GL1500 Rear Brakes very poor


Information and questions on GL1500 Goldwings (1988-2000)
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agedbikeman
Posts: 225
Joined: Tue Jun 18, 2019 3:41 pm
Location: Bruay la Buissiere, France
Motorcycle: 1995 GL1500 Aspencade with bolt on trike kit, made by Kit Trike Portugal.
2014 Can-Am Spyder RT(sold, glad to see the back of it)

GL1500 Rear Brakes very poor

Post by agedbikeman »



The rear brake pedal has never been that good compared with other bikes that I've had, noticing the rotor was very heavily grooved, so I replaced it and the pads, now it barely works at all, so I methodically went through the possibilities, noticing with the pads pushed wide apart, the caliper should slide freely on it's mounting pins, but it was solid, would not budge at all, which explaines why 1 pad was worn much more than the other, the sleeve on the lower mounting bold was siezed solid into the caliper.
After forcibly removing it, It looks like it had been stuck for some years, ,the grease was like rubber, after cleaning it the surface was so pitted not to mention the tool marks I made removing it, it is available as a seperate part, number 45111-MA3-006, there are dozens of them on Ebay, ordered now waiting delivery.
So unexplainable poor rear brake, check this I can't have the only bike this has happened to.

When I get the part I'll report back on the difference

Alex


Crusty1
Posts: 120
Joined: Sat Jun 06, 2020 10:57 am
Location: Kansas
Motorcycle: 2000 GL1500SE
2007 ST1300A ABS

Re: GL1500 Rear Brakes very poor

Post by Crusty1 »

I think you found the problem. The caliper must float in order to pinch the rotor and create enough friction to work. If the caliper isn't floating you are applying pressure to only one side of the disc which only causes the disc to flex or bend away from the piston. push the foot lever as hard as you can you will never build up enough pressure to pinch the rotor. Just fyi if the caliper does un-stick and apply it may re-stick in the applied position causing the brake pads to drag even when you aren't pushing on the pedal. Cleaning the caliper and replacing the Pins is a step in the right direction.

PS. Since the GL1500 has linked rear and left front brake calipers this would prevent good application of the left front caliper as well.
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agedbikeman
Posts: 225
Joined: Tue Jun 18, 2019 3:41 pm
Location: Bruay la Buissiere, France
Motorcycle: 1995 GL1500 Aspencade with bolt on trike kit, made by Kit Trike Portugal.
2014 Can-Am Spyder RT(sold, glad to see the back of it)

Re: GL1500 Rear Brakes very poor

Post by agedbikeman »

Thanks Crusty for your input, so now, while waiting for the new part which came today, I cleaned and greased the old one and put it back to road test it incase I found in need of other parts, caliper floating well of I went on a test drive , much improved and now all about the same but not good enough.
I now have installed 3 new rotors albeit chinese versions, all new EBC semi sintered brake pads and all calipers checked for floating, but the brakes are now not as good as the old grooved discs with old brake pads not really worn out, I don't think chinese rotors would cause poor brakes, they are supposed to be stainless steel which should work as well as any steel, I thought quality of rotors was how long they last, I have used EBC pads on the last 3 bikes and they worked well from day 1, I know they need to "bed in", but I thought they should work better than they do to start with and the will get even better, unless of course I'm wrong in my thinking, as I've left the saddlebag off for the moment ,I will put back the old honda pads on the new rear rotor just to see what happens.
The new rotors are nearly 1mm thinner than the oem ones and the pistons seem to come out a long way in my opinion, I'll put a photo and measurement up here tomorrow, I can't see any way I could have assembled the rear wheel and mounting plate wrong. wheel. spacer, caliper plate, and washer in that order, I followed the diagram to the letter.

Sorry this is so long but I've never encountered anything like this before.

Any input grateful, mayber someone could measur for me how much caliper pistons protrude on good pads.

Cheers , Alex
Crusty1
Posts: 120
Joined: Sat Jun 06, 2020 10:57 am
Location: Kansas
Motorcycle: 2000 GL1500SE
2007 ST1300A ABS

Re: GL1500 Rear Brakes very poor

Post by Crusty1 »

Please provide more detailed information describing “poor brakes”. Is the pedal firm but bike does not stop well? Is the pedal soft similar to air in the lines? Does the pedal travel too far without resistance? Keep in mind the left front and rear calipers are linked hydraulicly and apply simultaneously. The Gl1500 bikes are in excess of 22 years old. Rubber brake lines can fail internally, corrosion can block internal passages. There are ways to determine if there are blockages and where they are. Blockages would generally cause the pedal to be firm but not apply the pressure to the pistons.
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agedbikeman
Posts: 225
Joined: Tue Jun 18, 2019 3:41 pm
Location: Bruay la Buissiere, France
Motorcycle: 1995 GL1500 Aspencade with bolt on trike kit, made by Kit Trike Portugal.
2014 Can-Am Spyder RT(sold, glad to see the back of it)

Re: GL1500 Rear Brakes very poor

Post by agedbikeman »

Thanks again crusty,
Pedal is firm, travel is about right, just does not stop easily.
I read here about braided brake lines, this is new to me, is a braided line a one peice brake line from master cylinder to rear caliper as I notice it is made up of several pieces? this is the one I saw on ebay.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/133638757056 ... XQSbtSNOpj

I suppose it could be brake line problems as the brakes were adequate but not brilliant before I started with new rotors and pads.

