First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home


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NOVAwing
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First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by NOVAwing » Sun Jul 08, 2018 3:10 pm



IM SO ANGRY!
I could spit nails!

93 Aspencade, see my other threads.......

First time taking the wife out to ride.
5 miles from home on a minor highway with traffic.

Dies while at speed, smoke from under my crotch.

Got it off the road. Wont even crank. After sitting for several mins it barely cranks over then just ticks like a dead battery.

Waiting on a flatbed tow truck now. Wife just left in an Uber.

Im SO embarresed and ANGRY, did i mention angry?

Any ideas? I HATE electrical issues /sigh.

Thanks,
NOVAwing


NOVAwing
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“A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.”

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Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by NOVAwing » Sun Jul 08, 2018 7:32 pm

First thing to check will be battery. Which is acting like it somehow went from 80%+ to dead in 15 mins of riding.

Need to find out what can cause the bike to shut off at speed, we were on a 55mph road doing like 60mph. In traffic, it was not good!

Everything was fine riding along then it sputtered, then shut off, when I tried to refire it with the clutch in, it smoked at my crotch and barely cranked twice, then froze.

Got it off the road onto a side street in the shade. Dumb luck there. God this thing sucks to push!

After sitting 15mins or so it would try to crank for maybe 5 seconds then wind down like the battery is dead. Then it just clicks under my right leg.

An hour later the flat bed arrives. Lashed it down good enough, but not the proper way. He did not have the hooks to attached to frame under side panels.

Got it home and parked. The diagnosis will start after work when I get time.

If anyone has advice or experince with this particular random event, I would love some help.

Had planned to ride to work all week. Now its back in the gas guzzling truck.

Thanks,
NOVAwing
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Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by Bluewaterhooker0 » Sun Jul 08, 2018 9:23 pm

I'd start with the battery, then move on to the alternator.
What I can't explain is the 'smoke'.
Was this smoke, smoke....as in burned something smoke ?
Or, possible steam ? Smell should determine that.
A dead battery will cause the engine to just shut down, especially if the alternator is also dead. Mine did that at a stoplight. The radio sounded scratchy, then poof. Dead bike. A bad alternator was the cause.
And, a 'dead' battery will recover after sitting idle, and provide some usable power at that point. But the battery is still dead.

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Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by NOVAwing » Mon Jul 09, 2018 6:51 am

Bluewaterhooker0 wrote:
Sun Jul 08, 2018 9:23 pm
I'd start with the battery, then move on to the alternator.
What I can't explain is the 'smoke'.
Was this smoke, smoke....as in burned something smoke ?
Or, possible steam ? Smell should determine that.
A dead battery will cause the engine to just shut down, especially if the alternator is also dead. Mine did that at a stoplight. The radio sounded scratchy, then poof. Dead bike. A bad alternator was the cause.
And, a 'dead' battery will recover after sitting idle, and provide some usable power at that point. But the battery is still dead.
Thanks for the advice.

Bike sat outside overnight. Didnt touch it after getting it home.

Quick battery test with my digital voltmeter as I was leaving for work this morning.

12.35 volts.

Thats normal and full correct?

This is a brand new AGM battery from batteries plus.

So the smoke. It was from under my crotch somewhere. Was going 60mph so dont recall any smell, including when stopped. If anything it might have been electrical smell, but nothing strong like you normally would smell.

Not sure I should try to start it anymore.

Can the alternator lock up or bind causing major resistance to cranking?


Thanks,
NOVAwing
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Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by RBGERSON » Mon Jul 09, 2018 7:18 am

Don't think so..starter could..starter shorted out and it could smoke.. but then it wouldn't crank at all. I'd pull the seat and plastic and look for metaled wires first. Then pull the starter and check it then on to the alternator. If she'll start after sitting for a day or two you could check the alternator's output before pulling it. Could something in one of the starter relay's for the not cranking but not for it quitting at speed.
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Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by NOVAwing » Mon Jul 09, 2018 6:47 pm

Update:

So the battery is showing 12.35 volts i think.
This is good right? 2 months old battery, agm from batteries plus.

I suck at electrical stuff.

I then switched the plugs on my voltmeter for some dumb reason and touched the battery again and iymt made a tiny spark.

