USB usage


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Rambozo
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Re: USB usage

Post by Rambozo »



The problem like Mark mentioned is that Windows reads all the file info into memory then does a sort. And even in Windows 10 which will let you sort on a metric-assload of metadata, write order is not one of them. I do not believe the creation time stamp has enough resolution to do the job for very small music files. So other than using a utility or looking at the raw disc data there is no easy way in Windows to see the write order. But as mentioned you could use a file copy program that lets you specify an order, or use a utility to fix the order after the copy. I seem to recall that Bulk Rename Utility has that function as well as the previously mentioned FAT Sorter. You just need to forget what Windows says as it will always lie to you about the sorting. The only thing that matters is how the bike sees them, and using a tool for that will be so much faster than copying them one at a time, for hundreds of files with zero tolerance for a mistake.



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tamathumper
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Re: USB usage

Post by tamathumper »

C-dub wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 9:49 pm
tamathumper wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 8:46 am
I believe there are programs to sort your FAT filesystem into actual alphabetical order - FATSorter is one.
I'm not sure what good that would be. Windows File Explorer (aka: File Manager) will do this. The issue is how the bike reads them. It reads them in the order to were created on the flash drive. If one of those other programs will load them in order alphabetically that might work. However, the only other issue with that might be that someone might not want their songs to play in alphabetical order. Songs on an album aren't in alphabetical order and if a person wants them to play in the order the artist put them on an album that won't work.
Windows File Explorer does not do it, unfortunately. It sorts the files in memory and displays them to you in alphabetical order, but it is reading them from the disk in whatever order they were laid down. And when it copies those nicely sorted files, it invariably sticks one on the end that's out of whack. Don't ask me why.
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Re: USB usage

Post by C-dub »

tamathumper wrote:
Thu Mar 26, 2020 6:13 pm
C-dub wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 9:49 pm
tamathumper wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 8:46 am
I believe there are programs to sort your FAT filesystem into actual alphabetical order - FATSorter is one.
I'm not sure what good that would be. Windows File Explorer (aka: File Manager) will do this. The issue is how the bike reads them. It reads them in the order to were created on the flash drive. If one of those other programs will load them in order alphabetically that might work. However, the only other issue with that might be that someone might not want their songs to play in alphabetical order. Songs on an album aren't in alphabetical order and if a person wants them to play in the order the artist put them on an album that won't work.
Windows File Explorer does not do it, unfortunately. It sorts the files in memory and displays them to you in alphabetical order, but it is reading them from the disk in whatever order they were laid down. And when it copies those nicely sorted files, it invariably sticks one on the end that's out of whack. Don't ask me why.
What?!

It doesn't REALLY change anything? It only displays it that way? I feel lied to. :( ;)

No wonder. Hmmm
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Corkster52
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Re: USB usage

Post by Corkster52 »

AZgl1800 wrote:
Tue Mar 24, 2020 5:42 pm


I have replaced the Windows File Manager's file copy system with: https://www.codesector.com/teracopy

I have used TeraCopy for more than 10 years, I don't recall when I first started using it, but it is much better than Win's file manager.

It will copy a complete folder, w/o fail. however, I have not experimented with trying to see if it retains the file order once copied.

All I can say there, is when I look at the Target folder, it is identical to the Source folder.
Are you using the basic or the Pro version of TeraCopy?

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kwthom
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Re: USB usage

Post by kwthom »

Gonna make a few heads swim on this...

One of the previous posts was partially on-target with the 'prepend two or three characters to the beginning of the file name' trick.

What you do *next* is change *all* of the time/date stamps *on your MP3 media* to be exactly the same.

I've used Total Commander for a long time. It has a tool that can change file attributes - one file or many.

Selecting all files, then changing date/time on all of them to be the same solves the problem.
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Yosserian
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Re: USB usage

Post by Yosserian »

I guess I shoulda said I am downloading music from a MAC to a USB. Does that make a difference?

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Re: USB usage

Post by C-dub »

kwthom wrote:
Wed May 20, 2020 10:04 am
Gonna make a few heads swim on this...

One of the previous posts was partially on-target with the 'prepend two or three characters to the beginning of the file name' trick.

What you do *next* is change *all* of the time/date stamps *on your MP3 media* to be exactly the same.

I've used Total Commander for a long time. It has a tool that can change file attributes - one file or many.

Selecting all files, then changing date/time on all of them to be the same solves the problem.
I'm trying this with the windows file manager and haven't figured it out yet. I'm guessing that it can't be done except with something like Total Commander?
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Re: USB usage

Post by Rambozo »

You used to be able to do it in the GUI on older versions of Windows, but it seems that function was removed. Here are a few alternatives.
You can still do it from the command line using the obscure + option of the COPY command. COPY filename+
If you have UNIX tools of some flavor, you can use the TOUCH command.
I guess the current command du jour is to use Powershell for things like that. The PS command is (ls filename).LastWriteTime = Get-Date
Use a third party tool.

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Re: USB usage

Post by AZgl1800 »

this is the Best copy utility in the Windows world,
I have it set to be the Default because the Windows tools are so crappy


https://www.codesector.com/teracopy
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Re: USB usage

Post by kwthom »

C-dub wrote:
Wed May 20, 2020 5:35 pm
I'm trying this with the windows file manager and haven't figured it out yet. I'm guessing that it can't be done except with something like Total Commander?
Won't work; explained above.

Again, a file manager will allow the adjustment of time & date to be in the past -or-in the future. Unless they're all the same, file names aren't in the sorting equation.
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Re: USB usage

Post by tamathumper »

Like kwthom said, you can mess with the dates all you want... that doesn't affect the order in which the files were written to disk.

The file system is basically a ledger book with rows and columns. As you create a new file, it gets added to the end as a new row. The creation date, last modified date, and other information about that file are just columns in that same row, off to the right, and they don't affect the *row* the file is in.

The file name doesn't matter. Even if it starts with underscores and zeros that make it appear to be at the top of the list, it's still at the bottom if you just added it to the disk.

For viewing, the OS will sort them in whatever order you wish, but always starting from how they're written to disk, and then sorting in memory and eventually putting on the screen. For bulk operations that handle multiple files, like moving, copying, backing up and printing, you're probably going to get them in the order the OS wants you to, most likely the order they're written to disk.

Think of it as written in ink. It can be erased and reordered, but not easily or with the average, most commonly available ink pen or author.


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