Starting issue
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Starting issue
I have looked in many different places and have yet to see this problem addressed. I am working on a friends 2001 1800. It starts only with the clutch pulled in. When the side stand is up and in neutral it will not start unless the clutch is engaged. I have looked at the wiring diagrams and don't see where what would prevent it from starting. All other functions are normal. My 2010 will start with the bike in neutral and no clutch. It is not a big problem, I would like to fix it for him.
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Re: Starting issue
Looking at the circuit diagram, the only failure mode I see for this is a failed sidestand switch.
Replacement sidestand switch: /Store/New-Used ... owItem=172
Replacement sidestand switch: /Store/New-Used ... owItem=172
Re: Starting issue
It could also be the switch on the clutch lever,and when was the last time the lever bushings were cleaned and greased. Sometimes the bushings wear and cause this issue.
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Re: Starting issue
In looking at the simplified starting dagram, it appears that there is something left out but it is just a smiplified diagram.
There has to be a path for ground to starter relays A and B. It would appear that ground is supplied through the Reverse Relay but the contacts should be closed or maybe the diagram is not drawn accurately.
If ground is supplied from the Reverse Relay, then the path for ground to the relay is coming from either the clutch swith through the side stand switch or from the Neutral switch contact in the gear position switch. Ground is needed from one or the other.
If it is necessary to hold the clutch switch in with the sidestand up to start the engine, then the ground path from the Neutral contact in the gear position switch could be faulty. If not the Neutral switch, then perhaps the Reverse Regulator Assembly connector has an open circuit
Both of these ground sources come through the Reverse Regulator Assembly. Perhaps there are some connections to the Reverse Regulator Assembly that are compromised or the Assembly itself is defective.
There has to be a path for ground to starter relays A and B. It would appear that ground is supplied through the Reverse Relay but the contacts should be closed or maybe the diagram is not drawn accurately.
If ground is supplied from the Reverse Relay, then the path for ground to the relay is coming from either the clutch swith through the side stand switch or from the Neutral switch contact in the gear position switch. Ground is needed from one or the other.
If it is necessary to hold the clutch switch in with the sidestand up to start the engine, then the ground path from the Neutral contact in the gear position switch could be faulty. If not the Neutral switch, then perhaps the Reverse Regulator Assembly connector has an open circuit
Both of these ground sources come through the Reverse Regulator Assembly. Perhaps there are some connections to the Reverse Regulator Assembly that are compromised or the Assembly itself is defective.
MikeB
1998 - GL1500 w/184,500 miles ~ 2017 - GL1800 w/13000 miles
USAF Avionics Communications Tech - 1968 - 1986 / Flight Engineer C-130E - C-141B - 1986 - 1992. Retired
Industrial Maintenance Tech - 1992 - 2014
Retired in Tacoma, WA
1998 - GL1500 w/184,500 miles ~ 2017 - GL1800 w/13000 miles
USAF Avionics Communications Tech - 1968 - 1986 / Flight Engineer C-130E - C-141B - 1986 - 1992. Retired
Industrial Maintenance Tech - 1992 - 2014
Retired in Tacoma, WA
- newday777
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Re: Starting issue
Welcome to the forum 208wrenchman208wrenchman wrote: ↑Thu Jan 07, 2021 2:50 pm I have looked in many different places and have yet to see this problem addressed. I am working on a friends 2001 1800. It starts only with the clutch pulled in. When the side stand is up and in neutral it will not start unless the clutch is engaged. I have looked at the wiring diagrams and don't see where what would prevent it from starting. All other functions are normal. My 2010 will start with the bike in neutral and no clutch. It is not a big problem, I would like to fix it for him.
I see this is your 1st post.
The neutral switch is a common problem on these older 1800s. A friend had one go out on his 01 at 120,000 miles.
My 08 is having problems getting the neutral light to come on and it's at 148,000 miles.
If the neutral light isn't coming on even though it's in neutral, that is in the safety circuit and will need to be replaced to get it to start properly as you want.
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Re: Starting issue
Does he have a good neutral light? If so, then he has an open diode in the reverse regulator assembly. If he’s not getting a good neutral light, then it’s the gear position sensor or a bad connection on the reverse regulator assembly’s connector. The assembly is hidden by the left saddlebag, to the rear of the battery and the starter relays.208wrenchman wrote: ↑Thu Jan 07, 2021 2:50 pm I have looked in many different places and have yet to see this problem addressed. I am working on a friends 2001 1800. It starts only with the clutch pulled in. When the side stand is up and in neutral it will not start unless the clutch is engaged. I have looked at the wiring diagrams and don't see where what would prevent it from starting. All other functions are normal. My 2010 will start with the bike in neutral and no clutch. It is not a big problem, I would like to fix it for him.
