Electrical issue


Information and questions on GL1500 Goldwings (1988-2000)
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Ed Brock
Posts: 38
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2019 11:45 am
Location: Oak Grove Or
Motorcycle: 1986 Suzuki Cavalcade GD
1998 1500 SE

Electrical issue

Post by Ed Brock » Sat Jun 22, 2019 2:12 pm



Hi,
We have a 1998 GL 1500 SE. 30,000 miles. Bike has not been accessorized by previous owner. The bike has started, ran, shifted, reversed all with no problems and no issues of any type.
I am going to explain in detail what happened hope that my help you out in a diagnosis. My problem is; I started the bike, and let it run for about 5-6 minutes at various choke and throttle openings. All was normal. I mounted the bike, back it out of the garage using the reverse mode on level ground. I took it out of reverse mode. The bike continued to run about 3-5 minutes longer, then I dismounted the still running bike from the right side and accidently hit the starter button. I could hear the starter engage, and then the bike instantly quite running.
I have install a voltmeter that is connected to the input post of a 4 terminal auxiliary fuse box. The aux. fuse box is wired from the input post directly to the battery. I have two other items fused to the aux. fuse block. The bike have been this way for 2-3 months and has never had any problems.
The voltmeter on the bike showed NO battery voltage. Nothing on the bikes electrical system worked also. I shut the key off and checked battery voltage with a hand-held volt meter, it showed 12.8v. I checked the volt meter again, still no voltage showing and still NO electric power to anything on the bike.
I let the bike sit for 1/2 hr. while I looked at the factory manual. I came back out to the bike and with out doing anything, the volt meter mounted on the bike showed 12.8 volts. I turned on the key and all electrical power now worked. SSOOO I hit the starter button and nothing happened. I had a repeat of the loss of electrical power again, and the voltmeter on the bike showed NO voltage. My hand held voltmeter showed I had 12.8 volts at the battery.
The voltmeter on the bike started working on its own and all electrical power came back on. I Checked both starter relays and you could hear a click from both of them. But when using the starter button for 2 times I lost all electrical power and the on bike volt meter WAS working! I pulled the left side lower rear panel off and checked the fuses and starter relays. No problems. Now the neutral indicator is not lite. I checked to make absolute sure the bike WAS in neutral. It was.
I let the bike sit overnight and EVERYTHING was working in the morning. I started the bike moved it forward and reverse, parked in garage and let it run about 1/2 hr. The bike was working normal.
Sorry for the VERY long message. It has been 5 days now and the bike has not had any of the above problems. I know I caused the problem, but has anyone experienced this issue before? Or, does anyone have a fix for this issue (besides not be dumb and hitting the starter button)?
Ed



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bellboy40
Posts: 624
Joined: Fri Nov 27, 2009 1:13 pm
Location: Brewton, AL
Motorcycle: 2000 GL1500SE Candy Spectra Red
1994 GL1500SE Pearl Bermuda Green

Re: Electrical issue

Post by bellboy40 » Sat Jun 22, 2019 2:59 pm

I would start by checking the battery terminals for looseness or corrosion. Also check the 30 amp main dogbone fuse there by the starter solenoid. They sometimes will look good but if you touch them it falls apart.

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DenverWinger
Posts: 1108
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2011 2:20 pm
Location: Denver, CO
Motorcycle: (s)
1980 GL1100 STD Vetter (2005-)
1993 GL1500 Aspencade (2017-)
1983 Trav-Lite Camper (2010-)
Past rides
1972 CL350 (1980-1988) sold
1978 Suzuki GS550 (1985-2005) sold
1977 GL1000 (2002-2006) sold

Re: Electrical issue

Post by DenverWinger » Sat Jun 22, 2019 9:33 pm

+1 on the corroded battery connections.

Hitting the starter button didn't do anything other than draw a surge of current thru an iffy connection which then opened up. Chemical action on the corroded connection after a while will allow some current to flow and you will again see voltage on your meter, but won't be enough to run the starter. Overnight the chemical action allowed enough of a connection for the starter to work. But this will be a recurring problem until the cause is corrected.

