What now....?


Information and questions on GL1100 Goldwings (1980-1983)
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Psycheonabike
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Motorcycle: 1985 Aspencade

What now....?

Post by Psycheonabike » Mon Aug 12, 2019 3:55 pm



I swear I am reaching my tolerance point with this bike now!

So after it doing the following its.......................

STILL running rough as a box of spanners!!
STILL not firing properly and stinks of gas!!
STILL takes ages for idle to drop after revving!!

Now ALL plugs look sooty not just #2!

For ages pulling the cap off #2 did nothing. Now the idles drops but pulling the cap off #4 does nothing whereas yesterday pulling the cap on #4 made it pretty much stall!

Here's what I have done so far......

Change timing belt (not a tooth out from what I can see)
Carbs off and cleaned at least 5 times including a rebuild kit which itself has been tried on and off the carbs
Balanced carbs all within no more than 1/4 of a mark with #3
Timing checked
Compression checked and all cylinders around 170 psi with little between them
Valve clearances checked (three times)
Spark Units replaced with OKI's
Regulator Replaced
New Fuel Filter
Changed oil and filter
Changed plugs to DPR 8's and tried every Gap you care to mention
I've ran REDEX (UK version of Seafoam) through both the carbs and tank



Some advice to avoid my next job being a burning rag in the tank would be grateful!



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Johnyy Smoke
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Motorcycle: 1980 GL1100
Vetter. "Its like Deja Vu all over again".

Re: What now....?

Post by Johnyy Smoke » Tue Aug 13, 2019 4:56 am

Have you looked to see if the coil is O.K.?
A long shot, granted, But worth a go. Regards, Johnny

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Johnyy Smoke
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Re: What now....?

Post by Johnyy Smoke » Tue Aug 13, 2019 5:07 am

You mentioned that the carbs have been rebuilt. Setting the floats at the proper level can be a bit of a hassle. (speaking from experience :roll: ) They HAVE to be CORRECT. Recheck these from heel to toe. They must be the same measurement across. My 1981 calls for 15.5 mm from base of carb. Not 15.8 or 15. 2. Hang in there on the repairs! Once you get your Wing running correctly, it will run forever. Regards, Johnny

Psycheonabike
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Re: What now....?

Post by Psycheonabike » Tue Aug 13, 2019 6:21 am

Yeah mahooosive spark like a lightening bolt!! :lol:

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Johnyy Smoke
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Vetter. "Its like Deja Vu all over again".

Re: What now....?

Post by Johnyy Smoke » Tue Aug 13, 2019 6:31 am

You do have the plug wires running to the correct cylinders? Regards, Johnny

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dingdong
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Re: What now....?

Post by dingdong » Tue Aug 13, 2019 6:55 am

Did you replace the float needle valves? If so were they OEM or kit valves? OEM seem to be the only valves that seal correctly.
Tom

"Molon Labe"

John F. Kennedy would be impeached by todays liberal Democratic socialist party.

Psycheonabike
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Re: What now....?

Post by Psycheonabike » Tue Aug 13, 2019 7:05 am

dingdong wrote:
Tue Aug 13, 2019 6:55 am
Did you replace the float needle valves? If so were they OEM or kit valves? OEM seem to be the only valves that seal correctly.
Good point. Tried others but went back to OEMs as I suspected foul play!!

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Johnyy Smoke
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Re: What now....?

Post by Johnyy Smoke » Tue Aug 13, 2019 8:41 am

After reading your previous posts So do I. Regards, Johnny

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dingdong
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Re: What now....?

Post by dingdong » Tue Aug 13, 2019 7:28 pm

Foul play???...........
Tom

"Molon Labe"

John F. Kennedy would be impeached by todays liberal Democratic socialist party.

Psycheonabike
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Re: What now....?

Post by Psycheonabike » Wed Aug 14, 2019 2:02 am

dingdong wrote:
Tue Aug 13, 2019 7:28 pm
Foul play???...........
I was being facetious!

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chief771
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Location: Austin, mn
Motorcycle: 1980 Goldwing GL1100

Re: What now....?

Post by chief771 » Wed Aug 14, 2019 4:48 am

Good morning, did you replace the slow idle jets? If you have 1980 carbs they are pressed in and dont usually come with a carb kit. I pulled them on my bike and they were all plugged. After cleaning them my bike runs great. Just thought I would throw that out there.
Where ever you go, That's where you are.
Chief771
Kevin

Psycheonabike
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Re: What now....?

Post by Psycheonabike » Wed Aug 14, 2019 5:59 am

chief771 wrote:
Wed Aug 14, 2019 4:48 am
Good morning, did you replace the slow idle jets? If you have 1980 carbs they are pressed in and dont usually come with a carb kit. I pulled them on my bike and they were all plugged. After cleaning them my bike runs great. Just thought I would throw that out there.
No thats a great point - I did pull them out and they were clogged up big time - took ages to get a guitar wire thought them but they did clean up in the end. Little difference though I am afraid.

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chief771
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Re: What now....?

Post by chief771 » Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:27 pm

Sorry to hear that. Wish I had some other ideas for you. Uber frustrating.
Where ever you go, That's where you are.
Chief771
Kevin

Psycheonabike
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Re: What now....?

