1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel


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smithmax
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1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by smithmax » Wed Jun 27, 2018 9:37 am



Hello my 92 has me baffled,, drove it in garage a couple weeks ago went to start a few days later spins over wont start . Ive been testing according to the service manual checked all fuses bank angle sensor kill switch cleaned all grounds checked all relays and also relay/fuse housing. Thought I found the problem one of the pulse generators tested high got a new set and tested before install all ok installed plugged in and nothing still no spark and no power to fuel pump while cranking. Jumpered outer pins on bank angle sensor still nothing. cruise indicator light goes on and off with kill switch have over 11 volts to ecu while cranking. Ive borrowed a friends spare ecu from a 96 and tried it still nothing Any ideas suggestions would be greatly appreciated



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virgilmobile
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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by virgilmobile » Wed Jun 27, 2018 10:34 am

There won't be any fuel pump power if there's no spark... but...do you hear the pump cycle when you first turn on the key?Usually lasts 2-3 seconds.

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landisr
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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by landisr » Wed Jun 27, 2018 10:59 am

All indications from your description smell an awful lot like a weak battery. Many similar posts on this site. Try jumping the battery from a non-running car.

Ron
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virgilmobile
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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by virgilmobile » Wed Jun 27, 2018 11:38 am

11 volts at the ecm while cranking is a good battery.
Something else is wrong.
Not the ECM...Not the pulse coils...
obviously you have a volt meter and can probe the ECM wiring when it's hooked up...Let's see if there's another test point to look at...
I'll review the schematic and point to a couple of things.
This may take me a little while to compile the data but I'll post ASAP.
In the mean time,Get to the side stand switch wires...with the key on and the sidestand down...one of them should have a little voltage on it...it comes from the ECM...The other 2 go to the side stand light.
I wonder if the bike will even start if the side stand is up????

smithmax
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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by smithmax » Wed Jun 27, 2018 12:53 pm

Thanks for reply tried with side stand up down clutch in and out tried gear selector in gear with clutch in as well

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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by smithmax » Wed Jun 27, 2018 1:49 pm

I’ve tried boosting with a running vehicle I’ve load tested the battery it reads 12.58 volt after sitting overnight

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virgilmobile
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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by virgilmobile » Wed Jun 27, 2018 2:04 pm

First...does the fuel pump cycle for a couple seconds when you turn on the key?
This will indicate that the ECM is powering up properly and going through it's self test.
***Keep in mind that all voltage tests are using a DVM with the negative lead attached to the green ground wire at the ECM and not the frame or battery.
This is important...Even if you have to skin the sheathing to get to the wire.***
Included is a couple of schematics for pin and color code reference.
With the key on only...
Measure for volts at the ECM plug wires..everything hooked up..
Pins 1-2-3-4 should have near battery volts.
Green/white side stand switch should have some voltage...maybe only 5 volts or so and go to zero when the side stand is pushed up.
Pin 8-9 are the pulse coils...There will be a little voltage there...not much..perhaps 0.5 to 1.5 volts....This voltage should go up when the pulse coils are unplugged .
Let.us know if any of these are not right.







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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by smithmax » Thu Jun 28, 2018 7:29 am

I know it doesn’t do the cycle to pump when you turn ignition on I will check the ecu pins later today. Thanks for the support

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virgilmobile
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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by virgilmobile » Thu Jun 28, 2018 7:53 am

Great.At least there's a indication of a problem.
I understand that it shows volts....However the ECM must have a ground...
There have been issues there.Be aware that there are 2 "ground bonding blocks" taped to both sides of the harness about where your knees are setting on the bike.
Have seen problems in them.
I think there orange and have several green wires in each.Theres a shorting cap that binds them together.
Check them.

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virgilmobile
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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by virgilmobile » Thu Jun 28, 2018 8:56 am

I copied this image from Google images/Steve saunders site...


This is on the left side.

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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by smithmax » Fri Jun 29, 2018 8:35 am

Morning I checked the ground clusters all good I competed pin checks
Pins 1-2-3-4 all 11.8 volts voltage at battery at test time 12.1. Green/white side stand only has .48 volts checked continuity between green and white at ecm and at plug for side stand, it checks out ok had .48 volts to pulse coils it did not go up when pulse coils were unplugged. Just another note bike has always been stored indoors I’ve had many plugs connectors pulled and have not found any corrosion anywhere

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virgilmobile
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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by virgilmobile » Fri Jun 29, 2018 10:12 am

Question...Your meter ground..Was it attached to the ECM green wire?
Because voltages don't change and you don't have a cycling pump it really sounds like a bad circuit ground.

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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by virgilmobile » Fri Jun 29, 2018 10:23 am

One of the first things the ECM does when it gets power is run it's self diagnosis.A part of that is to cycle the fuel pump.Find out why the pump won't cycle and I'll bet the rest will work.
Even take the cover off the ECM so you can measure stuff right at this pins.Jusy I. Case one of the wires in the. Large connector is bad

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Erdeniz Umman
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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by Erdeniz Umman » Sat Jun 30, 2018 5:43 am

When the ignition key is turned on, the pump will cycle a few seconds only on 88-89 year models which have a fuel pump relay. For the other year models it will only cycle while the start button is pressed in.