If the engine is running and you hit the starter this can't do any damage, the engine is idling faster than the starter would turn it, so the starter motor would just be "freewheeling" on the sprague clutch.
♫ 99 Little Bugs in the Code, ♪
♪ 99 Bugs in the Code. ♫ :(
♫ Take one down, Patch it around, ♪
♫ 127 Little Bugs in the Code. ♫ ♪ :shock:

~Mark

Ed Brock
Posts: 38
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2019 11:45 am
Location: Oak Grove Or
Motorcycle: 1986 Suzuki Cavalcade GD
1998 1500 SE

Re: Electrical issue

Post by Ed Brock » Mon Jun 24, 2019 3:42 am

bellboy40 wrote:
Sat Jun 22, 2019 2:59 pm
I would start by checking the battery terminals for looseness or corrosion. Also check the 30 amp main dogbone fuse there by the starter solenoid. They sometimes will look good but if you touch them it falls apart.
I did check the battery terminals and the "dog bone" fuse. The battery was just replaced 2 days before I picked up the bike, it is a new Yussa battery. The dog bone fuse is solid I removed it and gave it a good check over, it still has the factory blue paint in the middle of the fuse. The battery and dog bone have no corrosion, and all terminals are tight.
Thanks for your thoughts, any others?????
Ed

Ed Brock
Posts: 38
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2019 11:45 am
Location: Oak Grove Or
Motorcycle: 1986 Suzuki Cavalcade GD
1998 1500 SE

Re: Electrical issue

Post by Ed Brock » Mon Jun 24, 2019 3:56 am

DenverWinger wrote:
Sat Jun 22, 2019 9:33 pm
+1 on the corroded battery connections.

Hitting the starter button didn't do anything other than draw a surge of current thru an iffy connection which then opened up. Chemical action on the corroded connection after a while will allow some current to flow and you will again see voltage on your meter, but won't be enough to run the starter. Overnight the chemical action allowed enough of a connection for the starter to work. But this will be a recurring problem until the cause is corrected.

If the engine is running and you hit the starter this can't do any damage, the engine is idling faster than the starter would turn it, so the starter motor would just be "freewheeling" on the sprague clutch.
I agree with you that this will be a reoccurring issue if the cause is not found. I also agree about what happens if you engage a starter while an engine is running. The odd part of this is the battery having power and the starter solenoids clicking, but the starter not engaging and losing all electrical power through out the bike. I have rechecked all extra add on electrical items, and have found no problems. I used a ohm meter to determine the condition of the soldered connections as I made them. I have also, since I posted this inquiry, rechecked the connection I made with an ohm meter. I still have not found any problems.
Thanks for your help. Any other ideas??????
Ed

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DenverWinger
Posts: 1108
Joined: Thu Jun 23, 2011 2:20 pm
Location: Denver, CO
Motorcycle: (s)
1980 GL1100 STD Vetter (2005-)
1993 GL1500 Aspencade (2017-)
1983 Trav-Lite Camper (2010-)
Past rides
1972 CL350 (1980-1988) sold
1978 Suzuki GS550 (1985-2005) sold
1977 GL1000 (2002-2006) sold

Re: Electrical issue

Post by DenverWinger » Mon Jun 24, 2019 5:57 am

Since the bike is going completely dark there's very few things that be amiss. I'd re-check both battery connections to be sure they are spanking clean and that they aren't corroded where the metal terminals are crimped onto the battery wires. Also trace the battery Negative cable and check where it connects to the frame, Diagram says "On engine near dipstick" and "On frame near dipstick".

If nothing found then it's time to get the volt meter out. Easier to trace if you can get it to fail. Leave the key "ON" while the bike is dead and check voltage on both sides of 30A Main Fuse "A" (this will be in starter relay "A" next to the battery) and 55A Dogbone main fuse "B" (below starter relay "A")

Diagram attached....


♫ 99 Little Bugs in the Code, ♪
♪ 99 Bugs in the Code. ♫ :(
♫ Take one down, Patch it around, ♪
♫ 127 Little Bugs in the Code. ♫ ♪ :shock:

~Mark

Ed Brock
Posts: 38
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2019 11:45 am
Location: Oak Grove Or
Motorcycle: 1986 Suzuki Cavalcade GD
1998 1500 SE

Re: Electrical issue

Post by Ed Brock » Sun Jun 30, 2019 12:41 am

I have found the electrical problem. Thank you all who replied. The problem was the 5 amp neutral light fuse. While it tested good with an ohm meter I reused it. I did check the fuse box female connectors and made sure they were clean before reinstalling the original fuse.
I decided I would reenact the problem EXACTLY that I had caused. SSOOO, I reengaged the started button after making sure I followed my previous plan of backing the bike out of the garage and dismounting on the right hand side. I again lost all electrical power, just like before. The ONLY change I made was to pull the neutral light 5amp fuse and replace it. Once I installed a new fuse, EVERYTHING started working. So, I thought "lets retest the cause" After engaging the started button while the bike was running, the ONLY thing that happened was the started turned over. NO loss of any electrical power.
I had to be sure the symptom was corrected so I reenacted the cinereal 2 more time. Then I installed the fuse I replace and retested. The problem of no electrical power came back. Again, I pulled the factory original fuse and reinstalled the one I used that cured the problem. Again, all power was restarted and so far no other problems have happened.
What I don't understand is, how the neutral light fuse being bad could cause the no power issue, It's only a 5 amp fuse, after all !!!
Again, thank all for your help.
ED