Now my volt meter wont read the battery anymore. It comes on but only says 0.00.

Gonna open it and see if it has a fuse i blew or something.

Anyway. The bike cranks on jumper cables, but wont fire.

It looks to me like there is no fuel in the fuel filter. Bike has fuel i looked......

So what causes the bike to die at 60mph, and have a dead battery, but also wont pump fuel on a jumpstart?

Dogbone fuse is good, relay fuse thing above/behind dogbone is good. Main fuses look fine but havent pulled the rear one due to luggage needing to come off to do it.

Also no melted wires under the seat or under side panels. All looks normal?

Any ideas anyone?

Thanks,
NOVAwing
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Last edited by NOVAwing on Mon Jul 09, 2018 7:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by ct1500 » Mon Jul 09, 2018 7:25 pm

The black meter lead always stays on the common (COM), your red is in the current reading plug which is not for voltage measurements. The fine print on the meter current reading port states max. 10A unfused which was presumably breeched and likely cooked the meter. Some meters of that ilk will be fused and have a small glass buss fuse.
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Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by NOVAwing » Mon Jul 09, 2018 7:36 pm

ct1500 wrote:
Mon Jul 09, 2018 7:25 pm
The black meter lead always stays on the common (COM), your red is in the current reading plug which is not for voltage measurements. The fine print on the meter current reading port states max. 10A unfused which was presumably breeched and likely cooked the meter. Some meters of that ilk will be fused and have a small glass buss fuse.
Thanks for the advice. The plug position shown in my pic is the way i had it when it read 12.35 with the dial on the top left 20 position.

I moved the black wire to the lower port which is when it sparked and the meter stopped working when i touched the bike battery.

I opened the meter and i smell burnt electronics but nothing looks amis.

It does have a tiny 250v or mv glass fuse with the tiniest wisp of a fuse inside it. Cant even tell if its broken. Battery is fine and meter shows 0.00 always. Wont read a 9v battery in the house.

Guess i need a new one and relearn how to properly use it. My and electrical dont get along, its a foreign language to me lol.

But i have to figure this out and fix my bike asap.

Thanks,
NOVAwing
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Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by bellboy40 » Mon Jul 09, 2018 10:36 pm

What happened is you had the meter configured to read amperage and put it directly across the battery terminals. That is when you either blew the fuse or burned up the meter completely. Put another fuse in there and try it. You might get lucky and it will work. Otherwise, you will need a new meter and start over... after learning how to use it properly. :D
To read voltage, you need the black lead in the bottom hole and the red lead where the black one is in the picture.

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Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by Bluewaterhooker0 » Mon Jul 09, 2018 10:38 pm

Regarding your meter. As was stated, the Black lead always connects to the Common or (COM) plug socket, and is generally attached to the negative (-) side of any circuit you are reading. Or, in the case of battery testing, connected to the negative (-) battery terminal.
To read Voltage (V), Resistance (Ohms), or milliamps (ma), or test a Diode, you would have the Red lead in the center plug socket. To test battery voltage, the Black lead connects to the negative (-) battery terminal, and Red lead connects to the positive (+) battery terminal.
To measure full amps, up to 10 amps, you would connect the Red lead to the upper plug socket. That has to be connected in SERIES with the circuit to be tested. All other tests are in PARALLEL.
I don't know what type of reading you would get with the leads connected as you have them in the photo, when attempting to read battery voltage. Probably inaccurate.
If you touched the Black and Red leads to a battery, while connected to COM and 10A, you would either blow a fuse, if it has one, or burn that section of the meter, as uncontrolled amperage will flow through the meter until something fails or the fuse protects it.
From my experience, the 10A section of the meters are separate from the other Voltage reading section. Thus you may find that, IF CONNECTED PROPERLY, you can still read voltage with that meter. Maybe not, depending on how it was designed.

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Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by MikeB » Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:21 am

Let me try to answer some of your questions first.

1. 12.35 volts. That's normal and full correct?
Actually, not really. A fully charged motorcycle battery should be 12.6 to 12.7 volts when tested with a properly configured voltmeter. It doesn't look as though you had your voltmeter properly configured so I don't think that reading was correct anyway.