Thank you for helping me
Alex
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Wingsconsin
Posts: 1131
Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2012 1:47 pm
Location: Sussex, Wisconsin (West of Milwaukee)
Motorcycle: Current Rides -
2002 GL1800 - Pearl Orange
1983 Suzuki GS850GL - Blue & Black

Past rides -
2008 GL1800 Titanium
2003 GL1800 - Illusion Blue
1996 GL1500 Aspencade - Pearl Blue
1992 GL1500 Aspencade -Candy Red
1980 GL1100 - Custom Cobalt Blue
1985 GL1200 Aspencade Brown
1983 CX500 Custom Red
1982 CX500 Custom Blue
1978 CX500 Standard Black
1982 Suzuki GS650 Red
Contact:

Re: GL1500 Rear Brakes very poor

Post by Wingsconsin »

There is maintenance required on these systems -
Cleaning, greasing, and fluid bleeding -
When was the last time ALL of the brake fluid was changed out ?
This stuff attracts water which ruins it's ability to do work -
Changing ALL the brake fluid every other year is a great start -
Cleaning the slider pins, and the caliper pistons while you do the fluid change is the start -
A caliper rebuild may be in your future including all new rubber bits - piston seals, dust seals, cleaned and lubed pins etc.
I always used OEM rotors and pads - Not familiar with the EBC ones.
Consider he environment the caliper lives in - dusty, dirty, wet, grime, oil, and more build up on the pins and reduce the ability to operate properly.
Postings are my opinions based on experience and acquired knowledge.
Your results may vary. Universal disclaimers apply.


Munk's Maxim -- There is no such thing as a cheap motorcycle
User avatar
agedbikeman
Posts: 225
Joined: Tue Jun 18, 2019 3:41 pm
Location: Bruay la Buissiere, France
Motorcycle: 1995 GL1500 Aspencade with bolt on trike kit, made by Kit Trike Portugal.
2014 Can-Am Spyder RT(sold, glad to see the back of it)

Re: GL1500 Rear Brakes very poor

Post by agedbikeman »

Did all brake fluid last year, but rear dirty again, just doing it now, strange brakes were ok before I fitted new ones, oem pads so expensive in France
Crusty1
Posts: 120
Joined: Sat Jun 06, 2020 10:57 am
Location: Kansas
Motorcycle: 2000 GL1500SE
2007 ST1300A ABS

Re: GL1500 Rear Brakes very poor

Post by Crusty1 »

I recently repaired brakes on a 97 Valkyrie that were acting like you describe. I found one slider had pinched the rubber boot and was binding the slider. That was enough to cause poor braking as it never allowed the pads to fully contact the rotor and pinch the rotor. this one pinched boot stopped both calipers on that circuit from working effectively. Double check the sliding pins, rubbers etc. The calipers must float/slide freely. Additionally I prefer scintered pads. The OEM ones are scintered. I personally have not had good luck with "organic" pads. Can't go wrong with OEM pads unless you need something higher tech for racing lol.
User avatar
agedbikeman
Posts: 225
Joined: Tue Jun 18, 2019 3:41 pm
Location: Bruay la Buissiere, France
Motorcycle: 1995 GL1500 Aspencade with bolt on trike kit, made by Kit Trike Portugal.
2014 Can-Am Spyder RT(sold, glad to see the back of it)

Re: GL1500 Rear Brakes very poor

Post by agedbikeman »

All pins cleaned and greased, new slider tube fitted on rear, all rubbers seated well, I'm beginning to think the pads are not good but I've always used EBC semi sintered pads on all my bikes, never had a problem.
I replaced all fluids less than a year ago, but the foot pedal fluid is brown again, I'm in the middle of relacing it , will finish today then see what happens, did rear first forgetting it's front first, so I'll check rear asfter I've done front today.
User avatar
Wingsconsin
Posts: 1131
Joined: Tue Jul 10, 2012 1:47 pm
Location: Sussex, Wisconsin (West of Milwaukee)
Motorcycle: Current Rides -
2002 GL1800 - Pearl Orange
1983 Suzuki GS850GL - Blue & Black

Past rides -
2008 GL1800 Titanium
2003 GL1800 - Illusion Blue
1996 GL1500 Aspencade - Pearl Blue
1992 GL1500 Aspencade -Candy Red
1980 GL1100 - Custom Cobalt Blue
1985 GL1200 Aspencade Brown
1983 CX500 Custom Red
1982 CX500 Custom Blue
1978 CX500 Standard Black
1982 Suzuki GS650 Red
Contact:

Re: GL1500 Rear Brakes very poor

Post by Wingsconsin »

agedbikeman wrote: Thu Feb 17, 2022 3:54 am All pins cleaned and greased, new slider tube fitted on rear, all rubbers seated well, I'm beginning to think the pads are not good but I've always used EBC semi sintered pads on all my bikes, never had a problem.
I replaced all fluids less than a year ago, but the foot pedal fluid is brown again, I'm in the middle of replacing it , will finish today then see what happens, did rear first forgetting it's front first, so I'll check rear after I've done front today.
When I replace the fluids - I will use my MityVac and clear the reservoir - Then add NEW Freshly opened brake fluid.
I will suck this NEW fluid through the entire system by MityVac through the caliper bleed nipple(s) -
Sometime I will go through 2 small cans of the new fresh brake fluid - just to be sure it is running clear and clean -
The stuff that sits inside the lines ages as well so getting it all out is a good exercise
I am not questioning your process - just expounding on what I do as what I think is a good practice .


Postings are my opinions based on experience and acquired knowledge.
Your results may vary. Universal disclaimers apply.


Munk's Maxim -- There is no such thing as a cheap motorcycle
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