Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?


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5m0k3y
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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by 5m0k3y »



Wonder if a guy with a big enough machine shop to machine direct fit rear wheels with a standard car tire bead would ever see an opportunity in this?



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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by Wingsconsin »

brettchallenger wrote:
Thu Mar 05, 2020 11:39 am
Interesting ... What say you Sire ? aka King Brett.
This, or something similar is all I was asking for. However, the document is 11 years old and presumably relates to a machine no longer owned by 5m0k3y, judging by his list of current motorcycles. If you wish, I will draft a letter for you to send to your own insurance provider so you too may bathe in the warm comfort of knowing you are in fact fully insured. Or, a more likely scenario, be informed that as you have modified your motorcycle using critical parts not designed to fit on a motorcycle, that your insurance is in fact void.

PS, the correct form of address to a king is "Your Majesty" and not "sire". Personally I prefer, "His Imperial Majesty" - sort of trips off the tongue. I do very much hope that you are standing upright as you type.
Once again you are WRONG -
I do not run a car tire on my Goldwing - Not because of some fear of being uninsured -
Just because I didn't like the way it felt -
After a 30,000 mile test ride I decided that it wasn't for me and returned to motorcycle tires -
I do not ride 2 up ; nor do I tow a trailer - In fact I travel rather lightly and typically further than many riders - however that is not the issue at hand here.

I defend those who DO ride a car tire because I tried it - and it worked -
Everything they say it does -- it does.
The nay-sayers are wrong but entitled to their opinions and fears - Just please do not spread mis-information about something which you know nothing.

You asked for proof from an insurance company and it was provided - Accept that gracefully your Imperial Majesty - :lol:

ps: I referenced you as "SIRE" as I can not think of you without the idea that you represent some part of a horse's anatomy - :o :shock:


Postings are my opinions based on experience and acquired knowledge.
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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by brettchallenger »

ps: I referenced you as "SIRE" as I can not think of you without the idea that you represent some part of a horse's anatomy
So far I have seen a single 11 year old document. Clearly, I do not reside in your country but in most cases motor insurance is taken out for a year and then renewed after reviewing any claims, accidents, prosecutions, changes in status, age (thankfully this usually means insurance gets cheaper), change of address etc.

I am so glad I can conduct a conversation without resort to insult. Clearly this social skill has passed you by.
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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by Ravyn »

WOW.... this has turned into a pissing contest :o I suggest that Brett go find another forum to grace with his presence , he is nothing but a trouble maker and then the admin delete this thread. We all have better things to do then to put up with his stupidity ! :roll:

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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by CrystalPistol »

RoadRogue wrote:
Mon Feb 24, 2020 9:09 pm
I have said it before and will say it again. I am using a General Tire Altimax 195-55-16 on my 97 1500 with no issues at all. It does NOT rub the swing arm, it does NOT ride on the sidewall. This tire works well for me, I like to toss it around in the twisties here in the mountains of British Columbia. 8-)
I was once considering using that same tire on a 1500 rear wheel /FD / brake swap in my 1200, seen it too. But sold bike.

GoldWingRev wrote:
Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:51 am
Yeah I’ve read it...but idk how a 35mm wider tire fits back there. And no one ever changes up the front tire, which was my original question. I’ll probably have to remove the front fender go accommodate the extra width (10mm).
That 195 figure is sidewall width and it reduces when it get's pulled in on a narrower MC wheel.
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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by ekvh »

I have a195/55/16 on a 1500 rim and final drive, on a 1200 swingarm in a 1000 bike. Confused?

The width is as Crystal Pistol says. It’s too wide just trying the tire in the frame without being mounted, but mount it to the rim, air it up, and it clears the swing arm a safe amount 1/4” on one side and 1/2” on the other due to the beads being pulled into the 3.5” rim. Getting the tire on the rim is a chore as is seating the bead.

So far no issues. As I mentioned earlier it does want to lurch a little at very slow speeds on uneven roadways. The 1200 has the rear wheel about 1/2” out of alignment with the front which compounds the problem.

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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by 5m0k3y »

Hey Brett. Eat a dingaling.

Just got this from my insurer. Battle Creek is my current insurer for everything have insured from vehicles, on and offroad, home, and rental properties.

Cornerstone is my Broker.