2. So what causes the bike to die at 60mph, and have a dead battery, but also wont pump fuel on a jump start?
A bad alternator can cause this. The battery will power the bike for probably 20 minutes by itself but not much longer. The alternator does the heavy lifting after the engine is started and running. If the alternator is not working and the battery is supplying most of the power, the battery will die and not have the power to start the engine. After about 15 minutes of sitting with the bike off, a battery can regenerate enough power to turn over the engine but not enough to start it.
A starter motor that is continually running after the engine is started could cause the battery to discharge but I think it would not necessarily kill the bike after a few minutes of riding. As to fuel not pumping, I'm not 100% sure it was not pumping. The fuel filter will always be somewhat less than half full and not being able to see it filling is normal.

3. Can the alternator lock up or bind causing major resistance to cranking?
No, I do not believe that is possible. If it did lock up, I am quite sure you would hear a heck of a noise below your crotch. And that brings me to the smoke question. The smoke could have come from an alternator that finally gave up the ghost and let all the smoke out of it.

My recommendation, go to Harbor Freight for a cheap voltmeter and use that for your troubleshooting. They are dirt cheap and usually you can find a coupon that will get you a free voltmeter if you make a purchase. Also, see if you can find a little help from a friend that knows a bit about automotive electrics. It will be a big help. I doubt it is the starter but anything is possible. I'd start by removing the alternator and either have it tested or just replace it. You need to disconnect the battery while you are working on the alternator. That is a good time to put the battery charger on the battery. It would be ready for a trial after the replacement started is installed.
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Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by NOVAwing » Tue Jul 10, 2018 7:00 am

MikeB wrote:
Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:21 am
Let me try to answer some of your questions first.

1. 12.35 volts. That's normal and full correct?
Actually, not really. A fully charged motorcycle battery should be 12.6 to 12.7 volts when tested with a properly configured voltmeter. It doesn't look as though you had your voltmeter properly configured so I don't think that reading was correct anyway.

2. So what causes the bike to die at 60mph, and have a dead battery, but also wont pump fuel on a jump start?
A bad alternator can cause this. The battery will power the bike for probably 20 minutes by itself but not much longer. The alternator does the heavy lifting after the engine is started and running. If the alternator is not working and the battery is supplying most of the power, the battery will die and not have the power to start the engine. After about 15 minutes of sitting with the bike off, a battery can regenerate enough power to turn over the engine but not enough to start it.
A starter motor that is continually running after the engine is started could cause the battery to discharge but I think it would not necessarily kill the bike after a few minutes of riding. As to fuel not pumping, I'm not 100% sure it was not pumping. The fuel filter will always be somewhat less than half full and not being able to see it filling is normal.

3. Can the alternator lock up or bind causing major resistance to cranking?
No, I do not believe that is possible. If it did lock up, I am quite sure you would hear a heck of a noise below your crotch. And that brings me to the smoke question. The smoke could have come from an alternator that finally gave up the ghost and let all the smoke out of it.

My recommendation, go to Harbor Freight for a cheap voltmeter and use that for your troubleshooting. They are dirt cheap and usually you can find a coupon that will get you a free voltmeter if you make a purchase. Also, see if you can find a little help from a friend that knows a bit about automotive electrics. It will be a big help. I doubt it is the starter but anything is possible. I'd start by removing the alternator and either have it tested or just replace it. You need to disconnect the battery while you are working on the alternator. That is a good time to put the battery charger on the battery. It would be ready for a trial after the replacement started is installed.
Thanks Mike and everyone for advice.

So i put the black lead in the bottom com port and the red lead in the middle port.

Set dial to 20 on the top left. Put it on the battery still in the bike this morning. 12.48 was the reading. This is after about 15mins on my trucks jumper cables lastnight.

It cranked rapidly on the jumper cables but after about 3 tries it runs down and has to charge a few mins.

I used to know how to check circuits but its been years since i had to do this and im out of practice.

On the fuel filter, i recall seeing an air pocket in it before when the bike was still working.

I now see no air pocket and i can clearly see the filter medium fins inside it. I will pull the fuel line when able and crank, should see fuel flow when cranking only correct?

With the bike on jumper cables to my running truck, it should start, alternator working or not I would think?

