If it sounds like the valves are too loose...

[kndw]

What else could it be?

I have now triple-checked the valve clearances using the method in the book as well as the method where you adjust the valves one cylinder at a time, and they are 0.1mm (as my manual says). Still I hear something that sounds like the valves between ~3k rpm and ~5k rpm. At higher rpms the sound may still be there, but the growling of the engine then dominates...

So, could i be doing something wrong? And if so, what? Are there other things that may sound like valves but aren't?

Thanks!

Edit: I realize that maybe a timing belt is off a tooth, but I thought that then performance and fuel consumption suffer, and she runs great, and I manage even 1liter:17kms, which I believe is pretty decent for a 'wing...

[DWade1990]

How noisy are your valves? A little bit of sewing machine sound is what you want. If you can't hear them, they're too tight.

[virgilmobile]

I had a Gl1000 that had a tappet noise..It wasn't the engine..There was a chrome cover over the fuel pump..It was bolted to one of the intake bolts...Silly thing acted like a bell.I threw it in the trash and the noise went with it.
I also had a car that had abnormal tappet noise...Measured everything perfect..
The rocker had a worn flat spot in it.The cam was ok...Replacing the rockers quieted it down.
Look at the rockers and the ball end of the adjuster for abnormal wear.

[Fred Camper]

I suspect you are hearing something other than the valves. There are chains to consider for the starter for instance.

[kndw]

The chains have been renewed during an overhaul of the engine last winter, so I can't imagine it is those. Worn rockers makes sense. I'll look at that, thanks.

[terryt]

The valve setting on a 1000 are not all the same
inlet .1mm .004"
exhaust .13mm .005

and should only be adjusted when cold like left over night

[virgilmobile]

The chains have been renewed during an overhaul of the engine last winter, so I can't imagine it is those. Worn rockers makes sense. I'll look at that, thanks.

Don't forget to inspect the cam lobes for flat spots and the ball end of the adjuster.

[kndw]

This morning I took the valve covers off again and tried to inspect the camshafts and rockers. From what I could see by wiggling the rockers sideways, the cams and rockers looked okay, but it seems you can only inspect those parts properly if you take the thing that keeps the camshaft/rockers in place off entirely(?)... That will have to wait until after the season.

[ekvh]

The manual for 1000’s calls for 0.004” intake and exhaust clearances on a stone cold engine. The 1100’s use the 0.004” intake and 0.005” exhaust. That said, lots of guys with more knowledge than me suggest shooting for 0.005” on both. Too tight will rob power when engine is hot.

I cured all my noisy valves by simply getting older. Now I can’t hear them. Out of sound, out of mind. Lol

[Good Hondog]

I cured all my noisy valves by simply getting older. Now I can’t hear them. Out of sound, out of mind. Lol

Now that's some funny stuff right there! I spilled my coffee when I read that I was laughing so hard. Good one, ekvh, you made my day with your reply.

[kndw]

I looked at whether the cam timing was okay. It looked good to me, with the lines on the pulleys aligning with the lines in the plate behind them (and the engine at TDC#1). Does anyone notice something off here?

Also, it appears that the noise is not present when the engine is cold - little video here: https://photos.app.goo.gl/tLfuEze2XGmhqRHn7.
This of course requires a comparison video with a warm engine, but it looks like it's about to rain, so that one will come at a later time.

[DaveO430]

The manual for 1000’s calls for 0.004” intake and exhaust clearances on a stone cold engine. The 1100’s use the 0.004” intake and 0.005” exhaust. That said, lots of guys with more knowledge than me suggest shooting for 0.005” on both. Too tight will rob power when engine is hot.

I cured all my noisy valves by simply getting older. Now I can’t hear them. Out of sound, out of mind. Lol

How does that happen? The clearance gets looser when hot in OHC engines.

I do like your "cure".

[kndw]

No rain, so I went to get a burger... here is a video with the engine at full operating temperature:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/N6pHs7PxgupbCosD7

I don't get why/how the clearance would get looser with a warm engine

Maybe I just have to work on that getting-older thing.