Asked her to reach out to everyone to see if having an automotive tire affected insurance coverage. Sent the Geico letter to them as reference.
Recieved email below just minutes ago;

Hi Alen,

 

I have reached out to several of our carriers, getting a response from the underwriters at Battle Creek, Dairyland Insurance and Nationwide/Allied.   (see below)

 

Battle Creek Mutual  “while we do not recommend using anything but a Motorcycle tire for a Motorcycle, there are no exclusions to coverage for this type of thing”.

 

Nationwide  “Our motorcycle policy does not contain an exclusion for using a car tire in place of a motorcycle tire”.

 

Dairyland Insurance “Unfortunately, we will not insure these motorcycles because of the significant modifications to the rear end of the motorcycle”.

 

If Dairyland issued a policy without the knowledge that the cycle was altered, it could possibly affect coverage in the event of a claim.   

 

It is always a good idea to read through your policy at renewal to keep up to date on any policy changes.  The industry is constantly changing so it is a good idea to be aware of what is going on.  The letter from Geico was dated 2009; being over 10 years ago, it’s very possible that is no longer the case with them.

 

Hope that helps.  If you have any questions, please let us know!

 

C**** G******

Insurance Support Staff/CSA

Cornerstone Insurance Group

.................
I blocked her name out. Obviously Dairyland thinks im putting the whole wheel on.

Enjoy everyone.

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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by CrystalPistol »

Maybe I should have included this?

viewtopic.php?f=12&t=15720
CrystalPistol wrote:
Fri Jan 20, 2017 9:33 pm
RoadRogue wrote:
Nik27 wrote:Hey RoadRogue how the hell did you het that 195 tyre into a 1200 swingarm....... etc ...
I dont know what to tell you, other than I had to mount the wheel and final drive together and then slide the drive onto the driveshaft and swingarm. There is enough room for the tire on my 86 Interstate. 8-)
Good Thinking! :)

I admit, when I first saw this thread and your post I had my doubts about the sizing. I thought maybe it was due to a typo. So I blew the pic up, played with exposure, and it is definitely a General Altimax 195 55 R16 tire on a GL1500 wheel on a GL1200 bike.

I see that tire is just shy of $90 at Tire Rack if it's the General Altimax RT43 with a V speed rating. Nice looking tire!
Then further on in same thread, measurements come up.
CrystalPistol wrote:
Thu Jan 26, 2017 10:56 am
RoadRogue wrote:Ok ,I survived the trek through the snow to the back 40 where the 1200 is housed for hibernation. It was a tight squeeze to get underneath to take the measurements but I have the requested numbers for you.
Inflated tire 6-3/4", General Tire Altimax HP
Driveshaft clearance approx 1/4" (a pencil wont fit in between)
Brake side tire to swingarm 1/2"
Total swingarm width should be 7-1/2" this is a 86 Interstate 1200.

There is absolutely NO signs of tire rub on the driveshaft tube whatsoever.

Any other questions ? Just ask! 8-)
THANKS!

When I add those numbers up, right at 7-1/2" as you say. :)
When I add my numbers up, right at 7-1/2" ..... also. 8-)
It does look to me like the 1500 FD setup / wheel / etc moves the tire center just a hair over to the brake side ... I mean "just a hair". Not a bad thing, just an observation. (Of the 9/16" added tire width, looks like you lost 2/16" (1/8) on the drive side and 7/16" on the brake side. 7/16" minus 2/16" = 5/16" ..... devided by 2 means tire center moved 2.5/16" (0.156") to left.)
Looking at specs, looks like the General 195/55-16R is 24.4" OD, near an inch shorter than the OEM tire, both new .... that would not hurt clearance either. :lol:
Nik27 wrote:Awesome!!!.....I really appreciate your efforts and help, thanks buddy. Sizes check out with mine so will be ordering a tire tonite. Did you fit it yourself and is there a way of doing balancing at home, I have heard of putting ceramic balls to do the job.
I use hard plastic Airsoft Red Jacket .22 cal pellets in my bike tires and trailer tires and narrower 70 series car tires on the rear of the Trike, dosage dependent on size. This tire above is 55 series but on the narrower bike rim, sidewalls pulled in, the tire is narrow enough that that's what I would do there as well if I were to chose this route .... I might would throw 3.5 or 4 oz. in the car tire.

Part of me is saying "stay with the plan, go Avon Cobras" as I indicated way up yonder ..... but then there is a curious side suggesting that the CT at lower cost is maybe worth a trial with my riding style in mind.

Hmmmmmmmmm ??? :?
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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by Wingsconsin »

More importantly ---

What OIL should one use when riding on the Darkside ...?