I am starting to dread maybe the timing belt went. Is there a quick simple way to check without tearing it all down?

If I pull the alternator, who checks these? Advance auto parts checks car ones, but can they check this one? Otherwise how do i have it checked?

I still think something else is going on. Really frustrating.

This is the area my skills are lacking, I really dont know what to do to start eliminating things. The manual reads like chinese to me, all those schematics look crazy confusing and make no sense. I could spend a year trying to understand it lol.

If the alternator is good, what else could cause the battery to die amd the engine to shut off mid ride?

No sounds or abnormal behavior prior, it just died out of the blue.

I have such great luck lol.

Thanks,
NOVAwing
NOVAwing
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Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by Bluewaterhooker0 » Tue Jul 10, 2018 8:17 am

Regarding jumper cables.
The truck should NOT be running when you jump it. The truck alternator will sense the need to charge the battery, but will do it much too fast for such a small battery. You need to charge it with a bike appropriate battery charger. Battery Tender Plus, or Battery Tender Jr., or some other self controlled low amperage charger (1 - 2 amps). This will take many hours.

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Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by RockportDave » Tue Jul 10, 2018 10:14 am

NOVAwing,
I’ve been following your posts since you started resurrecting this blue beauty back to life and you’ve come a long way, so don’t let this get you down.
All good info from everyone.
I would disconnect the battery to isolate it from any shorts you might have and as stated from others, give it a low amp slow charge for a few hours. My charger has an AGM selection and will charge at a 2 amp rate.
Once the battery has recouped (assuming it is still ok) you should be able to check other items on the bike. It’s hard to diagnose problems when connected to an external source of power (ie; truck battery).
Look for any wires that are melted before reconnecting the battery. If there was smoke, there is probably something shorted out. Look for any black residue, especially around the alternator.
Electrical problems can seem overwhelming and I too need help understanding some of the operations of the system, but here is a good read from WingAdmin and others to help understand how the electrical system works.
viewtopic.php?f=19&t=19501
There is also a lot of information online on how the check the alternator when unable to start the bike.

Dave
1999 GL1500SE 5th Goldwing through the years

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Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by NOVAwing » Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:04 pm

Thank you everyone for the advice. You all are awesome folks!

I will take the not jumping the bike from my truck info under advisement.
Never seen any ill effects from doing this on this bike, or any other bikes, but you do make sense.

I have an older analog charger, it does 6amp and 2amp, 12v and 6v batteries. I will put the battery on the charger, maybe even take it back to batteries plus to be checked out.

Now, if my battery is reading 12.48v installed on the bike with the bike and kill switch off, and it should be 12.6+ it is how low roughly? A little or a lot?

At this voltage it will crank the bike for maybe 5-10 seconds then die, and wont crank anymore, just clicks at the relay next to the battery.

Its almost as if the engine is harder then normal to spin...…. that's why I'm worried about timing belts. Never heard any sound or anything though, and does not explain why battery went from being fine, to dead in 15-20mins of riding.

I am also wondering why I see no fuel in my fuel filter, will have to pull the line off and crank and see if I get flow or not to be sure.

On the fuel filter, I recall seeing an air pocket in it before when the bike was still working.

I now see no air pocket and I can clearly see the filter medium fins inside it. I will pull the fuel line when soon and crank it, should see fuel flow out the line when cranking only correct? Pump is controlled by ECU when you push the start button on a 93 Asp?

If the fuel pump died I can understand the bike cutting off, but ussually starving for fuel leads to sputtering before cut off, same with dying battery.
The bike went from running smooth at 60mph to instantly shutting off without sputtering that I could notice. Hence the timing belt worries, but timing belt would not explain the dead battery.

Argh im stumped here. I hate to just start replacing things without being sure of the issue. Feels like I have more then 1 issue somehow.

I am not scared of electricity, just very out of practice, and I know its far from my area of strength.

Is there a simple way to check timing belts are intact?
On a car you just usually look into the oil filler cap and see if the valves are moving while cranking....

I can't find a "how to" on replacing the alternator, do we have one?
That thing looks like a mother scooter to get out of the frame.