[DaveO430]

That is a lot of noise. Are you sure you didn't adjust them on the wrong stroke? Just having the T1 mark showing doesn't mean the cam is in the right position. If you adjusted them at the top of the exhaust stroke they would be very loose when at the top of the compression stroke.
The valves get looser because the valve head expands more than the other components of the valve train in an overhead cam. With a push rod engine the push rod expands more because of it's length so it does decrease the clearance.

[kndw]

Nah... I cannot imagine that I adjusted them at the wrong T1: I would then have done it wrong several times in a row. Also, I'd imagine that with such a grave mistake I'd also hear valve noise when the engine is cold (see first video).

I followed the manual. First turn the engine to T1 such that both valves of cylinder 1 have some play. If they didn't, I turned the engine another round until I did feel play. Then I set the clearance such that a 0.1mm feeler would go in, but the next size (0.15mm) wouldn't.

[terryt]

Are the carbs balance and set right. sounds like the carb pistons dash pots are jumping.

[kndw]

Are the carbs balance and set right. sounds like the carb pistons dash pots are jumping.

I'll check!

[DaveO430]

Nah... I cannot imagine that I adjusted them at the wrong T1: I would then have done it wrong several times in a row. Also, I'd imagine that with such a grave mistake I'd also hear valve noise when the engine is cold (see first video).

I followed the manual. First turn the engine to T1 such that both valves of cylinder 1 have some play. If they didn't, I turned the engine another round until I did feel play. Then I set the clearance such that a 0.1mm feeler would go in, but the next size (0.15mm) wouldn't.

OK, next best guess is rough spots on the cams and rocker arms.

[kndw]

Nah... I cannot imagine that I adjusted them at the wrong T1: I would then have done it wrong several times in a row. Also, I'd imagine that with such a grave mistake I'd also hear valve noise when the engine is cold (see first video).

I followed the manual. First turn the engine to T1 such that both valves of cylinder 1 have some play. If they didn't, I turned the engine another round until I did feel play. Then I set the clearance such that a 0.1mm feeler would go in, but the next size (0.15mm) wouldn't.

OK, next best guess is rough spots on the cams and rocker arms.

Yeah, I'm afraid that is going to be it. Thanks for the input!

[kndw]

Meanwhile, I've done some more research on possible causes of this noise.

An interesting suggestion came from a friend who suggested to look at the frequency of the ticks, and compare it to the RPM: if the ticks are spaced at 1/2 the frequency of the RPM, it is something to do with the valves; if it is at the frequency of the RPM, it has something to do with the crankshaft. The bike idles at 1000 RPM, which is 16/2/3 Hz. I put the video in Adobe Audition, and got the spectrogram, which shows that the ticks are spaced 120ms apart, which is 8/1/3Hz... Anyway, I found this a scientifically interesting approach to validate that it is the valves.

Then I found that valve-like noise can actually also be an exhaust gasket leak. I tried this, and replaced the exhaust gaskets. DIdn't help.

So, still it seems that the rockers/camshaft are worn, or maybe there is play on a valve in its guide? I guess I'll be pulling the heads soon...

[DenverWinger]

+1 on Adobe Audition - Wonderful software! Good diagnosis!

[Jim Garrett]

Just a thought, but could it possibly be the fuel pump lever rattling against the end of the camshaft?

[kndw]

Just a thought, but could it possibly be the fuel pump lever rattling against the end of the camshaft?

Yes, interesting thought. This is consistent with the frequency of rotation of the camshaft, and I also installed a new aftermarket fuel pump, so it could fit. I didn't mention it, but I already tested this by re-installing the old fuel pump (which never had noise), and got the same noise

[terryt]

Have you done a compression test. could be a sticking valve

[kndw]

Have you done a compression test. could be a sticking valve

Nope, haven't done that. A sticking valve is when carbon build-up prevents the valve from opening/closing properly, right? I have had the heads rebuilt, with new (not OEM) valves, ~1000 km ago, so it is hard to imagine that that happened. However, this we'll also see when I pull the heads. I'll do this in the coming days.