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Erdeniz Umman
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Location: Ankara Turkey
Motorcycle: 2000 GL1500SE

Re: Electrical issue

Post by Erdeniz Umman » Sun Jun 30, 2019 2:14 am

Ed Brock wrote:
Sun Jun 30, 2019 12:41 am
I have found the electrical problem. Thank you all who replied. The problem was the 5 amp neutral light fuse. While it tested good with an ohm meter I reused it. I did check the fuse box female connectors and made sure they were clean before reinstalling the original fuse.
I decided I would reenact the problem EXACTLY that I had caused. SSOOO, I reengaged the started button after making sure I followed my previous plan of backing the bike out of the garage and dismounting on the right hand side. I again lost all electrical power, just like before. The ONLY change I made was to pull the neutral light 5amp fuse and replace it. Once I installed a new fuse, EVERYTHING started working. So, I thought "lets retest the cause" After engaging the started button while the bike was running, the ONLY thing that happened was the started turned over. NO loss of any electrical power.
I had to be sure the symptom was corrected so I reenacted the cinereal 2 more time. Then I installed the fuse I replace and retested. The problem of no electrical power came back. Again, I pulled the factory original fuse and reinstalled the one I used that cured the problem. Again, all power was restarted and so far no other problems have happened.
What I don't understand is, how the neutral light fuse being bad could cause the no power issue, It's only a 5 amp fuse, after all !!!
Again, thank all for your help.
ED
Would you name the fuse according to the information in the diagram please? Because there is not any fuse called "neutral light fuse".

Are you referring to the #9 starter/reverse fuse or the 5A fuses behind the battery?

Ed Brock
Posts: 38
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2019 11:45 am
Location: Oak Grove Or
Motorcycle: 1986 Suzuki Cavalcade GD
1998 1500 SE

Re: Electrical issue

Post by Ed Brock » Wed Jul 03, 2019 7:37 am

Yes, the fuse I replaced that solved the no electrical power problem is fuse #9, It's location is in the fuse box under the LEFT side panel next to the relay box. I had to get the wiring manual to make sure I was giving out correct information.
When you remove fuse #9 the neutral light does not work and you cannot start the bike.
Ed

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Erdeniz Umman
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Motorcycle: 2000 GL1500SE

Re: Electrical issue

Post by Erdeniz Umman » Wed Jul 03, 2019 9:28 am

Ok. That is the starter/reverse fuse which provides the +12V to the coil of the reverse relay switch when the reverse lever is at the down position. And also it provides +12V to the Neutral light.

Then reverse relay switch (it is under the seat next to the 65A fuse) provides the +12V to the coil of the starter relay A.

So the coil of the relay and the N light do not draw much current, and 5A fuse is enough to provide safety.

If you examine the circuit diagram above, you will see that the higher current draws are protected by high amp fuses.

When the reverse lever is at the up position, it provides +12V to the coils of several relays in the reverse system, and again their total current draws are not much.

Ed Brock
Posts: 38
Joined: Wed Feb 27, 2019 11:45 am
Location: Oak Grove Or
Motorcycle: 1986 Suzuki Cavalcade GD
1998 1500 SE

Re: Electrical issue

Post by Ed Brock » Sat Jul 06, 2019 7:06 pm

Erdeniz,
Thanks for your information. That chart supplied by Denver Winger is how I traced the problem down. At the time I did not have a manual. One came with the bike but the seller loaned it out and has since hand delivered it to me. NICE.
I looked at the many pages of wiring of the 1500 Se wing. A lot more wiring on that bike then on our Cavalcade.
Again, a BIG THANK YOU to all who have helped.

V-ROD
Posts: 5
Joined: Sat Jul 13, 2019 2:03 pm
Location: Gloucester, NJ
Motorcycle: 1995 Honda Goldwing GL1500 SE

Re: Electrical issue

Post by V-ROD » Sat Jul 13, 2019 2:16 pm

BACKGROUND
Purchased a used 1995 Goldwing Anniversary Edition, GL1500 SE a few months back and has performed w/o any problems. That is until…
I was using the reverse to parallel park the bike when it just stopped backing up…the engine remained running. I finished parking manually.
Once parked, tried to get the reverse to work, w/o avail. At the time thought it was me having trouble finding neutral.
Turned bike off. Played with shifter until I knew I was in neutral – bike rolled freely w/o clutch
Bike would not start and no neutral light lit.