Is their a way to test the alternator while on the bike? Granted the bike will not run?
If not, where is a good place to have it tested? Will advance auto be able to test it inside like they do for cars?

If the battery is dead, and the alternator is bad, jump starting the bike it should still start, at least a car would, until you pull the jumper cables off, then it would die.

The bike will not start using jumper cables, it cranks, but no fire. This makes me think timing belts again....

So lost,

Thanks,
NOVAwing
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Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by MikeB » Tue Jul 10, 2018 12:20 pm

I will pull the fuel line when able and crank, should see fuel flow when cranking only correct?
Yes, you should have fuel flow with the engine cranking, provided that the RUN-STOP switch on the right handlebar near the throttle is in the RUN position.

With the bike on jumper cables to my running truck, it should start, alternator working or not I would think?
Be warned, you can damage the bike circuits by jumping from your vehicle. If you do jump it, do not have the vehicle engine running. There will be enough power from a car battery through jumper cables to start the bike.

It cranked rapidly on the jumper cables but after about 3 tries it runs down and has to charge a few mins.
If the voltage dropped to 10.0 volts or more while you had the starter button depressed, the engine will not start. There will not be enough current to power the ignition system.

If I pull the alternator, who checks these? Advance auto parts checks car ones, but can they check this one? Otherwise how do i have it checked?
I don't know who can check it to be honest. Personally, I check them while the bike is running and if you had a fully charged battery and fuel in the carbs, you could get the bike running long enough to check it with a voltmeter, output should be a low of 12.7 volts with a high of 14.7 volts measured at the battery.
I don't know if automotive alternator shops can help you but it is worth a shot.
There is no pulley on the alternator so most auto parts suppliers like Advance Auto would be hard pressed to know how to check it.

If the alternator is good, what else could cause the battery to die and the engine to shut off mid ride?
The RUN-STOP switch could have been bumped to STOP or maybe the switch has gone intermittent. On pre-1998 GL1500's, with that switch in STOP, the engine will still turn over but will not start and fuel will not flow.

Regarding a charger, as a minimum you should invest in a Battery Tender Junior. They are less than $30 at WalMart. Any battery charger will work for you to get the battery up to the proper charge as long as you do not use more than 2 amps as a charge current.
MikeB
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Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by hugger-4641 » Tue Jul 10, 2018 5:54 pm

[quoteIf I pull the alternator, who checks these? Advance auto parts checks car ones, but can they check this one? Otherwise how do i have it checked?][/quote]

There are a couple checks you can do without the alternator spinning, but you have to disassemble it.
First, you want to check the that the brushes are not stuck. Very common problem.
Another very common problem with the OEM alternators is broken rotor windings.
To check this you have to remove 1/2 of the alternator housing. There are brass slip rings that the brushes ride against which connect to the rotor windings. You will want to check for continuity between the slip rings and between each slip ring and the rotor shaft itselfnd. You should have a good connection between the slip rings with almost no resistance. If not, you have a broken rotor winding.
You should also have infinite resistance between the slip rings and the rotor shaft itself, if not then you have a shorted rotor winding, not as common, but can happen.
If this is good, then you want to check the stator windings. These are basically like a 3phase AC generator. You have three sets of windings. You should have good connection between the ends of each winding , and infinite resistance between any winding and the housing of the alternator.
There are some DIY articles here that will help with this if you decide to check into it.

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Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by MikeB » Tue Jul 10, 2018 6:47 pm

hugger-4641 wrote:
Tue Jul 10, 2018 5:54 pm
I pull the alternator, who checks these? Advance auto parts checks car ones, but can they check this one? Otherwise how do i have it checked?

There are a couple checks you can do without the alternator spinning, but you have to disassemble it.
First, you want to check the that the brushes are not stuck. Very common problem.
Another very common problem with the OEM alternators is broken rotor windings.
To check this you have to remove 1/2 of the alternator housing. There are brass slip rings that the brushes ride against which connect to the rotor windings. You will want to check for continuity between the slip rings and between each slip ring and the rotor shaft itselfnd. You should have a good connection between the slip rings with almost no resistance. If not, you have a broken rotor winding.
You should also have infinite resistance between the slip rings and the rotor shaft itself, if not then you have a shorted rotor winding, not as common, but can happen.
If this is good, then you want to check the stator windings. These are basically like a 3phase AC generator. You have three sets of windings. You should have good connection between the ends of each winding , and infinite resistance between any winding and the housing of the alternator.
There are some DIY articles here that will help with this if you decide to check into it.
That is good information but it might be more than the original poster is equipped to deal with.
If he can get the battery charged and then the motor started, checking the output of the alternator by checking across the battery is a good start to determining if the alternator is charging or not.