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Re: Starting issue
I was hop'n you to get involved with this oneTechdude2000 wrote: ↑Thu Jan 14, 2021 9:53 pm Does he have a good neutral light? If so, then he has an open diode in the reverse regulator assembly. If he’s not getting a good neutral light, then it’s the gear position sensor or a bad connection on the reverse regulator assembly’s connector. The assembly is hidden by the left saddlebag, to the rear of the battery and the starter relays.

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Re: Starting issue
This diagram fails to show you the neutral light being grounded by the gps via the reverse regulator assembly. The gps grounds it with another internal diode from the same input of the switch to the regulator. If the neutral light is working, then the ground is getting lost in the regulator before it makes it out to the reverse relay.MikeB wrote: ↑Thu Jan 07, 2021 6:52 pm In looking at the simplified starting dagram, it appears that there is something left out but it is just a smiplified diagram.
There has to be a path for ground to starter relays A and B. It would appear that ground is supplied through the Reverse Relay but the contacts should be closed or maybe the diagram is not drawn accurately.
If ground is supplied from the Reverse Relay, then the path for ground to the relay is coming from either the clutch swith through the side stand switch or from the Neutral switch contact in the gear position switch. Ground is needed from one or the other.
If it is necessary to hold the clutch switch in with the sidestand up to start the engine, then the ground path from the Neutral contact in the gear position switch could be faulty. If not the Neutral switch, then perhaps the Reverse Regulator Assembly connector has an open circuit
Both of these ground sources come through the Reverse Regulator Assembly. Perhaps there are some connections to the Reverse Regulator Assembly that are compromised or the Assembly itself is defective.
GL1800 Start System Simplified Highlighted.jpg
- MikeB
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Re: Starting issue
Yes of course, it is a simplifed diagram as I said. Not eveything is depited for sure.Techdude2000 wrote: ↑Fri Jan 15, 2021 3:06 pmThis diagram fails to show you the neutral light being grounded by the gps via the reverse regulator assembly. The gps grounds it with another internal diode from the same input of the switch to the regulator. If the neutral light is working, then the ground is getting lost in the regulator before it makes it out to the reverse relay.MikeB wrote: ↑Thu Jan 07, 2021 6:52 pm In looking at the simplified starting dagram, it appears that there is something left out but it is just a smiplified diagram.
There has to be a path for ground to starter relays A and B. It would appear that ground is supplied through the Reverse Relay but the contacts should be closed or maybe the diagram is not drawn accurately.
If ground is supplied from the Reverse Relay, then the path for ground to the relay is coming from either the clutch swith through the side stand switch or from the Neutral switch contact in the gear position switch. Ground is needed from one or the other.
If it is necessary to hold the clutch switch in with the sidestand up to start the engine, then the ground path from the Neutral contact in the gear position switch could be faulty. If not the Neutral switch, then perhaps the Reverse Regulator Assembly connector has an open circuit
Both of these ground sources come through the Reverse Regulator Assembly. Perhaps there are some connections to the Reverse Regulator Assembly that are compromised or the Assembly itself is defective.
GL1800 Start System Simplified Highlighted.jpg
gps? I have to assume you are referring to gear position switch. Non-standard abreviations really throw me a curve.
MikeB
1998 - GL1500 w/184,500 miles ~ 2017 - GL1800 w/13000 miles
USAF Avionics Communications Tech - 1968 - 1986 / Flight Engineer C-130E - C-141B - 1986 - 1992. Retired
Industrial Maintenance Tech - 1992 - 2014
Retired in Tacoma, WA
1998 - GL1500 w/184,500 miles ~ 2017 - GL1800 w/13000 miles
USAF Avionics Communications Tech - 1968 - 1986 / Flight Engineer C-130E - C-141B - 1986 - 1992. Retired
Industrial Maintenance Tech - 1992 - 2014
Retired in Tacoma, WA
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Re: Starting issue
Sorry Mike, yea GPS = gear position switch/sensor. This bike has a unique failure mode, I’ve seen failures of the RRA, reverse regulator assembly, but they have been different than this one. It’s fun when one of the diodes shorts in it and no longer isolates a ground and let’s it get to the wrong circuit.