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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by smithmax » Sat Jun 30, 2018 7:23 am

Morn, I did test the volt checks using the green wire to the ecu Will it help to run a jumper from ground to ecu even though it tested ok?

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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by virgilmobile » Sat Jun 30, 2018 6:12 pm

Erdeniz Umman wrote:
Sat Jun 30, 2018 5:43 am
When the ignition key is turned on, the pump will cycle a few seconds only on 88-89 year models which have a fuel pump relay. For the other year models it will only cycle while the start button is pressed in.
Yes the 88-89 do use a external circuit to operate the fuel pump.90 and up are internal of the ECM.
Same functions even as described in the troubleshooting page...


When the start button is pressed and the engine cranks...IF there's spark...that enables the fuel pump circuit to run.

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virgilmobile
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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by virgilmobile » Sat Jun 30, 2018 6:53 pm

smithmax wrote:
Sat Jun 30, 2018 7:23 am
Morn, I did test the volt checks using the green wire to the ecu Will it help to run a jumper from ground to ecu even though it tested ok?
Won't help or hurt...
Just for your peace of mind.Disconnect the wire feeding the fuel pump.Right on top of the fuel tank...Attach your meter or test probe and turn on the key.Verify that there is or is not voltage when the pump is suppose to cycle.

I still contend that if the pump does not cycle when the key is turned on there no point going further till that is fixed.

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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by ct1500 » Sat Jun 30, 2018 8:17 pm

I would not bet my life on what the 1500 manual states as there are inaccuracies, omissions, errors and hold-overs from previous year manuals after changes were made.
Only the '88-89 models had the 2 second fuel pump prime when key 1st turned on.

To the OP there gotta be more to this story. What is the repair history and what has been added, how long have you owned this?
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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by Erdeniz Umman » Sat Jun 30, 2018 9:52 pm

That is one of the incorrect information forgotten to be updated in the service manual. I tested on my 2000 year bike, and it cycles only when I hit the start button, and it can be heard through the fuel filler cap hole.

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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by smithmax » Mon Jul 02, 2018 8:01 am

Had the bike almost 5 years general maint only tires, brakes, oil change 78000 miles on the clock a couple weeks ago I drove it in garage 3 days later went to take it out,, no start no mods that I know of, extra lighting ring of fire were installed previous to me never any problems prior to this

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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by landisr » Fri Jul 20, 2018 11:25 pm

How are things at this point, smithmax? Made any further progress?

Ron
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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by smithmax » Sat Jul 21, 2018 3:56 pm

Hello no progress yet I did find 2 relays that were bad not sure where they were originally as I was swapping them around. I got two new ones checked all contacts in fuse/ relay panel installed and Nothing again, very frustrating going to try and troubleshoot with manual for no fuel pump opposed to no spark still seems to leed to same place. the wire to fuel pump from ecu is good as is grounds to ecu and fuel pump housing. Any thoughts or ways to bypass all run permissives and maybe work my way back to the fault?

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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by landisr » Sat Jul 21, 2018 6:15 pm

Hmmmm. I am certainly no expert. My electrical testing bag of tricks consists mostly of checking connections, fuses, etc., using a simple multimeter to check voltage, continuity and ohms, and bypassing or swapping parts. I have owned my 94A since new (187,000 miles and counting) and have done a vast majority of my maintenance myself. Please excuse me for any repetition, but....

Going back to basics: Let's try the simplest and cheapest tests first..

How did you determine that you have no spark? Did you install known good spark plugs in the plug caps, ground them to the block, etc? If no spark when cranking, is there any immediately after releasing the starter button while the motor is still spinning?

Do you know for sure that the fuel pump works? Does it move fuel to and through the fuel filter? Have you jumpered both the positive and negative terminals on the pump directly to the battery? Does the bike start using ether or starting fluid?

I have no intention of insulting your efforts so far. From reading your replies above, you are far more savvy about electronics than me. At this point perhaps you/we need to take a deep breath, set aside our notes and jump through some hoops again from a different approach. Something changed since the last time you parked the bike. Let's confirm whether you in fact have a problem with spark, fuel or both.

If you try this, let me/us know your findings. Maybe that will help determine where we go from here. I hate chasing gremlins.. :roll: Did you by chance lose your spirit bell? :shock: :lol:

Ron
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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by smithmax » Mon Jul 23, 2018 2:08 pm

Hello all did some more retesting yest. Secondary voltage on 3-4 coil reads bad I don’t know if this could cause my no fuel pump /spark issue but figured I would throw it out there I tried with three different multimeters to verify one analog and 2 digital

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Re: 1992 gl 1500 turns over no spark, no fuel

Post by smithmax » Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:04 am

Hello Im back hoping someone will be able to assist with my 1992 no fuel spark issue,, Left it for a while and and need to get it running and out of garage, thinking of starting over from scratch also the manual Ive been using for schematics is for a 2000 and Im wondering if 1992 wiring may be different. Thanks in advance
Steve



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