Things to consider:
A fully charged healthy battery under no load (neglecting surface charge) will have a terminal voltage of 12.5-12.8 volts. Under load that voltage drops to 11.5-12 volts very quickly, especially a motorcycle battery.

If the alternator quits when running, the voltage will drop below the 12.5 volt level immediately.

There are three numbers that are significant in judging the state of a charging system for a lead acid battery.

1. The 12.5-12.8 volt level for full charge under open circuit conditions.

2. The "float voltage" at which the battery is neither charging or discharging - typically this is 13.2-13.8 volts.

3. The "end of charge" voltage, usually 14.0-14.5 volts - above this level gassing and electrolyte depletion begin.

Voltmeter reads 12 volts. - Alternator failed.

Voltmeter reads 13 volts. - Alternator ok.

Voltmeter reads 14 volts. - Alternator ok.

Voltmeter reads 15 volts. - Alternator ok. Possible voltage regulator failure.

Voltmeter reads 16 volts. - Alternator ok. Voltage regulator failure.
MikeB
Tacoma, WA, USA

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NOVAwing
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Location: Nothern Va
Motorcycle: 1993 GL1500 Aspencade

Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by NOVAwing » Tue Jul 10, 2018 7:18 pm

Thanks for the continued great advice and especially the voltage info. I wont get to really mess with it much until Saturday. Work and all that jazz lol.

I am fairly certain there is something wrong more than an alternator here. I jumped the bike from stone dead off my truck a month ago shortly after installing the new battery because it went dead overnight some how.

It fired right up that time.

It has been fine ever since that one incident.

When I jumped it lastnight it acted like it was barely enough as I explained after 1 crank it has to sit and charge before it will crank more.

The bike would not fire and never even sputtered, no matter what I did with the choke. Normally cold start has taken 1/2 to 2/3 choke to start.

I need to spend some time going over it peice by peice.

GOD what I would give for a friggen garage :cry: id work half the night and give up sleep if I had one to work in. Working outside in the heat and the glaring sun sucks more and more every day I get older.

I will report back as soon as I know more.

Thanks again,
NOVAwing
NOVAwing
1993 GL1500 Aspencade, restored from 4 years rotting outside.

“A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.”

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SG_Jay
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Motorcycle: 1998 GL1500 Aspencade

Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by SG_Jay » Tue Jul 10, 2018 8:16 pm

I'd agree, before you keep cranking on it, look things over. Take the battery out, seat off, anything else in the way and start looking really closely at the wires coming in to the battery. Look for melted, corroded connectors. You said there was smoke, it came from something. Even smell around in there a bit. A wire fire leaves a distinct smell. Check the cables to the battery, look to make sure the ends are crimped on strong, and clean. Shine up the battery posts too. Just go through as much as you can with a fine tooth comb. Leave the battery on a charger while you're doing all that. Once you've visually looked through everything, put it in, leave the seat off and hit the button. You just might find the problem, or you might find that the problem was dirty or corroded connections somewhere. If nothing else, you'll get a clean starting point to go from. I think we're all rooting for ya!!

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someone548
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Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by someone548 » Wed Jul 11, 2018 11:54 am

Hi,
So in this sort of scenario, I find it's best to just start with what happened initially. The smoke I think is the biggest clue we want to track down. The smoke had to come from somewhere and if the smoke corresponded with the bike stopping running, it's a fair assumption that it had something to do with it. If it were me, I wouldn't check or replace anything until I found the source of the smoke. So we're looking for burnt wires, loose or rusty connections, and any wiring that is non-factory. Just my 2 cents. Good luck with it!