Post by Psycheonabike » Thu Aug 15, 2019 1:19 am

chief771 wrote:
Wed Aug 14, 2019 7:27 pm
Sorry to hear that. Wish I had some other ideas for you. Uber frustrating.
Yup....thing is, how can #2 be hardly firing at all and #4 stall the engine if you pull the plug cap and now it's working the other way around??? Plus all plugs bar #3 are sooty as hell??

I swear it's got me beat!!!

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OldguyGlen
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Motorcycle: 1980 GL1100 STD/Vetters
1966 Honda 90

Re: What now....?

Post by OldguyGlen » Thu Aug 15, 2019 3:01 pm

Puzzling for sure... here's some food for thought, but don't know if it will help.
Symptoms are somewhat suggestive of float valve trouble, but you've been there already.
Also possibly carb pistons sometimes stick up, and flood via the main jet???
But I am concerned about your test technique on the plugs firing.
I NEVER pull the cap on a CDI type solid state ignition. I only GOUND a plug to test cylinder function.
In the first place, its not easy on my 1980. My plug caps are a molded rubber assembly for the pair (1-3, and 2-4). Hence it is hard to pull just one cyl cap. But the real reason is the CDI does NOT like trying to fire into thin air. The Coil Secondary rises in voltage till it jumps the plug gap. Infinite gap means the voltage rises to extreme high levels to finally dissipate the coil's collapsing magnetic field into a corona discharge into the air, or ("Whoops") it jumps to some other part of the circuitry, like the primary which takes the jolt back into the solid state components in the CDI module. Old time points ignitions could tolerate that much better than solid state units.
Also remember each coil fires 2 spark plugs, in series. If one plug wire faces an infinite gap (cap pulled), the companion plug won't fire either as the circuit is not complete without both plugs. So when you pulled plug cap #4, you also disabled Cyl #3, possibly causing confusion on what cyl's are helping or not.
The best way to test one cyl at a time is to SHORT the plug, not pull the cap. Use something like a ball point pen spring to craft an extension between the plug post and the ignition wire cap. Then take a temporary ground wire, attached to a good frame ground, and momentarily touch it to the exposed wire (spring) at each cylinder. I'm not sure of your original test technique, maybe you were grounding each plug. But if not, I would redo the each cyl test with the grounding technique. Intermittent plug firing problems are often at the coil, rather than at the plug end of the wire.
Sorry for the long ramble, but maybe there's something in here you can use.

Psycheonabike
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Re: What now....?

Post by Psycheonabike » Thu Aug 15, 2019 3:09 pm

@oldguyglen ...thanks man, more to consider.

The other things is how the mixture screws do nothing. I mean they make no difference at all. You'd think winding them all the way it might make it run a tad leaner? Nope! Still all sooty as hell!

All apart from #3 ....nice gold colour!

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OldguyGlen
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Re: What now....?

Post by OldguyGlen » Thu Aug 15, 2019 3:20 pm

Idle screws = no effect is worth noting. Either the idle/low speed jets are still plugged. Or it is getting fuel some other way, like the stuck pistons on the main jets.
Besides the low speed jet itself, did you clean the various passages associated with it. In particular there are 4 very tiny holes in the carb throat area, right where the butterfly disc touches the wall when at idle. And yet another one just a bit farther in, if memory serves me well? If the low speed circuits are plugged, you would have had to crank the main linkage idle set screw excessively high to get the butterflies to open enough to get some fuel via the main jets. That never works well giving rough, unstable idle. Is the idle you can maintain anywhere near the ideal 950 rpm?

Psycheonabike
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Re: What now....?

Post by Psycheonabike » Thu Aug 15, 2019 3:31 pm

@oldguyglen ...she idles fine, not like a clock ticking but not far off, around 1000rpm - not tried any lower.

Once past say, 2000rpm she pulls like a rocket! Something kicks in then. It's not a sudden surge but if I try riding her at walking pace the whole engine slaps and thumps...really uncomfortable! Pull away and zoooom!!!

However.....when doing about say 50mph in 4th gear and opening the throttle I get lots of vibration and little in the way of power.

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OldguyGlen
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Re: What now....?

Post by OldguyGlen » Thu Aug 15, 2019 3:45 pm

Starting to run out of suggestions here...
Hard to believe it idles OK, but the idle jet screw has no effect.
And rough running just off idle at walking speeds is good indication of carbs not synched. But you can't synch 'em without idle jet screws working. Did you just clean the slow jet, and not the associated carb body passages, like the 4 tiny holes???
I have no ideas about the full throttle bog at 50 mph in 4th.... Possibly the carb pistons... just a guess.
Due to the time zones, you must be up late tonight. I used to work with an American subsidiary of the British Fenner company. Got to know a lot about you blokes. I even can translate your "English". Maybe try riding the bike on the right side to see if it helps. Good luck on the bike, don't give up.

Psycheonabike
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Joined: Sun Feb 10, 2019 5:00 am
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Motorcycle: 1985 Aspencade

Re: What now....?

Post by Psycheonabike » Thu Aug 15, 2019 4:10 pm

Thanks. ;)

No giving up....though I've come close!!



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