:lol: :lol: :roll: :lol: :lol: :roll: :lol: :lol:

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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by 5m0k3y »

brettchallenger wrote:
Tue Mar 03, 2020 9:11 am
Irrespective of the advantageous claims made about using a car tyre on a motorcycle, this should not be done. I understand fully that the United States has a much more relaxed approach to road safety than in the UK, which may account in part, for the 75% greater number fatalities per 100,000 population in the US compared with the UK. In the UK, a motorcycle fitted with a car tyre will fail its annual (for want of a better phrase) road worthiness test, thus making the machine illegal to operate on public roads and so such practise here is rare – though no doubt does occur. Moreover, there are very good reasons for not putting a car tyre on a motorcycle – and I am referring here specifically to two wheel motorcycles not “trikes”.

We call this freedom here in the USA. Some of us choose to not wear helmets where allowed, that is our freedom. Break down your numbers in to people riding normally, and idiots riding well over the speed limit and stunting. Or idiots talking and playing games on cellphones and running over or pulling in front of bikers. Your numbers are unspecified generic numbers. For the sake of this conversation, we only want deaths and accidents due directly to darksiding.
In Canada and countrieswhere its spelled tire.
Maybe that's the issue...we use DOT approved tires where you use car tyres. Lol


There isn’t a single tyre manufacturer which advises a car tyre can be put on a motorcycle. Some, when asked, have made statements to this effect.

Tire manufacturers will not support automotive tire testing on a motorcycle, they would loose a lot of money on the price difference and mileage difference between car and mc tires

Honda’s Goldwing owner's manual (GL1500) states: “The use of tyres other than those listed on the tyre information label may adversely affect handling. Any attempt to mount passenger car tyres on a motorcycle rim may cause the tyre bead to separate from the rim with enough explosive force to cause serious injury or death

Generic statement, used to remove liability from an action that they would loose money in testing. Also walmart mounts tires way cheaper than honda affecting them financially.

Cars have complex steering, damping and differential gearing which places very different stresses on a tyre. Motorcycles lean into corners. You may have noticed that car tyres and motorcycle tyres have very different profiles – there is a reason for this.

Technically the profile of a fat 320 chopper tire is different than that of a tire on a standard motorcycle.

Finally, in which ever country you live, putting a car tyre on a motorcycle rim or indeed, fitting a car wheel rim to a motorcycle, will invalidate your insurance. In most territories this is illegal, and in case of an accident may lead to penury.
No, I have disproven this to you already for the USA anyway.

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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by CrystalPistol »

Wingsconsin wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 9:30 am
More importantly ---

What OIL should one use when riding on the Darkside ...?


:lol: :lol: :roll: :lol: :lol: :roll: :lol: :lol:

That new one …. "Slicker'an Snot"
It's a new synthetic blend, you don't want to know what all is in it, some of it is naturally occurring in nature though. One weight is said to work in all applications.
ekvh wrote:
Mon Mar 09, 2020 8:34 am
I have a195/55/16 on a 1500 rim and final drive, on a 1200 swingarm in a 1000 bike. Confused?

The width is as Crystal Pistol says. It’s too wide just trying the tire in the frame without being mounted, but mount it to the rim, air it up, and it clears the swing arm a safe amount 1/4” on one side and 1/2” on the other due to the beads being pulled into the 3.5” rim. Getting the tire on the rim is a chore as is seating the bead.

So far no issues. As I mentioned earlier it does want to lurch a little at very slow speeds on uneven roadways. The 1200 has the rear wheel about 1/2” out of alignment with the front which compounds the problem.
No confusion here. :) I doubt there's anyone gonna notice slight offset (I figured / measured less than the 1/2") in riding.
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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by CrystalPistol »

brettchallenger wrote:
Tue Mar 10, 2020 8:49 am
We all have better things to do then to put up with his stupidit
y

… yada yada … etc … video too … etc …

No need to thank me.
Thank you? Surely you jest.
You post a post, include a video, and then quote your own post twice more with no additional? :D
Make Courtesy your "Code of the Road" …

… & Have a Safe Trip!
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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by drebudrebu »

I have an Austone if someone would like to purchase it from me. I bought 2, then realized after doing the math, that I will probably not need it for about 5 years and would rather not keep it in the attic for that long.

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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by 5m0k3y »

drebudrebu wrote:
Wed Mar 11, 2020 3:24 pm
I have an Austone if someone would like to purchase it from me. I bought 2, then realized after doing the math, that I will probably not need it for about 5 years and would rather not keep it in the attic for that long.
Ought to be worth at least 2 packages of pre coronavirus toilet paper. Depending on exchange rate and scarcity in your area.

