldWinkle :lol:
President of TELGO Golf Club
User avatar
Erdeniz Umman
Posts: 974
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2015 12:33 am
Location: Ankara Turkey
Motorcycle: 2000 GL1500SE

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by Erdeniz Umman »

David Doyle wrote: Thu Sep 28, 2017 8:02 pm OK I tested the wires and connector to the TSCU and looked OK. So I have ordered a new TSCU. Will post how this turns out.
As I have said before, I want to remind you not to apply +12V to the Blu/Blk wire inadvertently. It may toast the new unit as well.
User avatar
David Doyle
Posts: 37
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:11 pm
Location: Wheatland, CA, US
Motorcycle: 1999 GL1500SE
Contact:

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by David Doyle »

I just installed the new TSCU and the turn signals are working again. But something else has showed up. The fairing turn signals are also running lights. With OEM blubs the running light comes on and go off when I put on the turn signal. With an LED bulb the running light comes on for 2 or 3 second and goes out but the turn signal part of the light still works. Any Ideas?
GoldWinkle :lol:
President of TELGO Golf Club
User avatar
Erdeniz Umman
Posts: 974
Joined: Tue Oct 27, 2015 12:33 am
Location: Ankara Turkey
Motorcycle: 2000 GL1500SE

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by Erdeniz Umman »

Can you add a picture, brand etc of the LED bulb?
User avatar
David Doyle
Posts: 37
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2017 7:11 pm
Location: Wheatland, CA, US
Motorcycle: 1999 GL1500SE
Contact:

Re: Turn signal trouble

Post by David Doyle »

I found the trouble. Some where along the way I burned out the something inside of the switchback LED blubs. I replaced them with new ones and working again. The switch back bulbs are 744-AW60-SA (Amber and Cool White. from superbrightleds.com. What I did is take the turn signal lenses apart and take out the amber backing. Now the running light is all white and then it switches to amber. I want to thank you for all of your help. What to test and how to test went a long way to knowing what had gone wrong. :D


GoldWinkle :lol:
President of TELGO Golf Club
Post Reply