REMEDIES
Began moving reverse handle up and down, at times vigorously…nothing
Purchased CRC electronic cleaner and sprayed reverse micro switch best I could. w/o removing all panels…nothing
Removed seat and all panels – cleaned cables and switch w/CRC…nothing
Replaced reverse switch (New $20.00)…nothing

NOTES: Yes, the kill switch is in run position.
Tried starting with bike in neutral, kickstand down and with and without clutch pulled in
Tried starting with bike in neutral, kickstand up and with and without clutch pulled in
Tried starting with bike in gear, kickstand down and clutch pulled in
Tried starting with bike in gear, kickstand up and clutch pulled in

CURRENTLY:
Turn ignition key on and get oil light, a few seconds of reverse light (goes out) and side kickstand light when its down. I get radio and parking lights, no neutral light or headlight.

Now what do I do?

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bellboy40
Posts: 624
Joined: Fri Nov 27, 2009 1:13 pm
Location: Brewton, AL
Motorcycle: 2000 GL1500SE Candy Spectra Red
1994 GL1500SE Pearl Bermuda Green

Re: Electrical issue

Post by bellboy40 » Sat Jul 13, 2019 3:26 pm

Here are a couple links to threads about the neutral light. This might help you with your problem.

https://www.goldwingfacts.com/forums/2- ... issue.html
https://www.goldwingfacts.com/forums/2- ... t-tip.html

V-ROD
Posts: 5
Joined: Sat Jul 13, 2019 2:03 pm
Location: Gloucester, NJ
Motorcycle: 1995 Honda Goldwing GL1500 SE

Re: Electrical issue

Post by V-ROD » Sat Jul 13, 2019 3:26 pm

For the hell of it, I started checking fuses...the first fuse I pull was a 5amp...it was blown...replaced it, my neutral light came back on and bike fired right up...YES a stinking 5amp fuse was the single culprit of all those problems.

tsandvik
Posts: 67
Joined: Mon Dec 14, 2015 2:05 pm
Location: Tampa, FL
Motorcycle: 1990 GL1500 Aspencade

Re: Electrical issue

Post by tsandvik » Sun Jul 14, 2019 11:27 am

All

Just got to the point of test run on rebuilt wing. Started fine before I tore the bike down.

Now when i hit the starter button I get a click/thunk from the A relay and loose electrical in system. Trying to do a repeat push of the start button gives no results at all. Turn off key wait a min or 2 and will give the same symptoms.

Relay A in isolation will show continuity and clicks on and off repeatedly. 30 amp fuse is good. Lights shut down on button push as expected. Have pulled off the B relay but see no easy way to apply voltage to test as of yet. Neutral light is on. Reverse light is off. All lights come on when key is turned to ON.

I am stumped right now and do not know where to look next to chase more electrical gremlins. Everything turned over just fine before and from what I can see none of the electrics involved other than the reverse switch on side of engine block should have been mucked around with during the engine swap.

Any electrical guru's have any suggestions or places to check/look?

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SG_Jay
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Joined: Tue Jun 09, 2015 5:55 am
Location: Northern MN
Motorcycle: 1998 GL1500 Aspencade

Re: Electrical issue

Post by SG_Jay » Sun Jul 14, 2019 12:29 pm

First thing I would check are the battery cable ends and the battery terminals. Clean them with a wire wheel brush or sandpaper. Make them shine! :D

tsandvik
Posts: 67
Joined: Mon Dec 14, 2015 2:05 pm
Location: Tampa, FL
Motorcycle: 1990 GL1500 Aspencade

Re: Electrical issue

Post by tsandvik » Sun Jul 14, 2019 12:42 pm

Done the contact area cleaning on all parts of the bike. While stripped down did everything to try restore to newer condition. I get 12.5 volt (min) readings from everywhere on the bike.

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ct1500
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Re: Electrical issue

Post by ct1500 » Sun Jul 14, 2019 2:40 pm

You sure the engine is not locked up? Remove access cover over front crankshaft bolt and try to turn. Installation of the starter needs to go straight in while reverse lever down and not using bolts to force starter in. Some simple voltage checks at B relay large lugs and then at starter post itself will help to identify the problem.


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