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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by Donshelley »

AZgl1800 wrote:
Fri Feb 21, 2020 5:34 pm
Has anyone tried this tire on the 1500s ??


Dunlop SP Winter Sport 3D DSST RunOnFlat - Size: 175/60R16


https://tiresize.com/tires/Dunlop/SP-Wi ... -60R16.htm 
I just installed this Dunlop SP-Winter-Sport-3D-DSST-RunOnFlat-175-60R16 tire on my 1999 Gl1500 last week. I also installed 5oz of Counteract balancing beads. After riding about 250 miles I have to say - I love it! It’s smooth, it’s quiet, it grips well, wet and dry, and I don’t need to counter steer more than normal in the twisties. It drives very like a MT. I find it easier to hold a straight line while riding and the bike is easier to hold in an upright position when stopped.

The bike rides about 1” lower now than it did with the Dunlop Elite MT. That’s good for me at 5’ 9.5” tall, because now I can very nearly flat foot support the bike while seated. I can flat foot when I wear my 1.5” heeled engineer boots. (I wish those were more comfortable to wear. They are not ideal riding boots, for me). As a result, I feel more confident now when starting and stopping. However, the smaller diameter tire means 3000 RPM is only 58MPH in 5th gear. 65MPH is about 3300 rpms. So my mileage will likely go down. I am still playing around with tire pressure (46psi) and rear suspension (20-50 psi).

I will be replacing the front tire next week with a Metzeler Lasertec Bias Sport Touring rear tire 130/70H-18 (normal rotation direction so the tread drains water away from the tire). I’ll post a review of my double darkside experience after I have a few thousand miles under my belt.
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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by AZgl1800 »

Donshelley wrote:
Sun May 03, 2020 10:54 pm
AZgl1800 wrote:
Fri Feb 21, 2020 5:34 pm
Has anyone tried this tire on the 1500s ??


Dunlop SP Winter Sport 3D DSST RunOnFlat - Size: 175/60R16


https://tiresize.com/tires/Dunlop/SP-Wi ... -60R16.htm 
I just installed this Dunlop SP-Winter-Sport-3D-DSST-RunOnFlat-175-60R16 tire on my 1999 Gl1500 last week. I also installed 5oz of Counteract balancing beads. After riding about 250 miles I have to say - I love it! It’s smooth, it’s quiet, it grips well, wet and dry, and I don’t need to counter steer more than normal in the twisties. It drives very like a MT. I find it easier to hold a straight line while riding and the bike is easier to hold in an upright position when stopped.

The bike rides about 1” lower now than it did with the Dunlop Elite MT. That’s good for me at 5’ 9.5” tall, because now I can very nearly flat foot support the bike while seated. I can flat foot when I wear my 1.5” heeled engineer boots. (I wish those were more comfortable to wear. They are not ideal riding boots, for me). As a result, I feel more confident now when starting and stopping. However, the smaller diameter tire means 3000 RPM is only 58MPH in 5th gear. 65MPH is about 3300 rpms. So my mileage will likely go down. I am still playing around with tire pressure (46psi) and rear suspension (20-50 psi).

I will be replacing the front tire next week with a Metzeler Lasertec Bias Sport Touring rear tire 130/70H-18 (normal rotation direction so the tread drains water away from the tire). I’ll post a review of my double darkside experience after I have a few thousand miles under my belt.
First off, thank you for verifying my thoughts that this would be a good tire for the gl1500 bikes.

2nd: I predict that you will NOT suffer any loss in Miles per gallon fuel use.
The difference in RPM for a given speed is not all that much more than what it was.

I have ridden my '94SE all day long in 4th gear through twisties and mountains, and surprise, surprise, that tank of fuel gave me the best MPG ever since I owned that bike. a Semi truck merged that bike into a wall. :cry:

.Please report back after you get a few thousand miles on the bike, I want to hear more about your experience using that tire.
~John

'02 GL1800
2009 Piaggio MP3 250cc

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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by drebudrebu »

Someone posted On another site that there is another brand of taxi tire on Vintage Tire in Hershey, PA
$153

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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by blupupher »

drebudrebu wrote:
Sun Aug 09, 2020 7:50 pm
Someone posted On another site that there is another brand of taxi tire on Vintage Tire in Hershey, PA
$153
It is a Maxxis Taxi tire (also a 175/16 like the Austone).
One site said the Maxxis is a "N" speed rated tire (87mph rating), while the Austone was a "Q" speed rating (99 mph).
If that is the case, that makes the Maxxis a no-go for me.
If it is also a "Q" rated tire, then it should be OK for most (but I still am not crazy about a Q speed rating).
If going for the 175/60/16, you basically have 3 name brand choices, the Goodyear Assurance Fuelmax, Federal Formoza, or the Dunlop SP Wintersport (although the Dunlop is getting harder to find).