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virgilmobile
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Motorcycle: 1988 GL1500 I
Previously owned
78 GL1000
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83 GL1100 I
83 GL1100 standard
84 GL 1200 I

Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by virgilmobile » Thu Jul 12, 2018 3:12 pm

someone548 wrote:
Wed Jul 11, 2018 11:54 am
Hi,
So in this sort of scenario, I find it's best to just start with what happened initially. The smoke I think is the biggest clue we want to track down. The smoke had to come from somewhere and if the smoke corresponded with the bike stopping running, it's a fair assumption that it had something to do with it. If it were me, I wouldn't check or replace anything until I found the source of the smoke. So we're looking for burnt wires, loose or rusty connections, and any wiring that is non-factory. Just my 2 cents. Good luck with it!
I absolutely agree with this...get a fresh set of eyes and nose poking around the bike.Hopefully someone will see a blistered wire or the source of the smoke.
Assume nothing..suspect everything including any add on stuff... Flashers,trailer plug, accessory equipment,etc...Just anything that's not OEM.
I have determined that electric is just compressed smoke...When you let it out everything quits...
Just like light bulbs...they don't give light...they take darkness....Ever notice when one quits it's all dark inside?

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NOVAwing
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Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by NOVAwing » Thu Jul 12, 2018 3:36 pm

All good advice.

Thank you everyone!

I plan to spend an hour or 2 after work today checking things like fuel flow when cranking.

To clarify:

There is zero aftermarket stuff on this bike. Except broken wind wings which I removed.

Battery is new roughly 2 months ago. AGM from Batteries plus.

I looked over everything fairly well under the seat and side covers. No visible damage, zero smell. I'm VERY familar with burnt wire/eletrical smell from my Rc airplane and car hobbies.

Has anyone had a timing belt let go while riding?
Could that cause smoke?
Haven't seen a car do that, but it concerns me having taken the risk and not changed it yet.

Yes I know, I am bad, and/or crazy. I plan to do it next payday (once a month sucks) but not now, unless I get the bike fixed from this issue.

So tonight I will:
1) Confirm fuel pump is pushing fuel while cranking.
2) Remove and recharge battery.
Was showing 12.48v. Is this low enough to only crank once then click? Nobody has answered that question yet. Doesn't seem right to me, like the engine has exteme resistance to turning over. No unusal sounds when cranking fyi, sounds same as always.
3) Look again for signs of electrical damage, maybe I overlooked something. I did not look into the alternator much as its all covered inside the frame....

I wiill report back my findings.

Thanks again VERY much for everyone's help, I'm really gonna need it this time, I'm stumped and worried.

Last thought, on older OBD1 cars you could jump the diag port and it would flash the check engine light in moris code to give you trouble codes.

Does this bike do that some how? Give error codes? If not that is a HUGE mistake by Honda and very upsetting. That has been standard vehicle diagnostic proceedure for decades going back to the 80's at least.
This would give you a great idea of whats wrong, and where to look for issues. Otherwise your hunting in the dark while blindfolded lol. Thats why I feel so lost I guess lol.

Thanks,
NOVAwing
NOVAwing
1993 GL1500 Aspencade, restored from 4 years rotting outside.

“A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.”

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MikeB
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Motorcycle: 1998 - GL1500 Aspencade.
2003 - GL1800A

Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by MikeB » Thu Jul 12, 2018 4:41 pm

If you are reading 12. 48 volts with the ignition turned on, this should be enough to crank and start the engine. However if this 12.48 volts is with the ignition off it could be just a surface charge and we'll probably go down to like 11 volts or lower when you turn the ignition on. A fully charged motorcycle battery should read between 12.65 to 12.8 volts with no load. When you load a fully charged battery, such as turning on the ignition, the voltage should not go down below 12 volts.

If you don't already know it, you can bypass the petcock and try running the engine without the petcock in the line. It will not adversely effect anything.
Last edited by MikeB on Thu Jul 12, 2018 5:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
MikeB
Tacoma, WA, USA

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MikeB
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Motorcycle: 1998 - GL1500 Aspencade.
2003 - GL1800A

Re: First ride with the wife, broke down 5 miles from home

Post by MikeB » Thu Jul 12, 2018 4:42 pm

On the 1500 there is no on-board diagnostic or OBD system.


MikeB
Tacoma, WA, USA

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