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Re: Starting issue
This is a situation where you should NOT be using short terms to describe a condition.Techdude2000 wrote: ↑Fri Jan 15, 2021 4:58 pm Sorry Mike, yea GPS = gear position switch/sensor. This bike has a unique failure mode, I’ve seen failures of the RRA, reverse regulator assembly, but they have been different than this one. It’s fun when one of the diodes shorts in it and no longer isolates a ground and let’s it get to the wrong circuit.
99.98 percent of the people who read that, including me, are thinking you are an idiot for explaining that ground goes through a GPS Unit ( Global Position System )

Likewise, I have never, ever, seen the term 'RRA' used and had no idea of what you are trying to say...
The fact I own an 1800 does not make me knowledgeable of that fact....
really appreciate your tech expertise in these threads.

~John
'02 GL1800
2009 Piaggio MP3 250cc
'02 GL1800
2009 Piaggio MP3 250cc
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Re: Starting issue
Thanks everyone that gave me answers to this problem. After the the bike was serviced, oil and filter and air filter changed. The bike was on its kickstand (indicator illuminated), in neutral (indicator illuminated) and clutch out it started. So I don't have an issue any longer.
- newday777
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1976 CB750 K6 Anterris Red 25,000 miles
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Re: Starting issue
What fixed it then???208wrenchman wrote: ↑Sat Jan 16, 2021 6:31 am Thanks everyone that gave me answers to this problem. After the the bike was serviced, oil and filter and air filter changed. The bike was on its kickstand (indicator illuminated), in neutral (indicator illuminated) and clutch out it started. So I don't have an issue any longer.
("That gave me the answers to this problem" doesn't tell anyone later on exactly what you did to fix the problem) Your part of being on any forum like this is to reply back what the actual fix was so others later might find an answer to their similar problems.
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Re: Starting issue
I wish I knew what fixed it, but I am thinking it was the sidestand switch. It is very touchy in its position.
- newday777
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1983 GL1100A Wineberry 36,000 miles
1975 CB750 K5 Planet Blue 7,800 miles
1976 CB750 K6 Anterris Red 25,000 miles
Past rides
1999A Restored from PO neglect & sold at 19,000 miles
1999SE Totaled by cager at 105,000 miles
Re: Starting issue
Have you cleaned the sidestand switch?208wrenchman wrote: ↑Sat Jan 16, 2021 8:04 am I wish I knew what fixed it, but I am thinking it was the sidestand switch. It is very touchy in its position.
Or cleaned out and greased the sidestand pivot bolt?(very necessary maintenance item- full disassembly)
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Re: Starting issue
My '08 was giving me that issue so I replaced the side stand switch. Done. One bolt.
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Re: Starting issue
Doubt it, the side stand has to provide the ground in the up position or the engine will die as soon as you put it into gear and it is the source of the ground that the clutch lever sends on to the reverse regulator assembly when you squeeze the lever. My guess is corrosion on the reverse regulator assembly’s connector. If it returns, pull the left saddlebag away from the frame and unplug the regulator and clean its connector. If corrosion is the culprit, you will see it again and possibly more symptoms that might strand you with a no-start again.208wrenchman wrote: ↑Sat Jan 16, 2021 8:04 am I wish I knew what fixed it, but I am thinking it was the sidestand switch. It is very touchy in its position.
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Re: Starting issue
When it wasn’t working, did you have a good neutral light?208wrenchman wrote: ↑Sat Jan 16, 2021 6:31 am Thanks everyone that gave me answers to this problem. After the the bike was serviced, oil and filter and air filter changed. The bike was on its kickstand (indicator illuminated), in neutral (indicator illuminated) and clutch out it started. So I don't have an issue any longer.
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- Posts: 336
- Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2011 10:11 pm
- Location: Lexington, KY
- Motorcycle: 2004 GL1800
Re: Starting issue
Sorry guys, was in a hurry and didn’t want to type out the full names.AZgl1800 wrote: ↑Fri Jan 15, 2021 10:04 pmThis is a situation where you should NOT be using short terms to describe a condition.Techdude2000 wrote: ↑Fri Jan 15, 2021 4:58 pm Sorry Mike, yea GPS = gear position switch/sensor. This bike has a unique failure mode, I’ve seen failures of the RRA, reverse regulator assembly, but they have been different than this one. It’s fun when one of the diodes shorts in it and no longer isolates a ground and let’s it get to the wrong circuit.
99.98 percent of the people who read that, including me, are thinking you are an idiot for explaining that ground goes through a GPS Unit ( Global Position System )![]()
Likewise, I have never, ever, seen the term 'RRA' used and had no idea of what you are trying to say...
The fact I own an 1800 does not make me knowledgeable of that fact....
really appreciate your tech expertise in these threads.![]()