I see that Discount Tire has the Fuelmax for $100 right now, and I am tempted to get it, even though I won't need it for about a year (it is normally ~$150). I have read a few reviews of it though saying is was a little too wiggly, so not sure.

Also the confusion of whether a 195/55/16 fits seems to still be up in the air. Some say it just barely fits, but does fit without rubbing, but others say it rubs no matter what. There are a lot more options in that size.
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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by minimac »

Staying with the 175/16 size also makes it a lot easier to get on and off the centerstand, as well as knocking a few hundred rpms off at speed. The biggest thing for me was the additional load capacity. Everything else-better tire wear, better grip, lower costs- was just frosting on the cake! The Maxxis has a Q rated speed rating. That means it can be run SAFELY maintaining 99mph. It's capable of faster speeds, but not recommended for long periods at those higher speeds.

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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by blupupher »

minimac wrote:
Mon Aug 10, 2020 9:55 am
Staying with the 175/16 size also makes it a lot easier to get on and off the centerstand, as well as knocking a few hundred rpms off at speed. The biggest thing for me was the additional load capacity. Everything else-better tire wear, better grip, lower costs- was just frosting on the cake! The Maxxis has a Q rated speed rating. That means it can be run SAFELY maintaining 99mph. It's capable of faster speeds, but not recommended for long periods at those higher speeds.
After doing more research I found it is a Q rated tire. It is more common in England, and their sites all say it is Q rated.
It will probably be spring of next year before I need a new rear tire, so still time to figure out what to get.
1994 GL1500 Goldwing SE

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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by bellboy40 »

The Coker website that has that same tire listed shows the speed rating as Q also. It is a dollar less on Coker.

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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by agedbikeman »

I'm going to throw a real spanner in the works.
I'm considering an Austone taxi tyre on my 1500 as they are readily available in the uk, which I visit often from France.
I have a Towpac inta trike kit fitted which I cannot ride without, fitted to this kit are two trailer tyres, they are neither bike nor car tyres, my existing Dunlop rear tyre is showing signs of centre wear and does not grip very well on braking. If a taxi tyre gave out suddenly I still have two rear wheels to stabilise, so I can't see any danger in this. My insurance company have recognised the insta trike kit as a valid accessory even with it's trailer tyres, this company specialise in wierdo and home made trikes.

Looking at the tread on an Austone it will have much more contact with the road than the reccomended tyre, and it doesn't need to lean. I feel I'm increasing safety all round.

Alex

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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by WingAdmin »

agedbikeman wrote:
Sun Sep 20, 2020 5:56 am
I'm going to throw a real spanner in the works.
I'm considering an Austone taxi tyre on my 1500 as they are readily available in the uk, which I visit often from France.
I have a Towpac inta trike kit fitted which I cannot ride without, fitted to this kit are two trailer tyres, they are neither bike nor car tyres, my existing Dunlop rear tyre is showing signs of centre wear and does not grip very well on braking. If a taxi tyre gave out suddenly I still have two rear wheels to stabilise, so I can't see any danger in this. My insurance company have recognised the insta trike kit as a valid accessory even with it's trailer tyres, this company specialise in wierdo and home made trikes.

Looking at the tread on an Austone it will have much more contact with the road than the reccomended tyre, and it doesn't need to lean. I feel I'm increasing safety all round.

Alex
I agree, it's a perfect application for you.

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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by a little on the side »

Universal vintage tire co is where you find a maxxis taxi tire 175/80 r16. It works fine on my gl1500. Took me a while to find it because that tire has been sold to, and by different companies over the years.

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Re: Darkside: No Taxi Tire...now what?

Post by Solo So Long »

AZgl1800 wrote:
Mon May 04, 2020 8:20 am
2nd: I predict that you will NOT suffer any loss in Miles per gallon fuel use.
The difference in RPM for a given speed is not all that much more than what it was.
Just FYI, if the tire is heavier, there may be a decrease in fuel mileage. Probably not enough to worry about.



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